{"videoId":"https://video.isilive.ca/victoria/Compact%20Encoder%201349_COTW_2026-09-10-12-01.mp4","source":"isilive_vtt","segments":[{"t":1,"text":"September 10th meeting of Victoria City Council's Committee of the"},{"t":4,"text":"Whole, if I could have people please take their seats."},{"t":8,"text":"Today we have for our consideration two items of land"},{"t":11,"text":"use to staff reports, one council member motion and one"},{"t":15,"text":"closed item. Could I have the attention of council please."},{"t":19,"text":"Councillor Thompson is joining us online, so we do have"},{"t":21,"text":"a full complement today. Of course, before we begin our"},{"t":26,"text":"work together, we always like to take a moment to"},{"t":28,"text":"ground ourselves in our recognition and expression of appreciation and"},{"t":33,"text":"gratitude to the two nations on whose territories are city"},{"t":35,"text":"citizen its entirety. Ecosepsumnation and the Songhees Nation of the"},{"t":40,"text":"La Quangan people, we understand and take a moment always"},{"t":44,"text":"to express how pleased and thrilled and honoured we are"},{"t":49,"text":"to be able to do our work here in these"},{"t":50,"text":"territories. Which the nations have stewarded for so many, many"},{"t":54,"text":"generations with the intentive ensuring that we all who have"},{"t":58,"text":"the opportunity to live here have the best possible options"},{"t":61,"text":"for how we make our decisions, how we raise our"},{"t":63,"text":"families. So we live our lives. And the decisions that"},{"t":66,"text":"we make, we hope here in this chamber, we hope"},{"t":69,"text":"to do respect that history as well as embracing and"},{"t":72,"text":"facing the challenges of today, as well as thinking about"},{"t":74,"text":"how those challenges and how we respond to those challenges"},{"t":77,"text":"create a future for those who come after us. Today"},{"t":82,"text":"we want to wish in particular the Song Heath Nation."},{"t":86,"text":"Good luck as they have a by - election today"},{"t":89,"text":"to place a new council member into the vacant spot"},{"t":93,"text":"that they have that was caused by the death earlier"},{"t":95,"text":"this year of one of their elders. And so we"},{"t":98,"text":"look forward to embracing and welcoming whoever that new member"},{"t":101,"text":"of council might be and to work again with them"},{"t":105,"text":"individually and as a whole, both the Song Hisenkosapsum, and"},{"t":109,"text":"the very many opportunities that are ahead for all of"},{"t":111,"text":"us as we explore how to live the best lives"},{"t":114,"text":"we can in these territories. With that, we always like"},{"t":117,"text":"to express our thanks to them in their language, which"},{"t":119,"text":"of course is to say hichrikasium or hydroghymnaquilia, which is"},{"t":123,"text":"to say thank you, and to also offer our respect"},{"t":126,"text":"and our gratitude to all of those people in our"},{"t":129,"text":"territories, in their territories, in our city, who take a"},{"t":132,"text":"moment each day to spend some time trying to improve"},{"t":135,"text":"the lives of at least one other person. I trick"},{"t":140,"text":"CM, Nicole. I have no remarks to add today, and"},{"t":144,"text":"I'm not aware of any late items that need to"},{"t":146,"text":"be added to the agenda, and so I would look"},{"t":147,"text":"for a member of council to move approval of the"},{"t":150,"text":"agenda. Thank you, Councillor Coleman, seconded by Councillor Kim. Any"},{"t":154,"text":"comments on the public agenda. Not seeing any, all those"},{"t":158,"text":"in favor. Anyone opposed. That is unanimous. That takes us"},{"t":162,"text":"on to the consent agenda, and I will just note"},{"t":164,"text":"for the public's information what has been proposed. Sorry, there"},{"t":169,"text":"are four items, item G2, the 1114 Rockland Avenue Rezoning"},{"t":172,"text":"Application. The item H1, the Vancouver Island intercommunity business licensing"},{"t":177,"text":"bylaw. Item H2, the advisory panel by laws. And item"},{"t":182,"text":"I1, the council member motion, finding approaches for the City"},{"t":186,"text":"of Victoria to further respond to America's trade war with"},{"t":188,"text":"Canada. I'm aware that a request has been made already"},{"t":192,"text":"to remove item's G2 and H2 from the consent agenda."},{"t":196,"text":"And so as is our custom, I will do so,"},{"t":200,"text":"and that remains then. Item H1 and item I1 as"},{"t":204,"text":"consent agenda items. Does anyone wish to add a remove"},{"t":208,"text":"anything else from the consent agenda. Not seeing anything else."},{"t":214,"text":"We removed or added, so can I have someone move"},{"t":216,"text":"the consent agenda, please? Thanks Councillor Kim, seconded by Councillor"},{"t":219,"text":"Coleman. All those in favor of the consent agenda being"},{"t":222,"text":"just those two items, anyone opposed. That is unanimous. Thank"},{"t":226,"text":"you very much for that. Interestingly, once in a while,"},{"t":230,"text":"council has scheduled item at a specific time to accommodate"},{"t":234,"text":"different issues or circumstances. These are called orders of the"},{"t":237,"text":"day for those who are familiar with the arcane world"},{"t":240,"text":"protocol. This morning we unusually do have such an item,"},{"t":244,"text":"and this item, in fact, requires some attention in a"},{"t":247,"text":"closed session. So first I'm going to ask Mr. Kingsley"},{"t":249,"text":"if you would remind counsel and the public. The sections"},{"t":252,"text":"of the Community Charter that either require or enable counsel"},{"t":256,"text":"to consider a matter in a closed session. Mr. Kingsley."},{"t":261,"text":"Thank you, Mayor. The reasons proposed to close the meeting"},{"t":263,"text":"today are under Section 91F of the Community Charter regarding"},{"t":267,"text":"law enforcement matter. In Section 92B, regarding the consideration of"},{"t":270,"text":"information received and held in confidence relating to negotiations between"},{"t":274,"text":"the municipality and another level of government. Thank you very"},{"t":277,"text":"much for that. So for those reasons, may I have"},{"t":279,"text":"a motion please to move into and convene at closed"},{"t":282,"text":"session. Thanks Councillor Coleman, second of my councillor Kim. Any"},{"t":285,"text":"discussion. Councillor Gardner. Thank you, Mayor. Excuse me. And I"},{"t":290,"text":"appreciate what Mr. Kingsley just read and about Section 90"},{"t":294,"text":"and Section 92. The permit you to take this meeting"},{"t":297,"text":"into clothes and away again from public scrutiny. We've had"},{"t":301,"text":"a lot of discussion in the public realm now about"},{"t":303,"text":"closed meeting. Now Section 92 refers to all public bodies."},{"t":308,"text":"And so perhaps you can rationale as to why discussions"},{"t":312,"text":"with all public bodies, which one would expect to be"},{"t":315,"text":"public, is going to be enclosed. I think Mr. Kingsley"},{"t":319,"text":"reiterates the first of the Sections at our applicable to"},{"t":321,"text":"this would answer that question. That would be the law"},{"t":325,"text":"enforcement section. I'm sorry, Mayor. Can I just, the request"},{"t":330,"text":"is just to have it read again. Yes. Certainly. It's,"},{"t":334,"text":"the section is Section 91F of the Community Charter regarding"},{"t":337,"text":"a law enforcement matter. Yes, that's correct. Did you require"},{"t":340,"text":"the second as well? No, that's just, I believe that"},{"t":342,"text":"answers the question that was posed. Well, our question. Tory,"},{"t":346,"text":"my question really was that 92, which is the section"},{"t":348,"text":"that's underneath that one. Refers to all public bodies. In"},{"t":353,"text":"other words, we're having discussions with all public bodies. And"},{"t":357,"text":"I'm sure the General Public's wondering why discussions between and"},{"t":359,"text":"amongst all public bodies are enclosed, especially since we have"},{"t":364,"text":"so many closed meetings. I think the answer to that"},{"t":367,"text":"would be the secondary aspect that's been presented by Mr."},{"t":369,"text":"Kingsley would in fact be secondary in the first aspect"},{"t":372,"text":"that's been quoted would be sufficient for us to move"},{"t":374,"text":"in on this matter. Thank you. And since we have"},{"t":377,"text":"so many people present that look like they're here for"},{"t":379,"text":"the next one. Give any estimate of time so that"},{"t":381,"text":"they can go. Okay. Thank you everyone in the audience"},{"t":386,"text":"waiting. I know, I'll speak to that in a moment."},{"t":388,"text":"Any other comments on the motion to move into a"},{"t":391,"text":"closed session. Yeah, I just had a hand up. Sorry,"},{"t":395,"text":"Constor Thompson, I didn't see him. Go ahead. Uh, thank"},{"t":398,"text":"you. Yeah, just for the members of the public that"},{"t":400,"text":"might be interested in this topic. I hope you all"},{"t":404,"text":"know that we have had literally hundreds of closed meetings"},{"t":408,"text":"over the last four years with unanimous votes to go"},{"t":411,"text":"into closed for discussions of matters like this and other"},{"t":416,"text":"matters. It is entirely a normal function of government. Thank"},{"t":420,"text":"you. Thank you for expressing that opinion, Councillor Thompson. Anybody"},{"t":423,"text":"else. Okay, not seeing Anna or comments, all those in"},{"t":427,"text":"favor. Is anyone opposed. That is indeed unanimous. So just"},{"t":433,"text":"for the information of the public, this is an item"},{"t":435,"text":"that will require a little bit of time, although we're"},{"t":438,"text":"not certain about how much. So we will in fact"},{"t":440,"text":"return to council here in the chambers as soon as"},{"t":443,"text":"this matter is concluded, but in the meantime, I suggest"},{"t":446,"text":"it would be helpful for you to perhaps go and"},{"t":448,"text":"get yourself a cup of tea. So we will just"},{"t":451,"text":"take a moment to allow staff to move us into"},{"t":454,"text":"closed as there are certain mechanics that need to be"},{"t":456,"text":"required for that. And once that happens, we'll begin that"},{"t":460,"text":"session. And as I say, we will return as quickly"},{"t":462,"text":"as possible."},{"t":497,"text":"Thank you. Good morning. My name is Miko Batanzo, senior"},{"t":500,"text":"pine urban design with development services. I'm here with my"},{"t":503,"text":"colleagues, Crystal Steveno, our senior heritage planner, and are acting"},{"t":507,"text":"assistant director of development services, Jim Handy. This proposal is"},{"t":511,"text":"to rezone the property, to modify the site - specific"},{"t":514,"text":"regulations under the Oldtown District 1 zone to permit additional"},{"t":518,"text":"density for a purpose - built mid - rise residential"},{"t":521,"text":"rental building with ground four commercial uses and a publicly"},{"t":524,"text":"accessible plaza. A could - development permit with variances, addresses"},{"t":528,"text":"the proposed form and character, water and energy conservation and"},{"t":532,"text":"landscaping, and includes variances related to height, parking, and bicycle"},{"t":537,"text":"parking configuration. The key considerations are there for council, are"},{"t":541,"text":"therefore the proposed use density and massing as part of"},{"t":543,"text":"the OCP, and the development permit considerations relate to the"},{"t":547,"text":"form and character of the proposed building and the landscaping"},{"t":551,"text":"and the proposed variances insofar as their relative impacts and"},{"t":554,"text":"the measures proposed to mitigate those impacts. The site occupies"},{"t":559,"text":"half a city block bounded by Courtney Gordon and Brownton"},{"t":565,"text":"Street, the scene in this aerial image. The existing site"},{"t":569,"text":"is currently a four - story parcade. It's a three"},{"t":572,"text":"- story structure, but a four - story parcade, and"},{"t":574,"text":"it uniquely has commercial uses at the ground level. This"},{"t":577,"text":"is sort of an aerial view, and then this is"},{"t":580,"text":"the view from Broad Street - looking South. Moving around"},{"t":585,"text":"the block, this is Gordon Street, where the ground floor"},{"t":588,"text":"commercial uses are concentrated. This is Courtney Street, looking north."},{"t":594,"text":"And then when we move over to the neighbouring properties,"},{"t":597,"text":"we're still on Courtney Street here, where there's a mix"},{"t":600,"text":"of two to 7 - story buildings, and on the"},{"t":602,"text":"right hand of the image is the Magnolia Hotel. Moving"},{"t":606,"text":"around to Gordon Street, we can see that property is"},{"t":609,"text":"immediately across the street are at 1 - 3 stories"},{"t":613,"text":"with the overhyped wheeler building at the corner of Gordon"},{"t":615,"text":"and Brown. Kitty Corner to the subject site, we have"},{"t":619,"text":"the 11 - Store Sovereign Building that was completed in"},{"t":623,"text":"2013, and the 6th - Store Yarrow building. As you"},{"t":626,"text":"move east Downgrown, we get into the 3 - story"},{"t":628,"text":"Heritage Fabric Buildings that kind of define most of Oldtown."},{"t":633,"text":"Then the building that shares the block and a property"},{"t":636,"text":"boundary with the proposal is the St. Andrew's Presbyterian Church,"},{"t":639,"text":"which is one of 11 landmark heritage buildings in the"},{"t":642,"text":"Downtown. Moving to our analysis. Of course, the Key City"},{"t":646,"text":"Policies that the application is reviewed against, include the official"},{"t":650,"text":"Community Plan, the Downtown Corps Area Design Guidelines, the Oldtown"},{"t":653,"text":"Design Guidelines, and the Rezoning and Development Policy. The subject"},{"t":658,"text":"property is located within the Downtown Corps in the OCP"},{"t":661,"text":"Urban Structure Concept. And at this location, a variety of"},{"t":664,"text":"land uses are supported, including residential and commercial as is"},{"t":667,"text":"proposed. Notably, the residential being proposed is Purpose - Bill"},{"t":671,"text":"Rental, which would be secured with a housing agreement. Additionally,"},{"t":675,"text":"the proposal exceeds the Zoning bylaw 2018 requirements for family"},{"t":679,"text":"housing. Moving to the envisioned urban form, the OCP generally"},{"t":685,"text":"seeks to retain a low - rise - built scale"},{"t":688,"text":"that preserves and highlights adjacent heritage assets and tapers up"},{"t":691,"text":"from the harbour. Low rise is noted as building's generally"},{"t":695,"text":"in the four to six - story range. The OCP"},{"t":697,"text":"also, however, encourages a wider consideration to guide suitable -"},{"t":701,"text":"built form. And this includes the existing and future -"},{"t":704,"text":"built context impacts on public property and key views and"},{"t":709,"text":"alignment with zoning and other policy and regulations. Other key"},{"t":713,"text":"OCP policies include preserving and highlighting heritage assets, transitioning between"},{"t":718,"text":"areas with taller buildings, with lower - scale infill forms,"},{"t":721,"text":"and place - making that express the city values and"},{"t":724,"text":"promote distinctive features of Victoria. The proposed public plaza, which"},{"t":727,"text":"I'll speak to more later in the presentation, helps to"},{"t":730,"text":"advance these goals by highlighting St. Andrew's Church suitably transitioning"},{"t":734,"text":"to taller buildings, which is illustrated in the key view"},{"t":736,"text":"analysis, and by promoting distinctive features of the city with"},{"t":740,"text":"its continuation of discrete pedestrian areas knitted into the city's"},{"t":743,"text":"urban fabric. Moving to the downtown core area plan, it's"},{"t":748,"text":"building height guidance reinforces the urban structure concept in the"},{"t":751,"text":"OCP at this location, and the envisioned building heights are"},{"t":754,"text":"up to five stories. Now looking at the proposal, it"},{"t":759,"text":"is for a 12 - story residential rental building with"},{"t":761,"text":"ground floor commercial uses and is proposed at a density"},{"t":764,"text":"of 5. 94 to 1 FSR. The existing zone density"},{"t":768,"text":"is 3. 9 to 1 FSR. Looking at the site"},{"t":773,"text":"plan, this slide shows the ground floor, which has the"},{"t":776,"text":"main lobby entrance off Gordon Street, and 3 commercial retail"},{"t":780,"text":"units, or CRUs. To activate the public plaza, a CRU"},{"t":783,"text":"is proposed adjacent with its exits and tables and chairs"},{"t":787,"text":"spilling out into the Plaza area. This is a landscape"},{"t":790,"text":"plan which demonstrates that you can see the table in"},{"t":793,"text":"which demonstrates this sort of effect, and you can see"},{"t":795,"text":"the tables and chairs in that image. This slide also"},{"t":798,"text":"illustrates some of the extensive frontage improvements around the site,"},{"t":802,"text":"which include enhanced streetscapes on all three frontages. Rain gardens"},{"t":806,"text":"and landscaping that advance the linear Parkway goals for Courtney"},{"t":809,"text":"Street, a raised pedestrian crossing, extending beyond the centre line"},{"t":813,"text":"of Brownton Street to connect the plaza to the pedestrian"},{"t":816,"text":"areas on Broad Street. These improvements beyond bylaws, but beyond"},{"t":822,"text":"the bylaws standard would be secured in a legal agreement,"},{"t":825,"text":"an appropriate wording is provided in the recommended motion. This"},{"t":829,"text":"slide provides an additional view of the plaza, and some"},{"t":832,"text":"of the precedent images to illustrate the general intent of"},{"t":834,"text":"its design. There are three levels of underground parking, with"},{"t":840,"text":"the main entrance off of Courtney Street. In terms of"},{"t":843,"text":"the parking variance, 189 parking stalls are required, and 141"},{"t":847,"text":"are being provided. This is a shortfall of 48 stalls."},{"t":851,"text":"To help mitigate the impact of this shortfall, a comprehensive"},{"t":854,"text":"transportation demand management, or TDM packages proposed. Key features of"},{"t":858,"text":"the TDM package include membership and BCTrand's ecoPaths program for"},{"t":863,"text":"all the units to evalue of just over 360, 000."},{"t":866,"text":"Provision of an electric vehicle with an on - site"},{"t":868,"text":"dedicated stall, an increased long - term biking and bike"},{"t":872,"text":"facilities. All of which would be proposed to be secured"},{"t":875,"text":"in a legal agreement. This is the ground floor plan."},{"t":880,"text":"The majority of the area at this level is devoted"},{"t":882,"text":"to CRUs, which is consistent with policy and helps to"},{"t":884,"text":"activate the street level. Moving up through the proposal, we're"},{"t":889,"text":"on the second floor. There are 26 apartments on this"},{"t":891,"text":"floor, including two, three - bedroom units. This is the"},{"t":896,"text":"plan for Floor's three to seven, which generally defines the"},{"t":898,"text":"podium for the proposal. And moving up to the eighth"},{"t":902,"text":"and ninth floor, the floors, the building transitions into its"},{"t":905,"text":"mid - rise form, and you can see the amenity"},{"t":908,"text":"areas on the roofs of the lower portions of the"},{"t":910,"text":"building. This slide also demonstrates one of the benefits of"},{"t":914,"text":"the proposed massing distribution. The building's longest dimension runs north"},{"t":918,"text":"- south, which minimizes shadowing and creates preferential light access"},{"t":922,"text":"to the units. This aspect of the design is factored"},{"t":925,"text":"into the consideration of the height variance. And then as"},{"t":928,"text":"I flip through Floor's 10 and 10 to 12, you"},{"t":931,"text":"can see how the building's setbacks reduce the floor plate"},{"t":934,"text":"sizes as you move up in building height, which in"},{"t":938,"text":"turn diminishes the visibility to the upper stories when perceived"},{"t":941,"text":"at close range. These next slides show the building elevations,"},{"t":945,"text":"the image on the left is facing west on Gordon"},{"t":948,"text":"Street. This is the largest face of the building, and"},{"t":950,"text":"is evident in this image that the design approach to"},{"t":953,"text":"emulate a typical heritage building composition. There's a clear base"},{"t":957,"text":"middle and top, a formal gridded fenestration pattern, clear structural"},{"t":962,"text":"bays, and a higher wall to window ratio, which is"},{"t":964,"text":"a hallmark of Heritage Buildings. These factors, along with a"},{"t":968,"text":"proposed materials, helped to make the application consistent with the"},{"t":971,"text":"forming character design guidelines. This composition continues on the east"},{"t":976,"text":"side and north elevations. And then looking at the Section"},{"t":981,"text":"Plan, uh, you can get a good indication of how"},{"t":983,"text":"those setbacks are proposed. This section plan running north -"},{"t":989,"text":"south shows the lower 7 - story sections of the"},{"t":991,"text":"building as it transitions to the lower - scale to"},{"t":994,"text":"a to a lower scale heading east towards St. Andrews"},{"t":996,"text":"Church. Here, you can also see the internal elevated outdoor"},{"t":999,"text":"amenity space in the middle between those two portions of"},{"t":1002,"text":"the building. Uh, above the loading and parking entrances and"},{"t":1005,"text":"portions of the CRUs below. This plan shows how that"},{"t":1009,"text":"private amenity space is being planned out. Here on the"},{"t":1012,"text":"left, there's a dog area seating trees and paving. And"},{"t":1016,"text":"then the rooftop amenity spaces above the lower sections of"},{"t":1018,"text":"the building are also illustrated with those relative landscape plans"},{"t":1023,"text":"as well. This slide shows that a green roof is"},{"t":1027,"text":"also proposed, which forms part of the landscaping proposal. To"},{"t":1033,"text":"illustrate how the proposed masking was distributed in response to"},{"t":1036,"text":"the site context, this slide provides a step - by"},{"t":1038,"text":"- step account. It starts with 1st achieving a separation"},{"t":1042,"text":"to St. Andrews Church to reestablish its prominence within the"},{"t":1046,"text":"street wall. And to be deferential to its heritage value."},{"t":1049,"text":"This pushed most of the density to a mid -"},{"t":1051,"text":"rise building form that runs north - south emulating the"},{"t":1055,"text":"existing larger footprint and orientation of the yarrow building to"},{"t":1059,"text":"the north. Then, the building steps back and building articulation"},{"t":1062,"text":"is added to diminish the visibility of the upper stories,"},{"t":1066,"text":"align, building faces with adjacent building planes, and to break"},{"t":1069,"text":"up the massing from key vantage points. These steps collectively"},{"t":1073,"text":"distribute the density consistent with policy objectives for context sensitivity."},{"t":1078,"text":"And again, these factors all contribute to the consideration to"},{"t":1081,"text":"support that height variance. Looking at the shadow study, one"},{"t":1085,"text":"of the concerns was that the building may shade the"},{"t":1088,"text":"pedestrian areas on Broad Street, which is closed to vehicles."},{"t":1091,"text":"This analysis shows that this isn't the case, and instead"},{"t":1093,"text":"the proposed plaza acts as an extension of this pedestrian"},{"t":1096,"text":"area, which will receive ample sunlight midday in the summer"},{"t":1100,"text":"and at the Equinoxes. Moving to the landmark Heritage Radius"},{"t":1105,"text":"Policies, as previously mentioned, St. Andrews is one of 11"},{"t":1109,"text":"landmark heritage buildings in the Downtown. These heritage buildings are"},{"t":1112,"text":"noted for their prominence as visual landmarks within the local"},{"t":1115,"text":"streetscapes. Their ability to be commonly recognised and memorable, and"},{"t":1119,"text":"for their overall contribution to the public realm. The related"},{"t":1122,"text":"policies aim to ensure that the height setback sighting an"},{"t":1126,"text":"overall massing of new buildings do not detract from or"},{"t":1129,"text":"obscure the visual prominence of these buildings. Looking at the"},{"t":1133,"text":"context elevation, you can see how the building massing is"},{"t":1136,"text":"set back and separated from the church by the plaza,"},{"t":1138,"text":"and steps down towards it. In the lower image, you"},{"t":1143,"text":"can see the existing site condition, which shows the parqued"},{"t":1146,"text":"spiral exit ramp right next to the church. As the"},{"t":1149,"text":"other images on the slight illustratory, the proposal significantly improves"},{"t":1152,"text":"this relationship. Moving on to a render of what that"},{"t":1156,"text":"will likely look like, I can flip back and forth"},{"t":1158,"text":"to the previous slide to demonstrate this improvement to the"},{"t":1162,"text":"Heritage Context. At this location, there's one public external view"},{"t":1170,"text":"that is protected. So views looking at the city from"},{"t":1173,"text":"afar, and that's the Laurel point view. The overall policy"},{"t":1176,"text":"objective here is to conserve these views and the character"},{"t":1179,"text":"- defining elements within them and to minimize impacts. The"},{"t":1182,"text":"relevant guidelines include utilising sympathetic materials and colours and well"},{"t":1187,"text":"- crafted detailing to relate to the adjacent historic buildings,"},{"t":1190,"text":"using complementary massing proportion and spacings, and retaining the visual"},{"t":1195,"text":"role of supporting buildings and reinforcing the General Patern of"},{"t":1198,"text":"Background Buildings. And so this is a view, the existing"},{"t":1201,"text":"view. And I apologise because an existing view wasn't provided."},{"t":1205,"text":"So this is a Photoshop version, which accurately reflects the"},{"t":1208,"text":"existing BULF form massing, but it is a bit blurry."},{"t":1212,"text":"Um, this is the image of the proposed building within"},{"t":1217,"text":"this view, and so you can sort of get the"},{"t":1219,"text":"difference between those two views. Um, to help council evaluate"},{"t":1223,"text":"its impact. And so the analysis of the proposed height"},{"t":1227,"text":"variants takes into account these factors. The view analysis, the"},{"t":1231,"text":"building design, and its step backs, I'll just highlight it"},{"t":1234,"text":"here as well. Uh, the existing built context and the"},{"t":1237,"text":"provision of applauza, which largely contributed to the increased building"},{"t":1240,"text":"height. Looking at all of those factors and the general"},{"t":1243,"text":"impact to the Heritage Character of the area from the"},{"t":1245,"text":"perceived height in conjunction with other aspects of the proposal,"},{"t":1248,"text":"like its provision of purpose - built - rental housing,"},{"t":1251,"text":"and significant frontage improvements, had led to the recommendation to"},{"t":1254,"text":"support the height variants. I'll now move through a series"},{"t":1259,"text":"of illustrations that give an indication of how the building"},{"t":1261,"text":"would be perceived from the public realm, which helps to"},{"t":1264,"text":"evaluate its impact on the Heritage character of the area."},{"t":1267,"text":"So this is a view looking east on Brownton, and"},{"t":1270,"text":"you can see the Sussex building in the background. This"},{"t":1274,"text":"is the view looking north on Gordon Street, and in"},{"t":1276,"text":"the background you can see the 11 - Storen building."},{"t":1282,"text":"This is likely the most impactful view. It's on government"},{"t":1285,"text":"street - looking northeast. Uh, however, and I didn't provide"},{"t":1288,"text":"this slide, but if you were to just turn your"},{"t":1290,"text":"head to the southeast, the existing Belmont building creates a"},{"t":1294,"text":"similar sort of height juxtaposition. This is the view from"},{"t":1299,"text":"Gordon Street at Courtney. And then this is the view"},{"t":1304,"text":"- looking South from Broad Street, where you can see"},{"t":1306,"text":"the view terminus defined by this glazed green brick 7"},{"t":1309,"text":"- story wing of the proposal. And this last view"},{"t":1314,"text":"is of St. Andrew's Church from Douglas Street. This image"},{"t":1321,"text":"shows the proposed material palette, and again as noted, the"},{"t":1324,"text":"proposed materials and how they're employed are highly consistent with"},{"t":1328,"text":"the design guideline goals and objectives for a contextual fit,"},{"t":1331,"text":"which reinforces the Heritage character of the area. And I'll"},{"t":1334,"text":"end on this rendering with the recommendation in the report,"},{"t":1337,"text":"which is that the proposal is consistent with many of"},{"t":1340,"text":"the design guideline objectives for building composition, materials, public realm"},{"t":1344,"text":"improvements, and design. It's also consistent with several OCP objectives,"},{"t":1348,"text":"including goals for increased rental housing and downtown living. The"},{"t":1352,"text":"principal departure from City Policy relates to height. However, as"},{"t":1356,"text":"noted, the proposed plaza, existing built context, view analysis, and"},{"t":1360,"text":"relative consistency with other policies, suggests that this variant is"},{"t":1363,"text":"supportable. Well, one heritage preservation objective to retain low -"},{"t":1368,"text":"scale development is contradicted another to improve the conditions around"},{"t":1371,"text":"Heritage Landmark buildings is advanced. Similarly, the proposed parking variance"},{"t":1376,"text":"is supportable based on the comprehensive TDM package being offered."},{"t":1379,"text":"And so far as parking, while the removal of the"},{"t":1382,"text":"existing parking structure is a potential outcome of council's decision,"},{"t":1385,"text":"council's key considerations are limited to the proposal's consistency with"},{"t":1389,"text":"the relevant city policies. To this end, securing or adding"},{"t":1394,"text":"secured rental housing, family - friendly homes, beyond requirements, and"},{"t":1397,"text":"significant frontage improvements, further increases the proposal's consistency with the"},{"t":1402,"text":"broader city policies. With this wider policy consideration, in addition"},{"t":1406,"text":"to balancing the heritage policy, consistencies and inconsistencies, the recommendation"},{"t":1410,"text":"is to support the proposal. That is it. Thank you"},{"t":1415,"text":"very much, Mr. Patanzo. Let us start with questions. I'm"},{"t":1418,"text":"sure there are many Councillor Hammond, why don't you start"},{"t":1420,"text":"us off? Thanks, Merin. Thanks for the presentation. So what"},{"t":1428,"text":"demonstrates the 12 stories is necessary to deliver the plaza"},{"t":1432,"text":"and the other public benefits. Mr. Pretenso. So, through the"},{"t":1438,"text":"mayor, what demonstrates that the 12 stories is necessary? I"},{"t":1442,"text":"think if we were to look at the distribution of"},{"t":1447,"text":"density, what we're looking at is some... I wouldn't say"},{"t":1451,"text":"that it's been demonstrated that it's necessary, but it's an"},{"t":1454,"text":"outcome. It's the preferred outcome of the proposed density. So"},{"t":1459,"text":"there are benefits to, um, to how that density has"},{"t":1463,"text":"been distributed. Which gives us a benefit to the heritage"},{"t":1467,"text":"context in terms of its relationship to the church. And"},{"t":1471,"text":"although the amount of density that may be attributed to"},{"t":1476,"text":"the parcel where the plaza is, may not be completely"},{"t":1480,"text":"consistent with the amount of density that results in the"},{"t":1483,"text":"12 stories. It's sort of close. And so I think"},{"t":1487,"text":"the review is that on balance, um, that additional height"},{"t":1491,"text":"is justified on the basis of that improvement to the"},{"t":1495,"text":"Heritage Context and the provision of applause - off Republic"},{"t":1498,"text":"use. Thanks. And through the mayor, so that, but that"},{"t":1502,"text":"means we have no evidence before us as a materially"},{"t":1506,"text":"shorter building could also retain most of those benefits, is"},{"t":1509,"text":"that correct? Shpetanzo. So through the mayor, I don't think"},{"t":1515,"text":"our normal process isn't to request sort of a proforma"},{"t":1518,"text":"analysis on whether or not the amount of density is"},{"t":1520,"text":"required. What we typically just analyse an application against is"},{"t":1524,"text":"its relative consistency with policy under the premise that what"},{"t":1530,"text":"is being proposed is what generally would pencil from an"},{"t":1535,"text":"applicant's perspective. Okay, and you mentioned about heritage. And so"},{"t":1540,"text":"staff told the Heritage Panel that the human scale is"},{"t":1543,"text":"generally six to eight stories, and that twelve stories does"},{"t":1546,"text":"not fully meet the objective. Why recommend 12 stories. Mr."},{"t":1551,"text":"Tenzo. So through the mayor, the recommendation to support the"},{"t":1557,"text":"application at 12 stories is based on a more comprehensive"},{"t":1561,"text":"review of City policies. Um, I apologise. I should typically"},{"t":1565,"text":"say through the mayor. Um, so through the mayor, the"},{"t":1568,"text":"consistency with the wider City policies is what staff are"},{"t":1574,"text":"tasked with. And so in the instance of heritage review,"},{"t":1579,"text":"um, it doesn't achieve all of the heritage objectives from"},{"t":1582,"text":"that perspective, but from a wider sort of city policy"},{"t":1585,"text":"evaluation on balance the staff recommendation is based on that,"},{"t":1589,"text":"which includes the provision of rental housing, uh, significant frontage"},{"t":1593,"text":"improvements, and the plaza, as opposed to the one consideration"},{"t":1596,"text":"of building height. Okay. And so then, again, getting back"},{"t":1600,"text":"to the 12 stories when normally it's supposed to be"},{"t":1603,"text":"six - day stories. Why not be recommending eight, nine,"},{"t":1608,"text":"or 10 stories, for example. Mr. Patanzo. Through the mayor,"},{"t":1618,"text":"the recommendation that staff have come to is based on"},{"t":1621,"text":"that fuller analysis of the proposal. And so while we"},{"t":1625,"text":"could recommend that the height be reduced, you know, we've"},{"t":1628,"text":"had sort of a year - long conversation with an"},{"t":1630,"text":"applicant on a requirement of a particular level of density"},{"t":1634,"text":"to make the project actually work. And so we're working"},{"t":1637,"text":"within that framework to sort of achieve the best outcome."},{"t":1640,"text":"Okay. So through the mayor, if council approves this 38."},{"t":1645,"text":"11 metres and 5. 94 to one FSR, where the"},{"t":1650,"text":"framework contemplates 15 metres and 3 to 1, what's the"},{"t":1655,"text":"limiting principle for future Oldwn applications. Mr. Patenzo. So through"},{"t":1661,"text":"the mayor, so every application is sort of reviewed on"},{"t":1663,"text":"its own merits, um, but I won't, uh, you know,"},{"t":1667,"text":"every application that also get to prove, um, sets a"},{"t":1670,"text":"bit of a trajectory for, uh, future development in the"},{"t":1674,"text":"city as well. Um, I think some of the things"},{"t":1676,"text":"to take into consideration are the incremental growth within Oldwn"},{"t":1681,"text":"and within the city as a whole. And so our"},{"t":1684,"text":"OCP speaks to how incremental growth is meant to be"},{"t":1687,"text":"supported. And if we look through sort of an historical"},{"t":1690,"text":"lend, we can look at, you know, buildings like the"},{"t":1692,"text":"Magnolia are at nearly 5 FSR. Our most recent sort"},{"t":1696,"text":"of hotel approved into Downtown is just shy of 5"},{"t":1699,"text":"FSR at 8 stories. And so there's an incremental growth"},{"t":1703,"text":"that the OCP is premised on supporting. And looking through"},{"t":1708,"text":"that lens, um, that's sort of how we're evaluating each"},{"t":1712,"text":"proposal as they come forward. So then through the mayor,"},{"t":1715,"text":"can we expect, if this is approved that other applications"},{"t":1719,"text":"will also come back double what is normally expected. I"},{"t":1726,"text":"don't think I can speak to what you could expect,"},{"t":1730,"text":"but there are tremendous development pressures on the City of"},{"t":1733,"text":"Victoria at present. And I would expect those conditions to"},{"t":1736,"text":"continue. There's also tremendous pressures on the City Victoria not"},{"t":1740,"text":"to just turn into another city that is not like"},{"t":1743,"text":"Victoria. So don't we also want to retain some of"},{"t":1747,"text":"the things that are special about Oldwn and the specifications"},{"t":1751,"text":"that we're expected. But for something like this application, uh,"},{"t":1756,"text":"through the mayor, that is the condition and the consideration"},{"t":1759,"text":"before council today. Okay, thank you. And one last question"},{"t":1763,"text":"or in this area, Mayor, the parking study addresses the"},{"t":1768,"text":"aggregate offstreet capacity. How a staff assessed the loss of"},{"t":1772,"text":"convenient short - term parking close to nearby businesses, especially"},{"t":1776,"text":"for seniors, sorry, visitors and people with mobility limitations. Mr."},{"t":1782,"text":"Patenze. So through the merit, the assessment for the parking"},{"t":1789,"text":"variance is based on the policies relative to what's being"},{"t":1794,"text":"proposed. So, um, 200 and some odd units of residential"},{"t":1799,"text":"housing is being proposed. There's a parking requirement to support"},{"t":1802,"text":"that much development, the shortfall, uh, there is a shortfall"},{"t":1807,"text":"of up to 48 stalls. And, um, that shortfall is"},{"t":1811,"text":"being addressed to a TDM package. And so what isn't"},{"t":1814,"text":"being assessed is the parking in terms of how it"},{"t":1818,"text":"services the wider community, what's being assessed are the policies"},{"t":1822,"text":"relevant to this application, which is whether or not that"},{"t":1825,"text":"parking is suitable for the amount of density being proposed."},{"t":1828,"text":"Sure. And through the mayor, I'm not suggesting that we"},{"t":1831,"text":"can't turn public parking lots into other, other forms of"},{"t":1836,"text":"business, such as housing, for example. But knowing that we"},{"t":1841,"text":"got comments from some of the business around there that'll"},{"t":1843,"text":"have a negative impact on them. Was there any analysis"},{"t":1847,"text":"that was done about, um, how far people would have"},{"t":1852,"text":"to park in order to use those business around there."},{"t":1856,"text":"And would that have an impact on them. Mr. Tenzo."},{"t":1860,"text":"So through the mayor, I can sort of parsley answer"},{"t":1862,"text":"that, but I might look to our transportation colleagues to"},{"t":1864,"text":"more fully answer that. Um, the, the analysis that the"},{"t":1869,"text":"city undertakes from a staff perspective is relative to the"},{"t":1872,"text":"policies that we have. And so the policies, you know,"},{"t":1876,"text":"governing what we're looking at are the parking requirements for"},{"t":1880,"text":"what's being proposed. Um, I think perhaps, you know, an"},{"t":1885,"text":"analogous or an analogy could be, you know, one of"},{"t":1888,"text":"the challenges with development in the city is the amount"},{"t":1890,"text":"of development that's happening. The volume of development. Well, there"},{"t":1894,"text":"aren't policies in the city that govern or regulate that."},{"t":1897,"text":"Those are outcomes of city decisions rather than, um, an"},{"t":1900,"text":"analysis of how much development should occur or shouldn't occur."},{"t":1904,"text":"Um, so, uh, no, that analysis has not been done"},{"t":1907,"text":"from a planning perspective. Transportation may have other comments on"},{"t":1911,"text":"that, uh, typically it's just relative to what's being proposed."},{"t":1914,"text":"Mr. Doyle, I see you leaning in there. Do you"},{"t":1916,"text":"have something to offer? Through the mayor, assistant director Ross"},{"t":1920,"text":"Kennedy is available to expand on Mehikhil's comments. Yes, I"},{"t":1924,"text":"do see him online. Hello, Mr. Kenny. What would you"},{"t":1926,"text":"like to add. Good morning, Mary Council. Um, through the"},{"t":1930,"text":"mayor, I'd say so the applicant has provided a parking"},{"t":1932,"text":"impact assessment that's in the attachments. Um, through their third"},{"t":1937,"text":"party review, they've been looking at kind of the public"},{"t":1939,"text":"demand of their own parking lot and surrounding area. Um,"},{"t":1943,"text":"through that review, again, this is a snapshot in time."},{"t":1946,"text":"They're, they're, they're demonstrating what they believe, um, and saying"},{"t":1949,"text":"that there is a capacity in surrounding parquets. Um, however,"},{"t":1954,"text":"you know, again, limitations always to, they're showing, um, peak"},{"t":1957,"text":"demand, say at lunchtime midweek, um, that they're, you know,"},{"t":1961,"text":"people would have to find alternatives. And again, this is"},{"t":1963,"text":"looking from September. So, you know, different demand times in"},{"t":1968,"text":"the report calls out, you know, say in the wintertime,"},{"t":1970,"text":"there may be or in December or special events, You"},{"t":1975,"text":"know, so, but we haven't specifically looked at, say, the"},{"t":1978,"text":"parking impact as, uh, you know, Mr. Patazzo speaks to"},{"t":1983,"text":"where we've been looking at the site and, uh, we"},{"t":1985,"text":"would respond accordingly based on council's direction. Thanks. Mayor, I"},{"t":1989,"text":"made a mistake. I actually have one more question. It's"},{"t":1992,"text":"okay. Um, the Heritage Advisory panel unanimously recommended declining and"},{"t":1996,"text":"a revision, what substantive changes were made afterwards. Mr. Patenza?"},{"t":2002,"text":"Uh, so through the mayor, no substantive changes were made"},{"t":2005,"text":"after either the advisory design panel, uh, and the heritage"},{"t":2008,"text":"advisory panel. I will sort of make comment that, um,"},{"t":2013,"text":"that the sort of staff purview of that commentary. You"},{"t":2016,"text":"know, reflects comments specific to certain aspects of the, of"},{"t":2020,"text":"the proposal. So when we seek advice from the heritage"},{"t":2024,"text":"advisory panel, we get heritage advice. Um, staff's role is"},{"t":2029,"text":"more broad in assessing, um, the full suite of city"},{"t":2033,"text":"policies. And so while their comments and inputs always inform"},{"t":2037,"text":"our evaluation, uh, they're not determinants of what, uh, the"},{"t":2040,"text":"staff recommendation would be. And therefore this unanimous decision of"},{"t":2045,"text":"an expert panel did not form part of any of"},{"t":2048,"text":"the decision of consideration of making changes to this proposal."},{"t":2052,"text":"Mr. Tensel. So through the mayor, those, um, comments go"},{"t":2056,"text":"to it, the applicant for their consideration. Um, in terms"},{"t":2059,"text":"of staff's, um, use of that commentary, we always support,"},{"t":2065,"text":"um, making amendment to applications following our advisory panel reviews"},{"t":2071,"text":"and whether or not the applicant does or doesn't is"},{"t":2073,"text":"at their discretion. Thanks, Mayor. Thank you. Good call, goodner."},{"t":2079,"text":"Thank you. Um, slide 18."},{"t":2095,"text":"To the mayor. I apologise. Which slide would that be?"},{"t":2097,"text":"I can't see the number. 18. Oh, 18. Oh, the"},{"t":2100,"text":"numbers are there. 201. 18. We received a note this"},{"t":2108,"text":"morning in our mailboxes from someone, uh, on the, um,"},{"t":2112,"text":"co - chair of the property finance and trustee of"},{"t":2115,"text":"St. Andrews. And they state they're not going to take"},{"t":2117,"text":"a position on the rezoning. However, they are speaking about"},{"t":2121,"text":"their three car parking spot. Where is that on the"},{"t":2124,"text":"schematic. So through the mayor, that would be, if you're"},{"t":2128,"text":"looking at the sort of half circle, uh, of the"},{"t":2132,"text":"church, it's that small grey area just in front of"},{"t":2135,"text":"that. That's what I thought. So what they have suggested"},{"t":2138,"text":"is they proposed to, uh, that space, their space being"},{"t":2142,"text":"incorporated into the plaza to make it bigger and better"},{"t":2146,"text":"fit with the church if it goes forward. Uh, but"},{"t":2149,"text":"they be guaranteed three parking spots in the new building."},{"t":2152,"text":"Has this been considered. Those discussions have occurred? They are"},{"t":2158,"text":"ongoing. Um, and I can suggest that should counsel wish"},{"t":2162,"text":"to formalize, uh, request that staff, uh, pursue those discussions"},{"t":2166,"text":"further that an amendment to the motion could be made"},{"t":2169,"text":"and, um, we do have some wording prepared. Should you"},{"t":2171,"text":"wish to go that route? Thank you. We just got"},{"t":2174,"text":"that this morning. Further to, uh, the combat that was"},{"t":2176,"text":"just made about the Heritage's review panel. You will know"},{"t":2179,"text":"on July 30th at a motion was arising on a"},{"t":2182,"text":"different issue to create a heritage oldwn committee in order"},{"t":2185,"text":"to not have oldwn go into a full broad consideration,"},{"t":2189,"text":"but actually focus more on the heritage. And it was"},{"t":2192,"text":"to include a member of the Heritage Advisory Panel Victoria"},{"t":2196,"text":"Civic Heritage Trust, the Hall of Mark Society. And no"},{"t":2198,"text":"one other heritage experts in BC. Were any of them"},{"t":2202,"text":"consulted. Are any representatives for those groups. Uh, through the"},{"t":2209,"text":"mayor, no, our general process was followed, which just brings"},{"t":2213,"text":"this to the Heritage Advisory panel. Thank you. The heights"},{"t":2217,"text":"of nearby structures. What is the height again of the"},{"t":2218,"text":"building directly to the West."},{"t":2238,"text":"So through the mayor, I believe you're referring to the"},{"t":2240,"text":"wheeler building at the corner. Yeah. So the Wheeler building"},{"t":2245,"text":"is. Sorry, I apologise. It's a, it's a, yeah, it's"},{"t":2252,"text":"a, it's a five story building and 23 metres. Thank"},{"t":2258,"text":"you. What is the height of St. Andrews? I, you"},{"t":2263,"text":"had a slide and I couldn't catch the number. I'm"},{"t":2265,"text":"sorry. The height of St. Andrews to the main roof"},{"t":2268,"text":"level, not including the tower. What would that height be"},{"t":2270,"text":"in relation to the proposal? Would it be the 7th"},{"t":2273,"text":"story, the 9th story? What would that height be. Strictanzo."},{"t":2278,"text":"So through the mayor, I don't believe we have that,"},{"t":2281,"text":"uh, exact number, but I can probably provide a context"},{"t":2285,"text":"image that might give us an indication there. So if"},{"t":2290,"text":"we're looking at this context image, you can see that"},{"t":2293,"text":"not the tower, but rather the main portion of the"},{"t":2296,"text":"church looks to be about a story lower than the"},{"t":2300,"text":"7 - story wing. So about 6 stories which would"},{"t":2304,"text":"fall within the oldwn guidelines, actually, I think. Okay. Um,"},{"t":2309,"text":"and what is the height just because there's so many"},{"t":2311,"text":"comparisons. What was the height of the Kello Spilling. Tell"},{"t":2318,"text":"us Ocean, Mr. Pretenza. Do you remember that off the"},{"t":2319,"text":"top of your head? Through the marriage. I'll take me"},{"t":2321,"text":"just a moment, but I can provide that."},{"t":2352,"text":"To the mayor. Thank you. So it's 53 metres is"},{"t":2354,"text":"the teles ocean building. 53 metres. And so I believe"},{"t":2359,"text":"that was 11 stories, but it's a 10 to 11"},{"t":2362,"text":"stories. So this is larger than that. Um, sorry, through"},{"t":2368,"text":"the mirror. It's actually lower than the telescope. No, but"},{"t":2371,"text":"different stories is unusual. Okay. Um, but the lights, the"},{"t":2375,"text":"structures are shown here. Six would be the same height."},{"t":2379,"text":"And seven. Got it. Okay. How does it propose development"},{"t":2382,"text":"not meet the OCP guidelines or decapital scale guidelines. Mr."},{"t":2387,"text":"Patentzo. So through the mayor, the OCP speaks to the"},{"t":2391,"text":"urban structure concept, which typically envisions buildings in that sort"},{"t":2395,"text":"of four to six - story range. It's low -"},{"t":2397,"text":"rise buildings within the harbour. Um, and then the downtown"},{"t":2402,"text":"query plan reinforces those policies and sort of generally points"},{"t":2405,"text":"to buildings at about the five - story range. And"},{"t":2408,"text":"so, um, from that perspective, it would not meet those"},{"t":2413,"text":"policies, um, in terms of the height of the building."},{"t":2416,"text":"Okay. In oldwn is five, correct? To the mayor, that's"},{"t":2420,"text":"correct. Thank you. I will mention though that the variability"},{"t":2422,"text":"with that. It's not a hard number and it relates"},{"t":2425,"text":"to, uh, a larger assessment of the site in its"},{"t":2428,"text":"relationship to its surroundings. Okay. Frequently when I've looked at"},{"t":2431,"text":"things in the past, that could be wrong. It's just"},{"t":2433,"text":"me on memory. Uh, the proposal doesn't actually incorporate any"},{"t":2437,"text":"existing heritage needs. Um, in other words, it's not contributing"},{"t":2440,"text":"to, um, revitalization of a heritage building, et cetera. And"},{"t":2446,"text":"is there not usually some kind of amenity in that"},{"t":2449,"text":"way that comes forward when you have increased height. And"},{"t":2453,"text":"density. Tensile through the mayor, I can speak to when"},{"t":2457,"text":"we have, um, increase height in Oldwn that's associated with"},{"t":2462,"text":"a heritage building or a heritage asset, typically the amenity"},{"t":2466,"text":"is a seismic upgrade or improvements to the retention or"},{"t":2471,"text":"rehabilitation of that heritage asset. There are no heritage assets"},{"t":2475,"text":"on this site, but it does advance, um, heritage, uh,"},{"t":2480,"text":"form and character, wider neighbourhood considerations with how it is"},{"t":2489,"text":"organised next to the St. Andrews Church. So that Plaza"},{"t":2494,"text":"has a significant improvement to that significant heritage asset. Okay."},{"t":2499,"text":"I had a statement that I have problems with in"},{"t":2501,"text":"the report. And I'll read it to you. It was"},{"t":2505,"text":"in quotation marks. Rather than enshrining the proposed height within"},{"t":2509,"text":"the new zone being created, it is proposed to be"},{"t":2512,"text":"traded as a variance treated as a variance. This approach"},{"t":2515,"text":"has a benefit of making the proposed height a condition"},{"t":2517,"text":"only applicable to this application. Does anyone actually believe that."},{"t":2525,"text":"Because what I've seen over 20 years is no matter"},{"t":2527,"text":"what you put there, it's a precedent. Yes. Thank you."},{"t":2532,"text":"So through the mayor, the reason that the height would"},{"t":2534,"text":"be treated as a variance is so that should in"},{"t":2538,"text":"the future at this application, not advance. And if it"},{"t":2541,"text":"were not treated as a variance, then that height would"},{"t":2544,"text":"be permitted basically anywhere on the site. And so what"},{"t":2547,"text":"could then end up happening is a building at this"},{"t":2550,"text":"height directly adjacent to St. Andrew's Church, which would be"},{"t":2554,"text":"a negative outcome that we're trying to avoid. So by"},{"t":2557,"text":"having it as just a variance associated with this application,"},{"t":2562,"text":"the BULT form is known. And the BULT form in"},{"t":2566,"text":"what's being proposed is the most preferential to accommodate that"},{"t":2569,"text":"height relative to St. Andrews. You're speaking in terms of"},{"t":2573,"text":"a precedent, but the, the precedent being set would simply"},{"t":2578,"text":"be through the construction of this rather than, um, whether"},{"t":2581,"text":"or not it's enshrined. That height is enshrined in the"},{"t":2583,"text":"zone. Okay. So this variance here only if they fail"},{"t":2588,"text":"to build it, that it doesn't count. So, so there's"},{"t":2593,"text":"nothing being said that this isn't going to be present"},{"t":2595,"text":"because I believe certainly will be. So that clarifies that."},{"t":2598,"text":"Okay. Um. So my parking questions was already answered. That's"},{"t":2608,"text":"it for now. Consider Caradona and then Councillor Kim. All"},{"t":2614,"text":"right. We'll flip it and we'll go to cancer camp."},{"t":2619,"text":"Thanks Councillor Kurt on it. Um, through the chair, regarding"},{"t":2625,"text":"parking, um, and some of the concerns that the businesses"},{"t":2628,"text":"in the area have raised. When, if, if this were"},{"t":2632,"text":"to go through in the parquet is demolished. Do the"},{"t":2636,"text":"public parquets and other parking lots in the city have"},{"t":2640,"text":"the capacity to absorb. That loss. I think that might"},{"t":2645,"text":"be a question for Mr. Kenny. Mr. Kenny, are you"},{"t":2647,"text":"with us still. I guess could the question, please be"},{"t":2656,"text":"repeated. Go ahead, Councillor him. Do you, uh, other parking"},{"t":2659,"text":"lots and city parcades, um, have the capacity to absorb"},{"t":2663,"text":"the loss of the, uh, four story parque. Um, through"},{"t":2669,"text":"the mayor. So, um, the parking review that was completed,"},{"t":2672,"text":"um, found that within a two block radius of the,"},{"t":2676,"text":"um, the, the site, um, that there was sufficient capacity"},{"t":2679,"text":"for, uh, other parked vehicles to relocate to either City"},{"t":2682,"text":"parquets or other private parcades, um, I believe at the"},{"t":2686,"text":"report had suggested just at the peak hour, um, 15"},{"t":2690,"text":"vehicles may have to relocate outside of that two block"},{"t":2694,"text":"radius. Would there be any, uh, changes, um, or would"},{"t":2701,"text":"stuff have to examine, uh, on street. Parking spot rotation"},{"t":2708,"text":"time intervals. Does that make sense in order to accommodate"},{"t":2711,"text":"that peak. Um, so the, the, the report that was"},{"t":2716,"text":"submitted to us by the third party, um, had shown,"},{"t":2719,"text":"um, just under existing conditions, um, then through our regular"},{"t":2723,"text":"operations, we're constantly looking at, um, say parking demand usage,"},{"t":2727,"text":"uh, where we provide on street parking and make adjustments."},{"t":2730,"text":"Um, so, um, if this project were approved, um, just"},{"t":2735,"text":"given the scale of its own frontages and locations, we'd"},{"t":2739,"text":"likely be looking at, um, parking demand on street after"},{"t":2742,"text":"and making adjustments, um, but that would be similar to"},{"t":2744,"text":"say other developments that would occur in the downtown. Thanks."},{"t":2749,"text":"And then last question is, uh, the, uh, Magnolia hotel"},{"t":2753,"text":"had written with concerns about the loss of parking. Um,"},{"t":2757,"text":"and I wonder, do you know if they or any"},{"t":2759,"text":"other businesses have preexisting parking arrangements with the current parque"},{"t":2764,"text":"there, um, that would be impacted. Mr. Kitty. Through the"},{"t":2773,"text":"mayor, uh, more not aware of any, um, specific arrangements"},{"t":2777,"text":"that are made, noting that we would anticipate, again, nearby"},{"t":2780,"text":"businesses may use that parquet as it's available. Yeah. Okay."},{"t":2783,"text":"Thank you very much. Thank you. Let us go back"},{"t":2786,"text":"to Councillor Caradona. Thanks Mayor and through you. Thank you"},{"t":2792,"text":"for the presentation. I wanted to ask some questions about"},{"t":2797,"text":"St. Andrews and the proximity of all of that descent."},{"t":2800,"text":"Andrews, if we can bring up, I don't know, one"},{"t":2801,"text":"of the slides that shows. Maybe one of the ones"},{"t":2806,"text":"that shows the current arrangement. I first want to know"},{"t":2808,"text":"how close is the current parquet? Like, yeah, that one"},{"t":2812,"text":"on the left. It looks like two metres to me."},{"t":2816,"text":"Do we have a sense of how close to parquet"},{"t":2818,"text":"is to St. Andrews right now. Through the mayor, your"},{"t":2822,"text":"estimate is close. I believe it's about a metre and"},{"t":2824,"text":"a half. A metre and a half. Okay. Um, I"},{"t":2829,"text":"also want to just confirm, and I think it's come"},{"t":2830,"text":"up. I really wanted to be crystal clear because the"},{"t":2833,"text":"confusion about it in the community. Is this current. Parque"},{"t":2837,"text":"privately owned? And does the City Victoria have any stake"},{"t":2839,"text":"in it? Mr. Patenzo? Through the mayor. Yes. This is"},{"t":2842,"text":"a privately owned parquet. The city does not have an"},{"t":2846,"text":"interest in the parquet or its management or administration. Okay."},{"t":2850,"text":"And so if this proposal were to be declined, would"},{"t":2857,"text":"the proponents still have the right to demolish this building,"},{"t":2861,"text":"assuming they met the rules and regulations of the city."},{"t":2865,"text":"Through the mayor, yes, currently permitted uses on site include"},{"t":2869,"text":"residential up to a density of 3. 9 to one"},{"t":2872,"text":"FSR, which would generally equate to about a seven -"},{"t":2875,"text":"story building. And, um, that would be fully permissible under"},{"t":2880,"text":"its current zoning. So just to clarify, we have no"},{"t":2882,"text":"authority to prevent the demolition of this parquet. So through"},{"t":2887,"text":"the mayor council's consideration is relative to the policies for"},{"t":2892,"text":"what is being proposed and not, um, uh, whether or"},{"t":2896,"text":"not a parquet should be demolished. And what is the"},{"t":2900,"text":"closest city - owned parcades to this park aid. And"},{"t":2905,"text":"how far are they. Mr. Patenza, or would that be"},{"t":2909,"text":"a Mr. Kenney question? Through the mayor, I can sort"},{"t":2914,"text":"of provide a guess. Um, and I could take the"},{"t":2917,"text":"measurements here, but the parquet at the library, the parqueade"},{"t":2922,"text":"on, where's the other one? And on View Street as"},{"t":2927,"text":"well, and those might be the closest parkades. I would"},{"t":2931,"text":"think the library parquet on Broughton would be the closest."},{"t":2936,"text":"The library on Brown. Yeah, I, as I often do,"},{"t":2942,"text":"I look at the, uh, the parquet app, not the"},{"t":2945,"text":"City app, but the other one. And right now it"},{"t":2947,"text":"shows brown street entrance. Has 35 percent availability. In browning"},{"t":2954,"text":"street entrance has 40 percent availability Do we have any"},{"t":2957,"text":"data on whether or not that's roughly normal and to"},{"t":2961,"text":"be expected on. A weekday. In terms of demands in"},{"t":2965,"text":"our perk aids. I rarely see them full. Centennials, the"},{"t":2969,"text":"only one that regularly sometimes gets towards full. I see,"},{"t":2973,"text":"Ms. Thompson leading in. Is that something you can answer?"},{"t":2975,"text":"Um, through the mayor. So what I can say is"},{"t":2977,"text":"that the brown parquet is the one where we have"},{"t":2979,"text":"the most capacity, meaning that it is the least full"},{"t":2983,"text":"of all of them. Uh, it's rare that it fills"},{"t":2985,"text":"up. Um, barring events happening at the Royal Theatre, for"},{"t":2990,"text":"example, that's when it gets busier, uh, the busiest parcades"},{"t":2994,"text":"are the Yaet Street Parquet and then also Centennial Square"},{"t":2996,"text":"here. Thank you for that. So this is a bit"},{"t":2999,"text":"of an awkward question to ask through the mayor, but"},{"t":3002,"text":"what the city stand to gain materially if there was"},{"t":3005,"text":"fewer private parcades that we're competing with. Uh, not sure"},{"t":3011,"text":"that that is an appropriate question for any of our"},{"t":3013,"text":"staff to lean into. Well, let me phrase it differently"},{"t":3017,"text":"because that's maybe a bit crudely stated. But what we"},{"t":3019,"text":"expect there to be more business in terms of vehicles"},{"t":3023,"text":"going into city - owned parcades if this parquet were"},{"t":3026,"text":"to disappear. The more politely praised, the question is the"},{"t":3030,"text":"same, and I'm not sure that that would be appropriate"},{"t":3032,"text":"for staff to conjecture. I think it's legitimate to ask"},{"t":3037,"text":"if this would be expected to increase usage of city"},{"t":3041,"text":"- owned parquets. That seems like a legitimate question given"},{"t":3043,"text":"that we're potentially losing a very large private park aid."},{"t":3046,"text":"Mr. Pachano, is it a material consideration when considering a"},{"t":3049,"text":"land the use application to analyse the Financial Benefit to"},{"t":3053,"text":"the City in alternatives. So through the mayor, I would"},{"t":3056,"text":"suggest that it isn't. Staff typically would speak to the"},{"t":3059,"text":"relevant policies that we assess to determine the supportability of"},{"t":3063,"text":"an application or not, and whether there's any material gains"},{"t":3066,"text":"to other city assets. It's not part of our analysis."},{"t":3069,"text":"Okay, I'll accept that, but what I'm getting at here"},{"t":3072,"text":"is that there has been consternation about the loss of"},{"t":3075,"text":"a parquet, which seems reasonable. And so what I'm trying"},{"t":3078,"text":"to do is understand how the totality of this decision"},{"t":3082,"text":"would impact transportation downtown. And so what I'm attempting to"},{"t":3088,"text":"establish here is that there are several city - owned"},{"t":3091,"text":"parcades within blocks of this one. They seem to have"},{"t":3094,"text":"capacity on an average Thursday afternoon. Um, and so I'm"},{"t":3101,"text":"trying to understand globally what the impacts would be here."},{"t":3104,"text":"So if you want to give any high - level"},{"t":3106,"text":"comments on that, then I do think our material. Mr."},{"t":3110,"text":"Patenzu? Yeah, it's through the mayor. What I would suggest"},{"t":3113,"text":"is that the impacts of council's decision may impact the"},{"t":3119,"text":"availability of privately owned parking in the city. The analysis"},{"t":3124,"text":"in terms of parking relative to this application are based"},{"t":3127,"text":"solely on the provision of parking for what is being"},{"t":3131,"text":"proposed. And so while those impacts are, uh, an outcome"},{"t":3136,"text":"of a decision, they are not material to the decision"},{"t":3138,"text":"before council today. Okay. In terms of the plaza itself,"},{"t":3141,"text":"can we have a look at one of the renderings"},{"t":3143,"text":"of the plaza. Maybe from the streetscape."},{"t":3157,"text":"Yeah, that I think that'll do. So a couple of"},{"t":3159,"text":"questions about that. First, and there was some shadow studies"},{"t":3163,"text":"that went by kind of quickly, but it seems like"},{"t":3165,"text":"this would have a relatively good South facing exposure. And"},{"t":3169,"text":"so I just want to get a sense of how"},{"t":3170,"text":"well - lit this plaza would be during the day."},{"t":3176,"text":"Yes. Through the mayor, thank you for the question. So"},{"t":3179,"text":"typically where we would be locating plazas is on the"},{"t":3183,"text":"South aspect of a proposal or of a parcel. In"},{"t":3187,"text":"distance, the main function of this plaza is beyond providing"},{"t":3191,"text":"public space is to improve that relationship to the St."},{"t":3196,"text":"Andrews Church adjacent. In terms of light access, um, the"},{"t":3200,"text":"shadow analysis showed that at Summer Solstice and, uh, at"},{"t":3205,"text":"the Equinox is that there is ample light access during"},{"t":3208,"text":"midday. Um, this area of the city, uh, you know,"},{"t":3212,"text":"it does have buildings and it does C shade later"},{"t":3215,"text":"in the day. But, um, currently there is only a,"},{"t":3219,"text":"a one and a half story building to the South,"},{"t":3221,"text":"which provides lots of light access to the plaza. Thanks."},{"t":3224,"text":"And through the mayor, what are the SEPT principals that"},{"t":3227,"text":"have been applied here to this, to this plaza that"},{"t":3231,"text":"are maybe, maybe are relevant in material to our decision?"},{"t":3235,"text":"Yes. Through the mayor. So, um, with all public spaces,"},{"t":3238,"text":"the typically a concern around septair issues, uh, in order"},{"t":3241,"text":"to address that, the applicant has proposed a commercial retail"},{"t":3245,"text":"unit fronting onto the plaza. Um, uh, it has been"},{"t":3249,"text":"noted that, you know, parkades also after, offer, uh, step"},{"t":3254,"text":"10 issues, um, the management of that parquet has been,"},{"t":3258,"text":"you know, sufficient to, um, mitigate some of those concerns."},{"t":3261,"text":"In this instance, that sort of, um, passive surveillance of"},{"t":3264,"text":"the plaza, the activation of its edge, uh, and sort"},{"t":3267,"text":"of how it relates to both the BUL form of"},{"t":3270,"text":"what's being proposed. The street in general and the pedestrian"},{"t":3273,"text":"areas of broad street, all sort of address those septead"},{"t":3277,"text":"concerns. Okay. And, and just drilling down on that a"},{"t":3280,"text":"bit, the written by urbanists about what the difference is"},{"t":3286,"text":"between successful and unsuccessful plazas. And I know that staff"},{"t":3289,"text":"have thought a lot about this too. And, and in"},{"t":3291,"text":"this city, we have examples of both. And one that's"},{"t":3293,"text":"often brought up as an unsuccessful plaza is that sunk"},{"t":3296,"text":"in one on Blanchard and Pandora, then no one ever"},{"t":3299,"text":"seems to patronize. I won't get into centennial square. And"},{"t":3303,"text":"then other plazas are quite successful. So what, to your"},{"t":3307,"text":"minds is the difference between a successful plaza, which I"},{"t":3311,"text":"would define as safe and activated. And versus an unsuccessful"},{"t":3313,"text":"plaza. And what features do you see here that suggest"},{"t":3316,"text":"it would be successful? Mr. Downsell? Sure. Thank you. Through"},{"t":3319,"text":"the mayor, uh, I think some of the considerations that"},{"t":3322,"text":"you've brought up are, are very relevant. And, um, typically"},{"t":3326,"text":"what we look for in terms of what makes successful"},{"t":3329,"text":"versus not successful public spaces is what occurs along their"},{"t":3333,"text":"edges. And so in this instance, one of the edges"},{"t":3336,"text":"here is significantly activated. It also has the benefit of"},{"t":3340,"text":"overlook from the, um, uh, private outdoor spaces on the"},{"t":3345,"text":"building adjacent. And so from the 7 story portion of"},{"t":3349,"text":"the building and that entire middle section of the building,"},{"t":3352,"text":"which is the private, um, outdoor amenity space for the"},{"t":3356,"text":"residents. So that's all a passive surveillance sort of, uh,"},{"t":3361,"text":"approach, um, to making the plaza successful. Other attributes include"},{"t":3366,"text":"seating, shade, um, activation from, uh, adjacent CRUs being at"},{"t":3372,"text":"grade is an important attribute as well. And similarly linking"},{"t":3376,"text":"this plaza to other successful pedestrianized areas, uh, provides an"},{"t":3381,"text":"opportunity for it to be successful as well. And as"},{"t":3383,"text":"we know, broad street has been closed to vehicle traffic."},{"t":3387,"text":"And it's a rather active public area. And, um, you"},{"t":3391,"text":"know, making this more of a contiguous area of pedestrian"},{"t":3395,"text":"activity, uh, all contributes to its success. Thanks very much."},{"t":3399,"text":"Last question for me, it looks like 37 percent of"},{"t":3401,"text":"the units would be family sized, which I believe exceeds"},{"t":3405,"text":"our family housing regulation. Uh, and there's 242 rentals. So"},{"t":3409,"text":"conservatively, if this building were fully tenanted up, what is"},{"t":3414,"text":"the approximate number of people that would be living in"},{"t":3416,"text":"this building? Mr. Pacha. Through the mayor. I mean, we'd"},{"t":3424,"text":"be looking at about, um, potentially 500 odd people. Thanks"},{"t":3429,"text":"to them for the questions. Councillor Thompson. Thank you Mayor."},{"t":3438,"text":"And through you, thanks very much to staff. Um, this"},{"t":3442,"text":"is an important decision coming to us and, uh, appreciate"},{"t":3446,"text":"you presenting the pros and cons of it for Oldwn"},{"t":3450,"text":"and for local businesses and residents. Appreciate the thoughtful analysis"},{"t":3455,"text":"and report on the fact that it, as Steph mentioned,"},{"t":3458,"text":"it took a year to get, uh, to us already,"},{"t":3461,"text":"uh, with the work being done. Had a couple of"},{"t":3463,"text":"questions about height and about parking. So on the height,"},{"t":3469,"text":"um, uh, just as background, sometimes in communications aimed to"},{"t":3475,"text":"the public, not, not by city staff, not city communications,"},{"t":3480,"text":"but, but other, other folks writing in social media and"},{"t":3483,"text":"the letters to the editor. They seem to imply that"},{"t":3490,"text":"the numbers in plans and policies are more like the"},{"t":3493,"text":"numbers in a regulation. I'm just wondering if staff can"},{"t":3496,"text":"explain for the public, uh, the different effects of numbers."},{"t":3502,"text":"On one hand plans and policies. And on the other"},{"t":3506,"text":"regulations. Mr. Patanzo. So through the mayor, thank you for"},{"t":3511,"text":"that question. I think that is an important distinction. Um,"},{"t":3515,"text":"typically plans and policies insofar as the OCP and the"},{"t":3519,"text":"design guidelines speak to General figures. And so there's a,"},{"t":3524,"text":"you know, a general intent that the heights within Oldwn"},{"t":3528,"text":"are remain at around five stories or 15 metres. And"},{"t":3533,"text":"that's generally what staff are working to assess applications. But"},{"t":3537,"text":"that doesn't mean that buildings that are slightly higher than"},{"t":3540,"text":"that or slightly lower would be automatically, uh, recommended for"},{"t":3544,"text":"decline. There is a full suite of policies that, uh,"},{"t":3548,"text":"form part of the analysis, um, and that's the key"},{"t":3552,"text":"differentiating factor between policy and regulations. Regulations on the other"},{"t":3556,"text":"hand reside within the zones. And those are hard and"},{"t":3561,"text":"fast numbers that if there are discrepancies with those, they"},{"t":3565,"text":"result in, uh, variances that need to be dealt with"},{"t":3569,"text":"and assess that way. But in terms of, um, what"},{"t":3573,"text":"specify within the OCP and design guidelines, we're speaking to"},{"t":3576,"text":"Generalities. And the plus and minus in all of that"},{"t":3579,"text":"in terms of staff's assessment. Yeah. Thank you. Some pros"},{"t":3584,"text":"and cons, I guess. There's, um, if anyone in the"},{"t":3587,"text":"public is interested, then litigation on this recently in Victoria,"},{"t":3591,"text":"uh, where I think that the lawyer for the lawyer,"},{"t":3596,"text":"uh, one of the lawyers was confused. The court was"},{"t":3598,"text":"not confused about the difference between these numbers. Um, on"},{"t":3602,"text":"parking. So I know that city staff are aware of"},{"t":3605,"text":"the need for nearby businesses to have parking for, for"},{"t":3609,"text":"both workers and customers. But I'm wondering if we can"},{"t":3612,"text":"talk a little bit about the, uh, parquet that's on"},{"t":3615,"text":"the site right now. I appreciate that you've already addressed"},{"t":3620,"text":"some aspects of it. Um, there was some discussion about,"},{"t":3624,"text":"you know, can the person, can the owner demolish it?"},{"t":3628,"text":"And I guess that would require a permit. But can"},{"t":3631,"text":"short of demolishing it, um, can the City even force"},{"t":3637,"text":"an owner to keep the parquet operating? Or can they"},{"t":3639,"text":"just say we're closed. Through the mayor, this is a"},{"t":3646,"text":"private business. It would operate under the conditions of a"},{"t":3649,"text":"private business and they can decide and elect to close"},{"t":3652,"text":"or open as they so choose. Okay. Thanks. Um, there's"},{"t":3656,"text":"been some, uh, questions about nearby city owned parking. I'm"},{"t":3661,"text":"just wondering if perhaps engineering staff can talk about the"},{"t":3667,"text":"direction that council gave some time ago to explore options"},{"t":3672,"text":"for parquets more on the sort of edge of downtown."},{"t":3677,"text":"And if that's sort of still in the works and"},{"t":3679,"text":"where that's at. Thank you, Mr. Doyle. You may recall"},{"t":3683,"text":"some time ago that council provided direction to explore parquet"},{"t":3687,"text":"on the north end of the downtown. Can you speak"},{"t":3689,"text":"any to any information on that? It's more current. Through"},{"t":3694,"text":"the mayor, uh, first step would be a financial feasibility"},{"t":3698,"text":"study. Needs to be a sort of considered for future."},{"t":3702,"text":"It's not something that we have immediately taken on in"},{"t":3705,"text":"our, in our workload, uh, but, uh, considering it amongst"},{"t":3707,"text":"all COR broader CURBUSA throughout, throughout Downtown. Thank you for"},{"t":3711,"text":"that. Councillor, did you hear that? I did. Thank you"},{"t":3715,"text":"very much. Um, yeah, apart from City Parkades, if you,"},{"t":3720,"text":"if, uh, if any of the members of the public,"},{"t":3722,"text":"you know, just go into Google Maps and search for"},{"t":3725,"text":"parking, you'll see a lot of things in that area."},{"t":3728,"text":"But, um, about, I think the base enter is one"},{"t":3733,"text":"short block away. How does, do we have any idea"},{"t":3739,"text":"how many metres away the base centre parking lot is"},{"t":3741,"text":"arcade, I should say. It's privately owned. Yes. Our stuff"},{"t":3748,"text":"are actually doing mad calculations, but you're at councillor that"},{"t":3751,"text":"entrance is off of Vue Street. So it would seem"},{"t":3753,"text":"to be from an access perspective a bit further, but"},{"t":3755,"text":"you're right, it is only a block away as the"},{"t":3757,"text":"crow flies. But to accessing, it would be, I guess,"},{"t":3760,"text":"the equivalent of two blocks. There's still calculating. That's, I"},{"t":3764,"text":"guess, mirror, that would be two blocks of driving, but"},{"t":3766,"text":"one block of walking. Cause I think you can get"},{"t":3768,"text":"out the, uh, the west side of the, um, base"},{"t":3773,"text":"centre. Well, while, while Stafford looking at that, and I"},{"t":3776,"text":"don't need a precise number, uh, something approximate would be"},{"t":3779,"text":"great. Um, I note that there's also two Robbins parkades,"},{"t":3784,"text":"um, to the east and the west by about a"},{"t":3786,"text":"block. So if, if first Stafford just drawing a radius"},{"t":3791,"text":"circle, maybe they can advise on those two parcades as"},{"t":3794,"text":"well on roughly how far they are. With. Mr. Patazzo"},{"t":3798,"text":"has an approximation now for the, what's called the bay"},{"t":3800,"text":"parcade. I'm not sure if the others are there. Go"},{"t":3802,"text":"ahead, Mr. Tenzo. So to the Marriott, the Bay Parquet"},{"t":3806,"text":"would be about 300, approximately 300 metres away from this"},{"t":3810,"text":"subject property. That would be the entrance to the vehicle"},{"t":3812,"text":"entrance. That's correct. Yes. Go ahead. Okay. And then the,"},{"t":3816,"text":"the walking entrance to the bay street plaza or the"},{"t":3819,"text":"base treat mall. Or the bay mall. Yeah, that would"},{"t":3823,"text":"be a block shorter because you can walk into it"},{"t":3825,"text":"from the fourth street side. Okay. Um, and then the,"},{"t":3830,"text":"the others that I mentioned, the Robbins Parquet that's about"},{"t":3832,"text":"a block to the west and the Robins Parquet that's"},{"t":3835,"text":"about a block to the east. Yes. Stafford checking. I"},{"t":3841,"text":"believe they're mapping the local mouse. Oh, that's a. Smart"},{"t":3847,"text":"way to do them. Yep. They're mapping the local parquets."},{"t":3871,"text":"So through the mayor, the Robins Parquet is about 130"},{"t":3874,"text":"metres away. 130 metres. Thank you. Councillor. Okay. Is that"},{"t":3878,"text":"the one that's to the east or the one that's"},{"t":3880,"text":"to the west? Sorry. Through the mayor, that's the one"},{"t":3882,"text":"to the east. Okay. Um, okay. I don't need to"},{"t":3887,"text":"know the distance. So the other one. It's about the"},{"t":3888,"text":"same if you look on, on the map. Um, the"},{"t":3891,"text":"one to the west, um, down by Langley Street. I"},{"t":3896,"text":"know that the city provides about 70, 000 on street"},{"t":3901,"text":"parking spaces. Those are obviously not all downtown. Do we"},{"t":3905,"text":"know the numbers of on street parking spaces that are"},{"t":3908,"text":"downtown. I don't think that's a Mr. Ratanzo question. Actually,"},{"t":3915,"text":"interestingly, Ms. Thompson is checking. That's because parking technically comes"},{"t":3922,"text":"under the finance department. Yep. She's madly typing."},{"t":3936,"text":"Councillor, do you have another question that you could ask?"},{"t":3938,"text":"Well, unfortunately that is my last one. And we could"},{"t":3943,"text":"move on to someone else and I can get that"},{"t":3945,"text":"answer later. That's fine. Okay. We'll do that as we"},{"t":3948,"text":"did, uh, earlier with some other items. Uh, so if"},{"t":3951,"text":"you included then, I will go on then to Councillor"},{"t":3953,"text":"Lohn. Thank you. And through you mayor. Um, I'm just"},{"t":3958,"text":"curious about the state of the decap plans and the"},{"t":3962,"text":"heritage review for Oldwn. Cause that is in Flux right"},{"t":3967,"text":"now. Are we imagining that things would change to this"},{"t":3972,"text":"kind of height and density. Justin, I think this might"},{"t":3977,"text":"be for you. Through the mayor. We're still in the"},{"t":3986,"text":"early stages of scoping out that work. Um, so it'd"},{"t":3988,"text":"be premature at this stage to speculate on what the"},{"t":3992,"text":"outcomes might be because that will be a lengthy process"},{"t":3995,"text":"involving a lot of engagement and research and analysis. And"},{"t":4000,"text":"we'll be bringing forward even a report scoping out the"},{"t":4002,"text":"approach for council's consideration later this year. Okay. Thank you"},{"t":4009,"text":"for that. Um, would someone be able to through you"},{"t":4013,"text":"mayor, I'm just curious about where we are at in"},{"t":4018,"text":"our housing targets for, for rentals, purpose - built rentals."},{"t":4023,"text":"And if someone needs a second to look that up,"},{"t":4025,"text":"I can move on to my next questions. Who would"},{"t":4030,"text":"be able to? Are we exceeding or are we falling"},{"t":4034,"text":"behind. In our rental targets? Do we know that how"},{"t":4038,"text":"we're faring in the overall? I know that we've been"},{"t":4040,"text":"exceeding them in the first couple of years. But how"},{"t":4042,"text":"are we on track to continue that trend or have"},{"t":4044,"text":"we leveled off. Mr. Johnson. Uh, through the mayor, we"},{"t":4049,"text":"may take a minute just to check in with my"},{"t":4051,"text":"staff in the housing, um, division to get an update"},{"t":4055,"text":"on that, um, overall the city has been exceeding their"},{"t":4059,"text":"housing targets. Um, in recent, uh, with a recent reporting,"},{"t":4064,"text":"we have been exceeding our housing targets. Okay. Cancer. Um,"},{"t":4069,"text":"yeah, thanks for that. It's just specifically for rentals because"},{"t":4072,"text":"I'm just also curious if there was any conversation with"},{"t":4076,"text":"the proponent about doing a hotel on this site? Or"},{"t":4080,"text":"was it only focused on purpose - built rentals. Mr."},{"t":4084,"text":"Townsell? Yes, through the mayor. I do believe those conversations"},{"t":4089,"text":"were had. You know, it's always difficult conversation to suggest"},{"t":4093,"text":"something completely opposite to what's being proposed. Um, this applicant"},{"t":4097,"text":"does have a portfolio of what they typically propose and"},{"t":4100,"text":"purpose - built rental is their portfolio as opposed to"},{"t":4102,"text":"hotel. But, uh, with all applications, we seek to achieve"},{"t":4107,"text":"the broader city goals and always have those conversations. Okay."},{"t":4110,"text":"Thank you for that. Um, there was just a question"},{"t":4114,"text":"that came from, like some of the businesses in that"},{"t":4117,"text":"area, as has been mentioned, are concerned about parking and"},{"t":4121,"text":"also, um, Jeff Bray from the DVBA brought up the"},{"t":4126,"text":"ability to successfully fill all the government, the empty government"},{"t":4130,"text":"spaces. So he was suggesting there's 150 to 200, 000"},{"t":4137,"text":"empty square feet. I would just like some confirmation on"},{"t":4141,"text":"that vacant office space, what our plans for that are"},{"t":4147,"text":"and whether losing 300 parking spots at this park head"},{"t":4151,"text":"would affect our ability to plan on how we're going"},{"t":4156,"text":"to fill that vacant office space, government space. For Johnstown,"},{"t":4161,"text":"I'm not sure that that's something that we've turned our"},{"t":4163,"text":"minds to, but if you have any preliminary comments, you're"},{"t":4166,"text":"welcome to offer them. Through the mayor. Um, yeah, no,"},{"t":4171,"text":"at this stage, I think, uh, I wouldn't have anything"},{"t":4174,"text":"to offer in terms of how we anticipate dealing with"},{"t":4177,"text":"that situation. But, um, yeah, it's definitely something that we"},{"t":4183,"text":"are aware of and monitoring and turning our minds too."},{"t":4187,"text":"Okay. Um. And another, um, one of my colleagues asked"},{"t":4194,"text":"about this, but the new parquet that was to serve"},{"t":4200,"text":"downtown, we're waiting on the financial feasibility study. So how"},{"t":4207,"text":"do we. I know this is difficult to answer, but"},{"t":4210,"text":"are we, you know, years away from that materializing or"},{"t":4214,"text":"is there a way to say, you know, we're losing"},{"t":4217,"text":"this parquet, but then that parquet is coming and we"},{"t":4220,"text":"can somehow align that. Is that a possibility? Mr. Doyle,"},{"t":4225,"text":"do you have any comments on that in a preliminary"},{"t":4227,"text":"fashion? Through the mayor, would suggest it's on the magnitude"},{"t":4232,"text":"of years. Rather on the magnitude of years rather than"},{"t":4236,"text":"months. Just want to share some further data that's been"},{"t":4239,"text":"identified through my colleagues. So this Downtown Victoria has more"},{"t":4243,"text":"than 7, 300 total parking spots. So this is broken"},{"t":4247,"text":"down about 1900 on street spaces. Uh, 1900 spaces across"},{"t":4251,"text":"the City of Victoria Parque's. Uh, parking spots across private"},{"t":4256,"text":"parking lots and parkades. So while the loss of this,"},{"t":4261,"text":"this private parquet is a good number in the ground"},{"t":4265,"text":"scheme of the sites acrosswn. Don't see an immediate unmanageable"},{"t":4270,"text":"impact. Okay. Thank you for that. Okay. I think that's"},{"t":4273,"text":"it for me for now. Thanks, Mayor. Councillor Dell. The"},{"t":4277,"text":"first time. Thank you so much through the mayor. Can"},{"t":4283,"text":"you confirm this building is consistent with the OCP. What's"},{"t":4288,"text":"your penitencil? So through the mayor on balance, that has"},{"t":4290,"text":"been the, uh, conclusion staff has reached. Okay. Thank you."},{"t":4295,"text":"Um, through the mayor, my understanding is just quite drastically"},{"t":4299,"text":"exceeds our family housing policy more than I've ever seen"},{"t":4304,"text":"in our term of council. So can you just mention"},{"t":4305,"text":"the family housing policy? Would you say it exceeds this"},{"t":4309,"text":"drastically exceeds this? How was that part of the discussions"},{"t":4312,"text":"of a priority? I see there's 24 three bedroom units,"},{"t":4315,"text":"which I've never seen in a rental project really. How"},{"t":4318,"text":"is that discussion with the applicant. Mr. Conselho. So through"},{"t":4322,"text":"the mayor, the applicant offered, um, uh, to exceed the"},{"t":4326,"text":"family housing policy. It wasn't so much part of a"},{"t":4328,"text":"negotiation or a, or a, uh, I think it's part"},{"t":4332,"text":"more in part and parcel of the, um, part of"},{"t":4336,"text":"their portfolio of what they like to put onto the"},{"t":4338,"text":"market. Um, it does exceed the family housing policy. I'm"},{"t":4341,"text":"not sure if I'd say it drastically exceeds, but it"},{"t":4343,"text":"is in excess of what's required under the family housing"},{"t":4346,"text":"housing policy. Okay. Thanks. Uh, my takeaway from the report"},{"t":4350,"text":"through the mayor was that this building in some ways"},{"t":4353,"text":"could be read as supporting heritage, particularly with, um, building"},{"t":4358,"text":"this plaza around one of our 11 designated heritage building."},{"t":4361,"text":"So we're kind of weighing that it's a little bit"},{"t":4363,"text":"tall, but it also opens up this space. So a"},{"t":4366,"text":"building I've actually never been in. I really, I think"},{"t":4369,"text":"you can't really enjoy this building like some of the"},{"t":4371,"text":"other ones because of how constrained it is. So is"},{"t":4373,"text":"it fair to say in some aspects of this proposal"},{"t":4377,"text":"support, Oldwn in the City's heritage. Mr. McDonnell. Through the"},{"t":4383,"text":"mayor, within the report, we speak to, uh, a number"},{"t":4386,"text":"of aspects that help to support the heritage character of"},{"t":4390,"text":"Oldwn. Some of those aspects include just the design and"},{"t":4394,"text":"composition of the building in terms of its built form,"},{"t":4397,"text":"its fenestration, structural bays. The materials, those aspects of the"},{"t":4401,"text":"proposal are consistent with what we would want to see"},{"t":4404,"text":"in terms of supporting heritage character. And then to your"},{"t":4408,"text":"point, um, it advances the landmark heritage building policies by"},{"t":4413,"text":"creating a better interface between St. Andrews Church and the"},{"t":4418,"text":"public realm versus what is there now. So some aspects"},{"t":4421,"text":"of the heritage character, uh, of this area are improved"},{"t":4425,"text":"while others like the retention of a lower scale built"},{"t":4427,"text":"form are contradicted. Um, this, the housing part of this"},{"t":4435,"text":"is pretty straightforward and impressive. I guess my thought I"},{"t":4439,"text":"want to switch over to the parking and traffic. Are"},{"t":4444,"text":"there opportunities? You know, this is a very dense area"},{"t":4447,"text":"with businesses around it. One of the things that we've"},{"t":4449,"text":"seen in our time as of every single council is"},{"t":4452,"text":"a construction process creates challenges. You know, you're blocking off"},{"t":4455,"text":"roads. Are there opportunities to improve the construction process for"},{"t":4459,"text":"nearby businesses in terms of like, you know, limiting the"},{"t":4463,"text":"amount of space that's being taken up. Like for example,"},{"t":4465,"text":"in the telesocia building, it's been a lane for a"},{"t":4467,"text":"couple of years causing chaos. Has that been a discussion"},{"t":4470,"text":"with the applicant of ways to perhaps build a building"},{"t":4473,"text":"like this without, you know, completely blocking off half of"},{"t":4476,"text":"Gordon Street or, or, or really. Negatively impacting those businesses?"},{"t":4481,"text":"Or is it just pretty much a standard process that"},{"t":4483,"text":"you just have to suck it up for X amount"},{"t":4485,"text":"of years? Mr. Pretenso? So through the mayor, I, um,"},{"t":4489,"text":"this isn't part of, um, the land use application review,"},{"t":4492,"text":"but I am aware that there are, um, movements within"},{"t":4496,"text":"the City to try to make that less impactful. I"},{"t":4500,"text":"don't know if transportation or engineering could speak further to"},{"t":4502,"text":"that, um, you know, typically once it's under construction and"},{"t":4506,"text":"its impact on the public road infrastructure, uh, falls under"},{"t":4509,"text":"the transportation and engineering remit. Mr. Doyle, do you have"},{"t":4513,"text":"anything that you'd like to add. Through the mayor, Mr."},{"t":4516,"text":"Kenney's available to expand. Mr. Kenney, if you're still with"},{"t":4520,"text":"us, I wonder if you heard that question just about,"},{"t":4522,"text":"uh, anything that the city is currently contemplating or doing"},{"t":4526,"text":"to mitigate the impact of construction. Um, sure. Um, so"},{"t":4531,"text":"through the mirror, construction of, um, all aspects, you know,"},{"t":4535,"text":"whether that's private development, um, CDS, it's a third party"},{"t":4539,"text":"utilities, uh, we've reviewed those construction plans and issue street"},{"t":4543,"text":"occupancy permits. Um, for private development, uh, whether it's this"},{"t":4548,"text":"or other buildings, um, people pay for the usage of"},{"t":4553,"text":"city street for that construction. So one of the, one"},{"t":4557,"text":"of the tools that we have is by, um, by"},{"t":4561,"text":"pricing the use of, um, road space parking side block"},{"t":4565,"text":"space is encouraging people to keep sites, uh, their construction,"},{"t":4569,"text":"um, impacts as little as possible on a site such"},{"t":4572,"text":"as this with a public plaza, uh, because that's owned"},{"t":4575,"text":"by them. We'd be encouraging as much of that construction"},{"t":4578,"text":"activity actually from say that plaza space ourselves. Um, to"},{"t":4581,"text":"limit that impact on the street surrounding it. Um, while"},{"t":4585,"text":"we also modernize, continue to look at our processes. You"},{"t":4588,"text":"know, we are also contemplating in the future how we"},{"t":4591,"text":"might be able to come up with policies around, um,"},{"t":4594,"text":"around how our hoarding is, you know, so the fencing"},{"t":4596,"text":"around sights, um, what that looks like. We work with"},{"t":4600,"text":"businesses to provide ensuring, you know, as much as possible,"},{"t":4603,"text":"keeping good aesthetics, uh, where road closures or sidewalk closures"},{"t":4606,"text":"are required, you know, staying on top of them with"},{"t":4609,"text":"things like graffiti removal. But overall, you know, our street"},{"t":4613,"text":"occupancy program, which, um, brings the net revenue to the"},{"t":4616,"text":"city, but also helps to manage that public impact as"},{"t":4618,"text":"our main tool at this point to minimize, uh, public"},{"t":4620,"text":"disturbance. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Kenney. I"},{"t":4624,"text":"guess two more questions perhaps for you. Number one on"},{"t":4628,"text":"the parking, so you just mentioned that the applicant would"},{"t":4630,"text":"pay the city for use of the road space. Have"},{"t":4633,"text":"we ever considered in a project like this actually, um,"},{"t":4636,"text":"giving, you know, parking credits on the park Victoria app"},{"t":4639,"text":"to nearby businesses to say, Hey, you know what? You"},{"t":4641,"text":"get XML per day. You can give to your customers"},{"t":4644,"text":"given the, uh, the impacts on street parking. Or are"},{"t":4647,"text":"there any of those kind of conversations? Is number, question"},{"t":4650,"text":"number one. And number two, would staff consider looking at"},{"t":4653,"text":"the flow of traffic, like such as perhaps reopening broad"},{"t":4657,"text":"street, uh, just to make sure the bit more either"},{"t":4660,"text":"availability of street parking or availability for cars who are"},{"t":4663,"text":"kind of stuck in this construction zone on pretty tight"},{"t":4666,"text":"streets. I don't know if that means would mean government"},{"t":4668,"text":"street or broad is the one that comes to mind."},{"t":4671,"text":"Are those options on the table, uh, or that, is"},{"t":4674,"text":"that needed council direction. I think the first part of"},{"t":4677,"text":"that question is probably, um, as Thompson, then the second"},{"t":4679,"text":"part of that question is Mr. Kenney. So let's go"},{"t":4681,"text":"in that order, Thompson. Through the mayor. So yes, businesses"},{"t":4687,"text":"have been contacted us about the possibility for them to"},{"t":4690,"text":"basically purchase time for their, um, patrons. So law firms"},{"t":4697,"text":"and those types of things. For example. So we're exploring"},{"t":4699,"text":"how we can accommodate that. Um, so they would give"},{"t":4702,"text":"out essentially how that would work would be similarly to"},{"t":4705,"text":"how we did it at Christmas time when we offered"},{"t":4708,"text":"the joy code, um, and that gave a credit on"},{"t":4712,"text":"the person using the parking at that time. So, uh,"},{"t":4717,"text":"we haven't implemented that yet, but it's certainly part of"},{"t":4721,"text":"our ongoing conversations about what some businesses may be interested"},{"t":4725,"text":"in participating in. Thank you for that. Mr. Kenney, your"},{"t":4729,"text":"comments on traffic rerouting. Um, chat through the mayor. So,"},{"t":4735,"text":"you know, with when we have major disturbances or construction,"},{"t":4738,"text":"um, definitely things that we look at is what that"},{"t":4741,"text":"public impact is for, um, pedestrians, people driving, uh, people"},{"t":4746,"text":"cycling in transit. And we do make modifications in certain"},{"t":4749,"text":"locations. Um, sometimes that's, um, making changes to our traffic"},{"t":4754,"text":"signals, banding turns, um, allowing vehicle turns where they're currently"},{"t":4758,"text":"prohibited. Um, in this case, I think we would need"},{"t":4760,"text":"to see the specific construction plans of what the impacts"},{"t":4763,"text":"are and how the loading is. And then, uh, we"},{"t":4766,"text":"could investigate whether or not, um, say opening of streets"},{"t":4770,"text":"would be required. Um, just given the scale of these,"},{"t":4774,"text":"I think these would be ones that we may, you"},{"t":4775,"text":"know, depending on bringing to council's attention, depending on the"},{"t":4778,"text":"duration. So things like government street, if it was needed"},{"t":4781,"text":"for a few days, uh, to facilitate specific activity. That"},{"t":4785,"text":"might be something we just look at moving forward as"},{"t":4787,"text":"engineering department versus say a few years. Um, but overall,"},{"t":4792,"text":"um, we are constantly looking at ways to keep vehicle"},{"t":4795,"text":"and pedestrian and cyclist circulation open and something we would"},{"t":4799,"text":"take into consideration. But this project. Thank you. Okay. Just"},{"t":4802,"text":"maybe as a quick follow up. So in terms of"},{"t":4804,"text":"broad street specifically, which is pretty much right across the"},{"t":4807,"text":"street from this plaza. Is that something that would need"},{"t":4811,"text":"council direction? I don't know if it's a good idea"},{"t":4813,"text":"or not, but I just know there are, there is"},{"t":4815,"text":"street parking spaces available there that the local pistols do"},{"t":4818,"text":"use for that kind of quick turnover. Is that something"},{"t":4820,"text":"council direction is needed to explore? Or is that something"},{"t":4823,"text":"staff have authority to explore and consider on their own."},{"t":4826,"text":"Mr. Kenny. Uh, through the mayor, I believe currently staff"},{"t":4830,"text":"do have the authority to say reopen that's to reopen"},{"t":4835,"text":"a street such as that. Um, though, with council having"},{"t":4837,"text":"the ultimate authority to say, you know, provide direction or"},{"t":4842,"text":"council motion, um, either to support or, you know, disagree"},{"t":4845,"text":"with the staff's recommendation. Um, Broad Street, um, you know,"},{"t":4849,"text":"if this were happening, it's one that we, we could"},{"t":4851,"text":"look at noting the other complexities with broad street with"},{"t":4855,"text":"the sidewalk and patios and other uses. Um, but something"},{"t":4859,"text":"we'd be looking at. If there were impacts, um, say"},{"t":4863,"text":"I'm broken that required extensive closures or other changes. Okay."},{"t":4867,"text":"That's it for me. Thank you. Uh, Councillor Kim and"},{"t":4870,"text":"Councillor Gardner have both asked to ask a second question,"},{"t":4873,"text":"but I'll go to Councillor Coleman first. Is the first"},{"t":4875,"text":"time speaking? Thank you. And through your worship. Let's just"},{"t":4880,"text":"get our nomenclature right. St. Andrews Cathedral is three blocks"},{"t":4885,"text":"away on Blanchard Street. This is, uh, and it's been"},{"t":4888,"text":"referenced to number of times. This is St Andrew's Church."},{"t":4891,"text":"They share the diagonal cross of, uh, St. Andrew, uh,"},{"t":4895,"text":"the soldier, but they have very different perspectives. And one"},{"t":4899,"text":"has a bishop. The cathedral. This one doesn't. So we're"},{"t":4903,"text":"talking about the impacts from the heritage perspective on St."},{"t":4907,"text":"Andrew's Church. The question I have is, if we had,"},{"t":4913,"text":"um, an application come forward with the same floor space"},{"t":4915,"text":"ratio of 5. 94 to one, but didn't have that"},{"t":4920,"text":"plaza. And the setback was the same as the parcade."},{"t":4925,"text":"What would the height be lowered to. Mr. Patenzo. So"},{"t":4930,"text":"through the mayor, I can provide an estimation of what"},{"t":4933,"text":"that would be. But I think you'd be in the"},{"t":4935,"text":"realm of about eight stories. Okay. Thank you. So then"},{"t":4940,"text":"as it crystallizes in our mind, is this really about"},{"t":4944,"text":"creating the breathing space for that heritage building that's there,"},{"t":4948,"text":"St. Andrews Church. And in order to do that, we're"},{"t":4952,"text":"adding height on the rest of the site. Mr. Bertanzo."},{"t":4959,"text":"So through the math, there'd be a number of considerations"},{"t":4962,"text":"for how the overall density has been arrived at. One"},{"t":4967,"text":"of them is, um, the ability to improve that relationship"},{"t":4971,"text":"to St. Andrew's Church. But another one is obviously going"},{"t":4974,"text":"to be, um, uh, whether or not the project is"},{"t":4977,"text":"financially feasible. Um, and with most development projects, the financial"},{"t":4981,"text":"feasibility is the primary consideration. Okay. Thank you. And earlier"},{"t":4986,"text":"you referenced the fact that there are ongoing discussions between"},{"t":4990,"text":"the applicant and the presbytery or the guiding mind of"},{"t":4997,"text":"St. Andrew's Church with respect to those three parking stalls,"},{"t":5001,"text":"do you know where that sits. That discussion is. So"},{"t":5004,"text":"through the mayor, the discussion has sort of been ongoing."},{"t":5008,"text":"It would benefit from some direction from counsel to more"},{"t":5011,"text":"formally coordinate that discussion. Um, uh, staff can provide some"},{"t":5016,"text":"wording. Should council wish to go that route. But at"},{"t":5019,"text":"present, there is no resolution. There are many details that"},{"t":5023,"text":"would need to be worked out such as access. And"},{"t":5026,"text":"if there's any costs involved or anything like that. But,"},{"t":5029,"text":"um, they're pretty preliminary at this stage, I would suggest"},{"t":5032,"text":"at those discussions are at. Thank you for that. It"},{"t":5035,"text":"was referenced earlier that we did get a letter yesterday"},{"t":5039,"text":"from the Presbytery. They did offer some wording. So maybe"},{"t":5044,"text":"I can share that with you later and see if"},{"t":5047,"text":"that can be incorporated in this. Thank you. Thank you"},{"t":5050,"text":"very much. Uh, we are getting very close to our"},{"t":5052,"text":"lunch break. So I'm going to go first to Councillor"},{"t":5054,"text":"Kim and then to Council Garder to see if we"},{"t":5055,"text":"can wrap up the questions. Nothing else Councillor Gardner? Quick"},{"t":5060,"text":"question about the plaza. We spoke of the sun. And"},{"t":5064,"text":"so what is the building the one and a half"},{"t":5065,"text":"story directly to the south and who owns it. And"},{"t":5069,"text":"the chance it might go up to five or 10"},{"t":5070,"text":"stories. Going forward. Mr. Patenzo. So through the mayor, the"},{"t":5075,"text":"St. Andrews Church actually owns that building. Okay. I believe"},{"t":5079,"text":"it might be operating as a daycare at present. Um,"},{"t":5082,"text":"but I'm not a hundred percent certain as that with"},{"t":5085,"text":"that. It's its own four for height right now. And"},{"t":5088,"text":"so is it's possible. So currently it is zoned to,"},{"t":5091,"text":"to go up to 15 metres and three FSR. So"},{"t":5095,"text":"that's generally around that five story limit. So it could"},{"t":5097,"text":"go five stories which would probably get rid of a"},{"t":5099,"text":"lot of the sunlight in the plaza. If the church"},{"t":5102,"text":"exercises that zoning opportunity. So through the mayor, that hasn't"},{"t":5106,"text":"been analysed. But, um, there is still, uh, sunlight available,"},{"t":5111,"text":"uh, I would believe at the summer solstice, uh, for"},{"t":5115,"text":"light access in the plaza, but it would significantly diminish"},{"t":5118,"text":"the access to. Thank you. I'd only go in June."},{"t":5120,"text":"Okay. Thank you. Thank you very much. Not seeing any"},{"t":5123,"text":"other questions, but it is in fact now noon. And"},{"t":5126,"text":"so rather than a proceeding with the motions, I'm going"},{"t":5129,"text":"to suggest that we take a break now when we"},{"t":5131,"text":"return, I will look for someone to move the staff"},{"t":5134,"text":"recommendation or I believe there is an alternate, but we'll"},{"t":5138,"text":"go to council for their preference. And then I suspect"},{"t":5140,"text":"there may be some, uh, potential amendments as well. So"},{"t":5143,"text":"I suggest that we would want to consider that all"},{"t":5145,"text":"at the same time. So folks, let us return at"},{"t":5148,"text":"1 p. m. and we'll resume with a motion to"},{"t":5151,"text":"council on this matter."},{"t":5166,"text":"For the multiple addresses at 617 through 635 Brotons, 620"},{"t":5170,"text":"through 630 Courtney and 909 through 919, that's hard to"},{"t":5175,"text":"say. The Gordon Street. We had, I think, exhausted most"},{"t":5179,"text":"of the questions, although I'm aware the couple more. And"},{"t":5181,"text":"before I go to questions from council, I'm actually going"},{"t":5184,"text":"to go to Mr. Johnstown, who wants to relate some"},{"t":5187,"text":"information that he had discovered in response to a question"},{"t":5191,"text":"that was asked earlier. Mr. Johnson, over to you. Thank"},{"t":5194,"text":"you and through you mayor. Just wanted to circle back"},{"t":5197,"text":"to the question about rental housing targets that was asked"},{"t":5201,"text":"earlier. So I was able to get some more detailed"},{"t":5205,"text":"information from our housing team. So we have a target,"},{"t":5210,"text":"an overall five - year target established by the province"},{"t":5213,"text":"for 4, 902 units to be completed by 2028. The"},{"t":5220,"text":"breakdown of Rental within that target is a city guideline"},{"t":5226,"text":"in our target is 3, 483 during that five -"},{"t":5230,"text":"year period. And so in terms of where we are"},{"t":5234,"text":"at to date, we have total rental completions. They're sitting"},{"t":5240,"text":"at 2, 224 rental homes. So those are constructed and"},{"t":5245,"text":"have received occupancy. In terms of permits issued, we have"},{"t":5250,"text":"approximately 3, 264 homes rental homes that have been approved,"},{"t":5257,"text":"some of which have been constructed. Others have not yet"},{"t":5259,"text":"been completed. And so, yeah, I would say that we"},{"t":5264,"text":"are on track for meeting that target of 3, 483"},{"t":5269,"text":"rental homes by 2028. I hope that's helpful. Great, thank"},{"t":5273,"text":"you very much for that. Before I look to someone"},{"t":5276,"text":"to move the Staff recommendation, are there any more questions?"},{"t":5280,"text":"Councillor Litton. Thank you to you, Mayor. Just one more"},{"t":5285,"text":"question. And it's to do with considering St. Andrews being"},{"t":5290,"text":"a landmark heritage building. How did the park aid get"},{"t":5294,"text":"built so close to it in the first place? Mr."},{"t":5298,"text":"Batazzo, do you know that? So Tooth the mayor, no,"},{"t":5301,"text":"I do not know that. And we've asked a similar"},{"t":5303,"text":"question, but we haven't reviewed how that occurred in the"},{"t":5306,"text":"first place. Do we know when there, do we know"},{"t":5310,"text":"when the oldwn guidelines were established. Like this wouldn't have"},{"t":5317,"text":"fit into the old town guidelines. Mr. President, clearly. So"},{"t":5325,"text":"just to clear for, are you asking whether the parquet"},{"t":5327,"text":"would have fit into the old time? Or this back"},{"t":5329,"text":"application? The parquet. The current, what's currently there, like how"},{"t":5335,"text":"my question is, how did that get approved? How did"},{"t":5337,"text":"that get built? It's a great question. I'm not sure"},{"t":5341,"text":"any of our stuff. Well, certainly none of them have"},{"t":5343,"text":"been here that long, but do they know that material?"},{"t":5346,"text":"Well, so through the mayor, just through a quick Google"},{"t":5348,"text":"search, it looks like it was completed in 1960, which"},{"t":5351,"text":"would predate the oldwn design guidelines. Okay, so. I don't"},{"t":5355,"text":"want to speculate here, but maybe that's the reason we"},{"t":5359,"text":"adopted the old Tom Owltown guidelines because this is clearly"},{"t":5363,"text":"not in sync with the heritage, the National Heritage Regulations,"},{"t":5368,"text":"sorry, I forget the term for that. Okay, we'll leave"},{"t":5372,"text":"it there. There you go. Some might argue that it"},{"t":5375,"text":"is a little art decoey. But. Through YMR, but it's"},{"t":5379,"text":"just how close it is. You know, it's unbelievable how"},{"t":5385,"text":"close it is. Well, we'll save that for the comments."},{"t":5388,"text":"Thank you. Another questions checking online. Nope. Does anyone wish"},{"t":5392,"text":"to move Staff recommendation? Councillor Dell appears to want to"},{"t":5395,"text":"move that. And Councillor Carried on his second name. Councillor"},{"t":5397,"text":"Dell, over to you, discuss started. Sure, thank you. I'm"},{"t":5403,"text":"going to support this project. When I first saw this"},{"t":5407,"text":"project, I'm not sure when a couple of months ago."},{"t":5411,"text":"An early kind of designs. You know, my immediate thought"},{"t":5414,"text":"was this is one of the most well - designed"},{"t":5416,"text":"buildings we've had the opportunity to approve this term. I"},{"t":5418,"text":"think there's a lot of really thoughtful consideration put into"},{"t":5422,"text":"the design of this building, which staff have showed the"},{"t":5425,"text":"massing and the massing was done in a really interesting"},{"t":5426,"text":"way with the various step downs and kind of treed"},{"t":5429,"text":"canopy on some of the lower podiums that I think"},{"t":5432,"text":"really fits the vision for what Oldwn and Downtown is."},{"t":5436,"text":"Like unique creative designs, that doesn't necessarily mean designs that"},{"t":5439,"text":"are from that 1920s or whatnot, but I think the"},{"t":5443,"text":"building is well designed. It fits. Most importantly for me,"},{"t":5447,"text":"this is consistent with the official Community Plan. Council pass"},{"t":5450,"text":"in OCP. The reason for passing an OCP is to"},{"t":5453,"text":"give housing builders some assurance that what they're proposing is"},{"t":5457,"text":"going to fit. It's a secured rental building, which fits"},{"t":5460,"text":"the OCP. It's got ground floor commercial and aliens with"},{"t":5464,"text":"the proposed to form a character. So we passed the"},{"t":5466,"text":"OCP at this council. So it seems wrong to go"},{"t":5470,"text":"back on a project that meets the OCP. I'm most"},{"t":5473,"text":"excited that this hits and exceeds the family housing policy."},{"t":5476,"text":"We've really been needing more two and three bedrooms. Um,"},{"t":5480,"text":"I know some folks are going to talk about the"},{"t":5481,"text":"heritage or what the look is. And I want to"},{"t":5483,"text":"share a story about my daughter's best friend. Right now"},{"t":5487,"text":"is living three kids in a one bedroom condo. Totally"},{"t":5490,"text":"normal. My daughter went over there, played the other day."},{"t":5492,"text":"This was a normal thing that families are dealing with"},{"t":5494,"text":"in the city. So as much as we might not"},{"t":5496,"text":"like the look of this or might be a story"},{"t":5498,"text":"too tall, I would encourage a lot of folks here"},{"t":5499,"text":"to think what three kids in a one bedroom condo."},{"t":5503,"text":"Is like. And what that's like for their quality of"},{"t":5504,"text":"life versus perhaps, uh, your view of one extra story"},{"t":5508,"text":"on a building. These three bedroom units are going to"},{"t":5510,"text":"be huge for people and let alone the two bedrooms."},{"t":5516,"text":"Um. In terms of the actual heritage, I think this"},{"t":5519,"text":"project in many ways supports heritage, the photo where it"},{"t":5522,"text":"shows the back of the church with the spiral, the"},{"t":5525,"text":"parquet is one of the most unappealing things I've ever"},{"t":5528,"text":"seen in the city. And I think this plaza is"},{"t":5530,"text":"really going to make this church beautiful. I think, I"},{"t":5532,"text":"think the design of this is intended to support Oldwn,"},{"t":5536,"text":"bring out the character of the church there, which I"},{"t":5539,"text":"think is underappreciated and allow people to sit with a"},{"t":5542,"text":"coffee and look at this beautiful little building. So I"},{"t":5544,"text":"think this adds to Oldtown. The height is really interesting."},{"t":5549,"text":"And I want to point out the Belmont building is"},{"t":5551,"text":"just down on the corner of government and morph, I"},{"t":5554,"text":"believe. It was built in 1912 and is three metre"},{"t":5558,"text":"shorter. Over a hundred years ago, we built a building"},{"t":5560,"text":"that's only three metre shorter. And here we are 100"},{"t":5562,"text":"years later, you know, concerned about the height of this"},{"t":5566,"text":"building. The Belmo build is one of the most beautiful"},{"t":5568,"text":"buildings in the city. It's always talked about how Iconic"},{"t":5571,"text":"it is in the inner harbour. So, uh, I think"},{"t":5573,"text":"we need to remember that three metres over 100 years"},{"t":5577,"text":"is not that much of a difference. The sovereign building"},{"t":5579,"text":"is on the same street, brown, just down the road."},{"t":5582,"text":"It's 34 metres. Uh, I think it's a nice building"},{"t":5585,"text":"in the downtown. So I'm not as concerned about the"},{"t":5587,"text":"height. I think staff and the proponent have done a"},{"t":5589,"text":"good job at mitigating the height. You know, I think"},{"t":5591,"text":"maybe earlier versions were taller. This one actually fits. My"},{"t":5595,"text":"concern is around the parking. Obviously the last of the"},{"t":5598,"text":"parque, a couple of things. As someone just mentioned, the"},{"t":5601,"text":"parquet is not heritage. If we're concerned about Oldtown, this"},{"t":5604,"text":"is the last thing that should be an oldwn. It's"},{"t":5606,"text":"a short parquet. It's at end of life. It's likely"},{"t":5609,"text":"going to come down anyway. So we either rip the"},{"t":5610,"text":"band - aid off now or do it in a"},{"t":5612,"text":"couple of years. And that's really never worked out for"},{"t":5614,"text":"the city. So I think the brown street parcade, the"},{"t":5619,"text":"public one is just, it's one block over, uh, there's"},{"t":5621,"text":"a lot of capacity in that parquet. The base centre"},{"t":5624,"text":"has a lot of capacity. Um, and even with the"},{"t":5627,"text":"loss of parking, we are adding 300 more people that"},{"t":5629,"text":"are going to be living there or more. So I"},{"t":5632,"text":"think, I think that's something to be managed. And I'm"},{"t":5634,"text":"pretty sure what staff said about working with the businesses"},{"t":5637,"text":"to be allow them to purchase parking on the app"},{"t":5638,"text":"for their clients. And I know I had a dentist"},{"t":5640,"text":"downtown. And when you went in there, he gave you"},{"t":5642,"text":"a free pass or some credits to a parquet. And"},{"t":5645,"text":"that just might have to be how we work for"},{"t":5646,"text":"the next little while. So overall, I think this is"},{"t":5649,"text":"a really thoughtful and beautiful building that is just an"},{"t":5652,"text":"absolute win for downtown on so many different ways. And"},{"t":5655,"text":"I think the last thought put into it. So I'm"},{"t":5657,"text":"very happy to support this. Thank you very much. Councillor"},{"t":5660,"text":"Caradona is the second. Thanks Mayor. This one is very"},{"t":5664,"text":"easy for me to support. And I think that there's"},{"t":5667,"text":"a lot to recommend itself. And I think beginning with"},{"t":5669,"text":"the Heritage Components here and starting with the plaza and"},{"t":5673,"text":"proximity to St. Andrews Church. I am not a member"},{"t":5676,"text":"of the Religious Community at that church, but I am"},{"t":5679,"text":"a member of the choir that practices there. And I"},{"t":5683,"text":"have been on and off for years. And I've spent"},{"t":5684,"text":"a lot of time in that church. And it's always"},{"t":5687,"text":"struck me as absurd that there is a parcade 1."},{"t":5692,"text":"5 metres away from it. I mean, talk about poor"},{"t":5694,"text":"urbanism. It's just unbelievable that the council of the day"},{"t":5697,"text":"in 1960 allowed that to happen. It just, just the"},{"t":5701,"text":"absolute worst design. One of the reasons I emphasized earlier"},{"t":5703,"text":"in the question period that this is a private parquet"},{"t":5706,"text":"and that the city does not have the authority to"},{"t":5709,"text":"prevent it from being demolished is simply to remind ourselves,"},{"t":5713,"text":"the public and council that we're not really here to"},{"t":5715,"text":"debate the future of the parquet. It's a private property"},{"t":5719,"text":"owner who has the right to do what they want"},{"t":5720,"text":"with it. And it sounds everything I've seen and heard"},{"t":5722,"text":"is that this thing is probably going to be demolished"},{"t":5725,"text":"regardless of what else gets built there. So we're not"},{"t":5727,"text":"having a debate about whether or not they're ought to"},{"t":5729,"text":"be a parquet. That chip is sailed. What we are"},{"t":5732,"text":"debating is what's going to replace it. And I can't"},{"t":5734,"text":"really think of a better project to replace it. It"},{"t":5738,"text":"will add 500 new people towntown. I think that we"},{"t":5742,"text":"cannot ignore that fact. The province in many ways is"},{"t":5745,"text":"given up on downtown. They're shedding real estate all the"},{"t":5748,"text":"time. Remote and hybrid work is probably not going away"},{"t":5752,"text":"thousands of people used to spend time downtown no longer"},{"t":5754,"text":"do. Part of our vision, collectivision as a city for"},{"t":5758,"text":"downtown Victoria is to bring more people there. Through housing,"},{"t":5761,"text":"through activation, through arts and culture. But also mainly through"},{"t":5765,"text":"housing. Those 500 people will shop at the shopwntown. They'll"},{"t":5769,"text":"go to the coffee shop. They'll buy clothes. They will"},{"t":5771,"text":"activate the streets. They will improve. The vibrancy of Oldtown."},{"t":5776,"text":"But I particularly like this plaza. And what I like"},{"t":5779,"text":"about it is I think that it's designed well. It'll"},{"t":5782,"text":"have good sunlight. Yes. There's no guarantee in the future"},{"t":5785,"text":"that another building to the South won't block some of"},{"t":5788,"text":"that light. Hopefully that doesn't happen. There's only so much"},{"t":5790,"text":"we can do about that. But having that mixed use"},{"t":5793,"text":"context there means it's likely to activate the space. The"},{"t":5797,"text":"septhed principles that are brought to bear are likely to"},{"t":5799,"text":"make it a safe space. And most importantly, it's going"},{"t":5801,"text":"to allow St. Andrews Church to breathe. And have a"},{"t":5804,"text":"bit of context there that makes it the centrepiece and"},{"t":5808,"text":"not a brutalist concrete parquet. Um, staff referenced something called"},{"t":5814,"text":"the Heritage Landscapes policy. If I wrote it down correctly,"},{"t":5817,"text":"or maybe I have the word slightly and correctly, which"},{"t":5819,"text":"is not, it's about the context of the heritage acid,"},{"t":5822,"text":"not the heritage acid itself, but the context in which"},{"t":5824,"text":"it exists. I think that the context here will allow"},{"t":5827,"text":"that heritage asset to be foreground. And in that sense,"},{"t":5830,"text":"this very much is a project that supports Heritage. The"},{"t":5833,"text":"building itself to me looks sharp. And I know reasonable"},{"t":5837,"text":"minds can disagree on aesthetics and we can never reproduce"},{"t":5839,"text":"what Edwardian and Victorian buildings look like. We don't want"},{"t":5842,"text":"to have some kind of Disneyland version of Downtown. We"},{"t":5845,"text":"always have to move forward in terms of architectural style."},{"t":5848,"text":"But to my mind, it fits. I really like the"},{"t":5850,"text":"green cladding, the green roofs, which we haven't really even"},{"t":5853,"text":"discussed are incredible. And it's part of our new policies"},{"t":5856,"text":"that really encourage green roofs. So the actual livability of"},{"t":5859,"text":"this building seems to me quite high. And I think"},{"t":5862,"text":"it is striking. I mean, it's certainly more visually stimulating"},{"t":5865,"text":"the nine - tenths of the buildings that we've looked"},{"t":5867,"text":"at this term, at least to my subjective eyes. In"},{"t":5870,"text":"terms of the height, this certainly for me pushes it."},{"t":5873,"text":"This is the upper limit of what I would want"},{"t":5875,"text":"to see in Oldwn. I think some precedence has been"},{"t":5878,"text":"set of a last century around what the height max"},{"t":5881,"text":"might look like. And I'm always sensitive and cognizant of"},{"t":5884,"text":"the fact that we need to be careful in setting"},{"t":5887,"text":"precedent. And if folks recall, I was one of the"},{"t":5890,"text":"people who had the biggest concerns about the tall buildings"},{"t":5892,"text":"around St. Andrew's Cathedral. A couple of weeks ago, where"},{"t":5896,"text":"I was worried that 20 - plus story buildings would"},{"t":5898,"text":"really overshoed that heritage asset. So I'm very sympathetic to"},{"t":5904,"text":"people who are worried about that. But for me, when"},{"t":5906,"text":"I see the skyline renderings from the inner harbour that"},{"t":5909,"text":"we looked at, to my mind, those 12 stories fit"},{"t":5912,"text":"within the context of what's around it. It doesn't stick"},{"t":5914,"text":"out like a sore thrum. It doesn't overshadow Oldtown. It"},{"t":5918,"text":"doesn't overshadow downtown. I wouldn't want to see much bigger"},{"t":5921,"text":"than this in Oldwn, but for me, I can live"},{"t":5923,"text":"with it. In particular, because it's going to bring 242"},{"t":5926,"text":"rentals downtown, it's going to bring this plaza. It's going"},{"t":5929,"text":"to bring safety. It's going to bring activation. And I"},{"t":5931,"text":"think in the end, it's going to make Downtown a"},{"t":5933,"text":"better place to be and to live and to work."},{"t":5936,"text":"So for me, I'm really grateful that the proponents have"},{"t":5940,"text":"brought this forward and have work collaboratively with staff and"},{"t":5943,"text":"have landed on something that staff are recommending support. And"},{"t":5947,"text":"I really hope to see this one move forward. I"},{"t":5950,"text":"will just close by noting that I acknowledge the worries"},{"t":5952,"text":"about parking from some of the downtown businesses. And I"},{"t":5956,"text":"leave it in staffs capable hands to figure out what"},{"t":5958,"text":"the solution may be there, noting that we do have"},{"t":5960,"text":"multiple parqueades within blocks that are rarely full. And so"},{"t":5964,"text":"it is going to be an adjustment. And we'll all"},{"t":5967,"text":"work through it together. But I think in the end,"},{"t":5969,"text":"Downtown Victoria will be a better place as a result"},{"t":5972,"text":"of this project. Thanks, Mayor. Thank you very much. Councillor"},{"t":5974,"text":"Thompson. Thanks, Mir. Um, yeah, I'm, uh, happy to support"},{"t":5981,"text":"this as well. This is, uh, important for downtown vitality"},{"t":5986,"text":"as my colleague has mentioned with, with work from home,"},{"t":5990,"text":"and, uh, what I've heard from, from a lot of"},{"t":5991,"text":"business owners, uh, they're really missing, uh, their customers, um,"},{"t":5996,"text":"so, you know, this is going to bring hundreds of"},{"t":6000,"text":"potential customers for nearby businesses. It's going to have a"},{"t":6005,"text":"plaza. And it's been a priority of this council to"},{"t":6008,"text":"establish more public spaces downtown. Uh, it's going to have"},{"t":6012,"text":"some ground floor retail, which will also attract more people"},{"t":6015,"text":"to that area. Also agree with my colleague's comments about,"},{"t":6021,"text":"uh, parking and particularly that parcade, uh, and that the"},{"t":6027,"text":"owner could close it tomorrow. It's just not up to"},{"t":6029,"text":"the city to make a decision on that. Um, I"},{"t":6032,"text":"would mention that, yes, it's, it's going to be an"},{"t":6035,"text":"adjustment for some folks who are currently using that lot."},{"t":6039,"text":"Um, but in addition to the street parking that the"},{"t":6042,"text":"city provides, uh, the mention of the public parcade in"},{"t":6046,"text":"the next block, um, with spots vacant almost all of"},{"t":6050,"text":"the time, uh, as well as there are two parcades"},{"t":6053,"text":"on the same two private parcades on the same street,"},{"t":6057,"text":"uh, both within 150 metres, uh, in either direction. And"},{"t":6062,"text":"the one that's even closer, um, short block away at"},{"t":6065,"text":"the other end of, of Broad Street at the base"},{"t":6067,"text":"centre. So I think that there are some alternatives for"},{"t":6070,"text":"people. Um, on the height, um, it's, it's higher than"},{"t":6077,"text":"many of the buildings around it. But what we've seen"},{"t":6081,"text":"from the renderings, uh, is that it's probably not going"},{"t":6084,"text":"to be obtrusive or perhaps even noticeed, uh, depending on"},{"t":6088,"text":"the direction you're looking at it from. Uh, it is"},{"t":6091,"text":"providing much needed housing. We have, uh, 8, 000 units"},{"t":6096,"text":"of latent demand. That's for people who are already living"},{"t":6099,"text":"here in Victoria. This isn't for people coming in. But"},{"t":6103,"text":"we do have also an average population increase of between"},{"t":6107,"text":"a thousand and a thousand five hundred people per year,"},{"t":6110,"text":"despite the immigration upticks and downticks. That's just the, uh,"},{"t":6115,"text":"long - term average. So, uh, you know, meeting, meeting"},{"t":6120,"text":"part of that need is important. And this is a"},{"t":6122,"text":"significant contribution. Uh, and it does also exceed the family"},{"t":6126,"text":"housing targets that council determined as a priority. Uh, final"},{"t":6132,"text":"comment, uh, staff have recommended this. They've done the analysis."},{"t":6136,"text":"They've done the work with the, uh, the applicant for"},{"t":6138,"text":"the last year. Uh, they've certainly taken a much closer"},{"t":6142,"text":"look than we have at this proposal. Uh, and repeatedly"},{"t":6146,"text":"and for the reasons in their report, I support this"},{"t":6148,"text":"moving forward. Thanks Mayor. Thank you very much. Anybody else."},{"t":6160,"text":"Thank you. It's fascinating. To take a look at the"},{"t":6164,"text":"comparators that we did for this. And one of the"},{"t":6167,"text":"comparators is 608 Brown, the sovereign. That building has been"},{"t":6173,"text":"there now for 13 years. Um, if you go back"},{"t":6176,"text":"in history, it was a split vote of council. It"},{"t":6180,"text":"was seven to two in favor. Um, but it was"},{"t":6184,"text":"against the recommendation of staff. At the time. And the"},{"t":6189,"text":"staff, uh, were concerned rightly, I think about height as"},{"t":6194,"text":"it related to decap. Um, now 13 years later, I"},{"t":6199,"text":"think we see that the sovereign works. Um, it and"},{"t":6203,"text":"staff have had a chance to reflect through that. And"},{"t":6206,"text":"now come with a recommendation to support this. I am"},{"t":6211,"text":"open very much to this. I share the concern that"},{"t":6214,"text":"some people have around height. And I think that this"},{"t":6218,"text":"does push it. But what you have to do is"},{"t":6220,"text":"recognise that this, in some ways, is a trade -"},{"t":6223,"text":"off between that Plaza area that opens up the breathing"},{"t":6228,"text":"space for St. Andrews Church. I do think, and it's"},{"t":6235,"text":"been referenced a couple of times that the three parking"},{"t":6237,"text":"stalls adjacent to the church need to be moved. If"},{"t":6242,"text":"you're going to get the full benefit of opening up"},{"t":6244,"text":"that breathing space, I don't think having three cars shuffled"},{"t":6249,"text":"in the middle of a church and public plaza make"},{"t":6255,"text":"much sense. So I know that there was a thought"},{"t":6259,"text":"around wording that could be used to make that amendment."},{"t":6262,"text":"I think Mr. Batenzo has the wording for that. And"},{"t":6266,"text":"we can deal with that as an amendment later. But"},{"t":6269,"text":"to the, what we have here, I think it's what"},{"t":6272,"text":"we have to grapple with is the trade - off"},{"t":6274,"text":"that we see between. The height provision that's being supported"},{"t":6280,"text":"here. And what we see as the breathing space or"},{"t":6286,"text":"the room for the backside or the offside of St."},{"t":6290,"text":"Andrews Church. And I think that that's wholly supportable in"},{"t":6293,"text":"this instance. It is interesting to me as well that"},{"t":6298,"text":"it's been referenced earlier. We quite often talk about the"},{"t":6300,"text":"Belmont building at eight stories. It is the densest building,"},{"t":6304,"text":"I think, in the city, certainly in the downtown, because"},{"t":6307,"text":"of the setback relationships. It goes right to the property"},{"t":6310,"text":"edge. Um, but it is downhill from the area. So"},{"t":6315,"text":"we can't compare their eight stories to this 11 stories."},{"t":6318,"text":"This is, this is higher, 12 stories. Um, so they"},{"t":6323,"text":"are significantly different from each other. But I think in"},{"t":6326,"text":"terms of the community benefit that's accrued from this, yes,"},{"t":6330,"text":"we've spoken volumes about the housing and it's an enormous"},{"t":6334,"text":"benefit, particularly the two and three bedroom units. But I"},{"t":6337,"text":"think that the architecture is particularly good in this example."},{"t":6342,"text":"I love the articulation of the building itself, but it's"},{"t":6347,"text":"buying that plaza area and allowing people to revel in"},{"t":6352,"text":"the architectural brilliance of the backside of St. Andrews Church."},{"t":6357,"text":"So I will support this. But I look forward to"},{"t":6359,"text":"the amendment coming forward on the three parking stalls. Thank"},{"t":6364,"text":"you, very much. Anybody else. How's your Loton. Thanks and"},{"t":6372,"text":"to you, Mayor. This has been really difficult for me"},{"t":6376,"text":"of, you know, really, really struggled with this because oldwn"},{"t":6380,"text":"is such an important part of the city. And we've"},{"t":6382,"text":"talked about that a lot. And we do have regulations"},{"t":6385,"text":"for that, that I hesitate to veer out of. And"},{"t":6390,"text":"we're also still in a time when we're, you know,"},{"t":6393,"text":"reviewing the heritage review and the Heritage Experts need to"},{"t":6400,"text":"weigh in. And we're still working on decap. So that,"},{"t":6404,"text":"um, concerned me. And we're not quite sure where that's"},{"t":6408,"text":"going. So I was really, um, yeah, I just, it"},{"t":6414,"text":"was very difficult for me because of course I'm always"},{"t":6418,"text":"supportive of new purpose - built rental, and particularly the"},{"t":6422,"text":"two and three bedrooms that are desperately needed. And, um,"},{"t":6428,"text":"you know, it's too soon to go here, but the"},{"t":6430,"text":"Affordable Housing, Revitalization Tax Exemption, I'd be hoping that the"},{"t":6433,"text":"proponents would take advantage of that to get some affordability"},{"t":6437,"text":"into this project. Yeah. So I was very, very much"},{"t":6442,"text":"on the fence. But St. Andrews is landmark heritage and"},{"t":6448,"text":"it's unbelievable to me that the backside of it has"},{"t":6451,"text":"been basically, um, unavailable to the view of the public"},{"t":6457,"text":"for 60 years, 65 years. And opening that up to"},{"t":6462,"text":"be able to show off this heritage gem, I think."},{"t":6471,"text":"Is part of the reason where I'm leaning now towards"},{"t":6474,"text":"supporting this. I think it's that, you know, 12 stories"},{"t":6480,"text":"is kind of the limit for me as well on"},{"t":6482,"text":"Oldwn, but using the examples of the sovereign and the"},{"t":6486,"text":"Belmont building, you know, we've, we've, it's not out of,"},{"t":6491,"text":"out of scale with that. And it's also on the"},{"t":6493,"text":"edge of Oldwn. So yeah, very hair splitting decision here."},{"t":6501,"text":"But I also want to talk about the parking as"},{"t":6504,"text":"well because there are the businesses in that community around,"},{"t":6509,"text":"um, broad and Belmont have really brought that up as"},{"t":6513,"text":"a concern. And I'm just going to read out a"},{"t":6516,"text":"few examples of things that they thought could work. And"},{"t":6521,"text":"maybe this is something that, that, you know, staff or"},{"t":6524,"text":"myself or other councillors might want to get behind. So"},{"t":6528,"text":"they had suggested reviewing parking usage by day data by"},{"t":6533,"text":"day of the week. So particularly Mondays and Fridays to"},{"t":6536,"text":"offer free or reduced rate parking to stimulate slower business"},{"t":6539,"text":"days. So that's something, you know, is some smaller creative"},{"t":6543,"text":"solutions that could help the parking situation or explore the"},{"t":6547,"text":"feasibility of short - term and mixed - use parking"},{"t":6550,"text":"in commercial areas due to underutilization. So for example, loading"},{"t":6556,"text":"zones, I think there's three loading zones on Brown that"},{"t":6559,"text":"could be used for more than just commercial purposes potentially."},{"t":6565,"text":"And looking at changing the time of short of time"},{"t":6569,"text":"limits to park. So making those one and a half"},{"t":6571,"text":"hour time limits to two hours. And then maybe potentially"},{"t":6577,"text":"improvements at the Brownton Street parquet because I have heard,"},{"t":6581,"text":"and I'm not sure about this because I haven't been"},{"t":6582,"text":"in the Brownton street parquet for years, but there were"},{"t":6585,"text":"some complaints that it's, you know, cleanliness and safety issues."},{"t":6589,"text":"So maybe there are some things we can do to"},{"t":6591,"text":"help mitigate some of the parking issues that the businesses"},{"t":6597,"text":"in that area are concerned about. But the reality is,"},{"t":6603,"text":"is this parquet is coming down, whether this application passes"},{"t":6609,"text":"counsel or not. That's not in question. And we have"},{"t":6613,"text":"no control over that. So by a very, very, very"},{"t":6618,"text":"thin margin, I am going to support this project today."},{"t":6622,"text":"Thank you. Thank you very much. Anybody else. Councillor Hammond."},{"t":6627,"text":"Council Cardner. Thanks, Mayor. There's a lot about this proposal"},{"t":6632,"text":"that I support. I support redevelopment of the site. I"},{"t":6636,"text":"support the purpose - built rental housing. I support the"},{"t":6638,"text":"family - sized units. I support the commercial space at"},{"t":6642,"text":"street level. And I particularly support the sustainable public plaza"},{"t":6648,"text":"besides St. Andrew's Church, especially when you see the difference,"},{"t":6651,"text":"it will make compared to the parking ramp that exists"},{"t":6653,"text":"now. So this is not a choice between this proposal"},{"t":6657,"text":"and nothing. My concern is the scale. This proposal isn't"},{"t":6660,"text":"slightly higher. The planning framework for this site contemplates a"},{"t":6665,"text":"maximum height of about 15 metres. We are being asked"},{"t":6668,"text":"to approve more than 38 metres and a 12 -"},{"t":6672,"text":"story building. The proposed density is also substantially above what"},{"t":6676,"text":"is contemplated for this part of Oldwn. Those are not"},{"t":6682,"text":"minor variances. I recognise that this particular location can probably"},{"t":6686,"text":"accommodate more height than some other places of oldwn. They"},{"t":6691,"text":"Heritage Advisory panel recognised that as well. But the panel"},{"t":6695,"text":"also concluded unanimously that this proposal goes too far. What"},{"t":6699,"text":"I found particularly persuasive was that the panel did not"},{"t":6703,"text":"dismiss the project. Members described it as thoughtful. They liked"},{"t":6707,"text":"many of its architectural features and the plaza. Their concern"},{"t":6711,"text":"was essentially the same as mine. A good development can"},{"t":6714,"text":"still be too large. My vote is not against housing."},{"t":6717,"text":"Voting against 12 stories does not mean I support zero"},{"t":6721,"text":"stories. It means that I believe council has responsibility to"},{"t":6724,"text":"distinguish between reasonable additional density and too much density for"},{"t":6729,"text":"a particular location. I would like to see this applicant"},{"t":6732,"text":"come back with a material - y shorter building while"},{"t":6737,"text":"preserving as much as possible of what is good here."},{"t":6740,"text":"The rental housing family - sized homes, commercial uses, high"},{"t":6744,"text":"quality design and especially the plaza. Our planning policies should"},{"t":6749,"text":"not be treated as an absolute barriers to change. But"},{"t":6753,"text":"neither should they become meaningless whenever an attractive project asks"},{"t":6757,"text":"us to substantially exceed them. I believe there is a"},{"t":6761,"text":"very good development waiting to be built on this site."},{"t":6764,"text":"I do not believe the 12 - story version is"},{"t":6766,"text":"it. For those reasons, I will be voting to decline"},{"t":6769,"text":"the application. Um, and I want one to add that"},{"t":6772,"text":"if this proposal is defeated, it doesn't look like it's"},{"t":6774,"text":"going to be that I would put forward a motion"},{"t":6776,"text":"asking staff to go back to the applicant asking them"},{"t":6779,"text":"to come back with a similar proposal, but not as"},{"t":6781,"text":"much height. Thanks, Mayor. Thank you very much. Just to"},{"t":6786,"text":"clarify before I go to Councillor Gardner, is it your"},{"t":6789,"text":"intention to try and raise emotionalizing and opposition to the"},{"t":6792,"text":"outcome? Should it be defeated? I just don't think it's"},{"t":6796,"text":"going to be defeated. There. Okay. I would just point"},{"t":6800,"text":"out that that would be procedurally unacceptable. There you go."},{"t":6804,"text":"We'll just deal with that at the time. Sure. Hold"},{"t":6807,"text":"that thought. Councillor Gardner. First, it was talking about all"},{"t":6812,"text":"the amendment. When is the time the amendment comes forward?"},{"t":6814,"text":"It would be at any time before we vote. Please"},{"t":6816,"text":"now. No one yet has suggested an amendment. Okay. Please"},{"t":6819,"text":"no. Would you like to move an amendment, Councillor Gardner?"},{"t":6824,"text":"Okay. Do you have wording for the amendment? I think."},{"t":6828,"text":"This one's been mentioned many times the staff does. Mr."},{"t":6831,"text":"Patenzo, uh, inappropriately may I add, uh, counsel is asking"},{"t":6836,"text":"you to provide the wording for an amendment. Do you"},{"t":6839,"text":"wish to do that. You need not, by the way."},{"t":6842,"text":"That is not your job. Sorry, through the mayor. Is"},{"t":6847,"text":"this an amendment for the parking on the adjacent property"},{"t":6850,"text":"that we're seeking? Yes. So, um, some language was sent"},{"t":6853,"text":"to our administrative staff here. And I can read that"},{"t":6857,"text":"out. Uh, so after Section two, item GVIII, add item"},{"t":6863,"text":"H with the following text that staff explore with the"},{"t":6866,"text":"applicant expanding the proposed plaza onto the St. Andrew's Church"},{"t":6870,"text":"property and replacing the three parking stalls on the church"},{"t":6874,"text":"property to be within the proposed parquet through an agreement"},{"t":6877,"text":"with the church and the applicant. Just one second, please."},{"t":6890,"text":"So just to be clear, the intent of that would"},{"t":6892,"text":"be to remove the existing. Indication on the plans of"},{"t":6898,"text":"one parking spall and allowing that to be, become part"},{"t":6901,"text":"of the plaza and replacing that with three parking stalls"},{"t":6905,"text":"within the parquet. So through the mayor, there are currently"},{"t":6908,"text":"three surface parking stalls within the St. Andrew's Church property."},{"t":6912,"text":"And it would be to expand the plaza to the"},{"t":6914,"text":"face of the church, uh, remove those stalls and then"},{"t":6917,"text":"provide alternative stalls, uh, within the proposed parquet. Just to"},{"t":6923,"text":"be clear on the, um, plans on the South side"},{"t":6927,"text":"when you look at the plaza, there is a box"},{"t":6930,"text":"that's called St. Andrews Extension. Is that different than what"},{"t":6934,"text":"you're describing? That's not intended to be for. Parking. Through"},{"t":6940,"text":"the mayor, I believe that St. Andrew's extension would not"},{"t":6944,"text":"be contemplated with this motion. So what is that? I"},{"t":6950,"text":"thought that was the parking spot. I believe that's a"},{"t":6955,"text":"small storage area that's used by the church. It's a"},{"t":6958,"text":"building as opposed to surface parking. Very good. All right."},{"t":6960,"text":"That's clear. Thank you. So you're intending to, um, essentially"},{"t":6963,"text":"give them three parking spolls in the parquet. Okay. Is"},{"t":6966,"text":"there a seconder for that amendment? Thanks. Councillor Coleman is"},{"t":6971,"text":"second again. There you go. Sorry to fortunate. Can just"},{"t":6974,"text":"rate a point, which is that, as worded, it says"},{"t":6977,"text":"staff explore with the applicant, but the church should be"},{"t":6979,"text":"involved in that exploration because it's not the applicant's property."},{"t":6984,"text":"So shouldn't say that staff explore with the applicant. And"},{"t":6987,"text":"the church. Well, I believe that, um, Mr. Batanza's language"},{"t":6991,"text":"actually is suggesting that it is the applicant who speaks"},{"t":6995,"text":"with staff because the proposal, as I understand it, is"},{"t":6998,"text":"that three of the stalls in the applicants parcade would"},{"t":7001,"text":"be dedicated to the church. But if I'm, if I'm"},{"t":7004,"text":"understanding correctly, the, the thought here is to actually extend"},{"t":7007,"text":"a public, well, they would be an SRW Plaza onto"},{"t":7012,"text":"land owned by the church. Essentially extending the plaza onto"},{"t":7015,"text":"the church's property. That's my understanding of what's being contemplated"},{"t":7018,"text":"here and in exchange for that, they might get three"},{"t":7021,"text":"parking spaces elsewhere. Mr. Patanzo, I don't believe that's what"},{"t":7024,"text":"you're suggesting, is it? Yes, to the mayor, the, the"},{"t":7028,"text":"proposition is that the plaza area include those three parking"},{"t":7032,"text":"stalls on the church's property. Which are not included now."},{"t":7034,"text":"Which are not included now, correct? I see. Mayor. Yes."},{"t":7038,"text":"If you could put slide 18 up again, that would"},{"t":7041,"text":"clarify it. Sure. Let's do that before we look for"},{"t":7044,"text":"a second here. That's the one I have on my"},{"t":7048,"text":"screen. Yep, that's the one I have on my screen."},{"t":7058,"text":"So Mr. Patanza, can you clarify it based on this"},{"t":7061,"text":"drawing exactly the areas that you're describing in the amendment."},{"t":7067,"text":"What's current and what would be changed by this amendment?"},{"t":7070,"text":"Through the mayor. Do I have a laser? I don't."},{"t":7073,"text":"I don't think they do. Oh, it doesn't. No. You'll"},{"t":7077,"text":"have to use your words. Use your words. So yes,"},{"t":7081,"text":"your words. There you go. Uh, so, uh, through yourself"},{"t":7084,"text":"there, if we, if we look at this drawing, um,"},{"t":7087,"text":"that there's a space between the St. Andrews Church and"},{"t":7090,"text":"the plaza. And the lying drawn there. That's the property"},{"t":7093,"text":"boundary. There's a grey area within this drawing that accommodates"},{"t":7099,"text":"parking at this time. And so it's parking and it's"},{"t":7102,"text":"a bit of sort of sort of, uh, interstitial space"},{"t":7104,"text":"as well. And so what is being proposed is that"},{"t":7108,"text":"the plaza actually doesn't have a boundary that corresponds to"},{"t":7112,"text":"the property boundary. But instead a but the existing church."},{"t":7117,"text":"Within that area, there are three parking stalls, which the"},{"t":7119,"text":"church would be looking to have, uh, provided elsewhere, which"},{"t":7124,"text":"would be in the underground parking. Right. And so just"},{"t":7127,"text":"pointing going back to one of the comments by council"},{"t":7130,"text":"member, does that mean then your amendment requires consultation with"},{"t":7134,"text":"the church. So through the mayor, the way that that"},{"t":7139,"text":"motion was suggested was that, um, that consultation would occur,"},{"t":7144,"text":"but it's a private land use matter between the applicant"},{"t":7148,"text":"and the church as opposed to the city consulting directly"},{"t":7152,"text":"with the church itself. And so that's what the motion"},{"t":7156,"text":"has been drafted as. But saying that there would be"},{"t":7159,"text":"a requirement. And I have to look at our emotion"},{"t":7163,"text":"again here. That this plaza area is intended to have"},{"t":7167,"text":"a statue right of way over it to permit public"},{"t":7169,"text":"access. That statutory right of way would have to extend"},{"t":7172,"text":"also to properly, uh, that belongs to the church. So"},{"t":7175,"text":"we would need to have that conversation. The amendment rather"},{"t":7178,"text":"back up. And Mr. Patenzo, if you could clarify based"},{"t":7181,"text":"on your suggested wording, what, if anything, needs to change"},{"t":7185,"text":"to accommodate what you just said. I believe through the"},{"t":7191,"text":"mayor of yourself that it was just added to the"},{"t":7194,"text":"end of the sentence, um, uh, the proposed parque through"},{"t":7198,"text":"an agreement with the church and the applicant and the"},{"t":7201,"text":"city, uh, would suffice. Very good. With that then. Is"},{"t":7207,"text":"there a seconder for that amendment. Councillor Coleman is seconding"},{"t":7210,"text":"the amendment. Councillor Gardner, would you like to speak to"},{"t":7214,"text":"your amendment. This makes sense. Thank you. Councillor Coleman. And"},{"t":7219,"text":"I think you'd like to add. No. Okay. Anyone else"},{"t":7223,"text":"on the amendment. That is just item H in the"},{"t":7228,"text":"bold language. No. Okay. Although I'll just meet check with"},{"t":7234,"text":"councillor Thompson. Yeah. He's good. Uh, all those in favor"},{"t":7236,"text":"of the amendment. Is anyone opposed. That would be unanimous."},{"t":7242,"text":"Councillor Gardner, you still have the floor now on the"},{"t":7243,"text":"main amended motion. Thank you. This is a very interesting"},{"t":7253,"text":"attractive billing that's being proposed. When I saw the schematics"},{"t":7256,"text":"in January, I thought, wow, the design was actually superb."},{"t":7261,"text":"And, uh, and especially the nod to the end, um,"},{"t":7265,"text":"architecture. And while many has spoken about parking so far,"},{"t":7269,"text":"my real concern is a trend to consider broader city"},{"t":7272,"text":"goals as rationale to disregard or set aside Oldwn guidelines"},{"t":7277,"text":"and expectations for respect of oldwn and how important it"},{"t":7280,"text":"is. That is the most troublesome thing for me in"},{"t":7284,"text":"this whole, uh, application and the staff report. The height,"},{"t":7289,"text":"the density and an FSR of close to six to"},{"t":7293,"text":"one is asking too much for this site. And a"},{"t":7297,"text":"process, as I mentioned, presents a real threat to Oldtown."},{"t":7301,"text":"This proposal, um, if approved sets, as I mentioned, a"},{"t":7305,"text":"bad precedent. Now I'm going to just read from an"},{"t":7308,"text":"email and we received this morning. I don't know the"},{"t":7311,"text":"person. I haven't had a chance to get permission. So"},{"t":7313,"text":"I won't give his name. The downtown corps are planning"},{"t":7316,"text":"on zoning bylaw. I generally limit new construction additions to"},{"t":7319,"text":"Oldwn to 15 metres. These policies are recently reaffirmed by"},{"t":7323,"text":"council through the OCP process and are intended to preserve"},{"t":7327,"text":"oldwns human scale, historic urban form, and the gradual transition"},{"t":7331,"text":"in building height from their waterfront through Oldwn toward Douglas"},{"t":7335,"text":"Street. Councils continued adherence to these policies has helped maintain"},{"t":7338,"text":"the scale of old towns. Many heritage building about ninety"},{"t":7343,"text":"five percent of which are five stories or less. The"},{"t":7347,"text":"current proposal does not appear to align with that objective."},{"t":7353,"text":"This proposal follows the threat which was raised a few"},{"t":7357,"text":"meetings ago. The threat to Oldwn. The public is feeling"},{"t":7362,"text":"the impact of the new OCP. Setting aside OCP decap"},{"t":7368,"text":"and oldwn guidelines at this time. We'll further erode public"},{"t":7373,"text":"trust. In this part of Oldtown near the historic buildings,"},{"t":7376,"text":"a density lower, uh, to at most five to one."},{"t":7381,"text":"And perhaps even the eight stories which has mentioned would"},{"t":7383,"text":"have been supportable for me. But that is not what"},{"t":7387,"text":"is before us today. In summary, the proposal is height"},{"t":7391,"text":"and degree to which it departs from the established framework"},{"t":7396,"text":"intended to protect oldwns character is not supportable. Thank you,"},{"t":7400,"text":"Mayor. Thank you very much. Anybody else? I will just"},{"t":7407,"text":"add a few words. I won't repeat what many of"},{"t":7410,"text":"my colleagues had said. Have said that I've been very"},{"t":7413,"text":"eloquent as always. I do support this moving forward for"},{"t":7417,"text":"many of the reasons that have already expressed. I'll just"},{"t":7419,"text":"touch on two that I don't think have been expressed"},{"t":7421,"text":"yet. The thing about this for me, which actually compels"},{"t":7424,"text":"it over that line, that fine line is actually the"},{"t":7427,"text":"comprehensive nature of the analysis that Staff of outlined. They"},{"t":7431,"text":"have, in my opinion, uh, considered a wide variety of"},{"t":7435,"text":"different policies, applications, practicalities, realities and goals. And among all"},{"t":7441,"text":"of those have found balance. Which I think are questionable."},{"t":7446,"text":"There are aspects of this, which I think are outstanding"},{"t":7448,"text":"and quite exemplary of what I believe a city should"},{"t":7451,"text":"look like. And the experience of that, that it creates"},{"t":7455,"text":"for its residence. That being said, the balance points that"},{"t":7459,"text":"have been found, uh, with Staffs analysis, comprehensive analysis of"},{"t":7463,"text":"this in the end for me comes down to being"},{"t":7466,"text":"able to accept this and move forward with it. The"},{"t":7470,"text":"other piece that I don't think anyone's as mentioned is"},{"t":7472,"text":"I actually think this is remarkably elegant. It is a"},{"t":7475,"text":"very confined space. And it's a space which has some"},{"t":7481,"text":"intriguing history, I think, as I just be pointed out"},{"t":7483,"text":"by some questions. And certainly it's current spaces occupied by"},{"t":7488,"text":"a very unique structure, I guess, which none of us"},{"t":7492,"text":"can really figure out why it was put there given"},{"t":7494,"text":"all of the different policies of the time, but nevertheless."},{"t":7497,"text":"What is being proposed here, I think, brings a degree"},{"t":7500,"text":"of elegance that is entirely suitable for that location, particularly"},{"t":7504,"text":"as it is compared to some of the immediately surrounded"},{"t":7506,"text":"buildings, the magnobly hotel, the sovereign, the Belmont, a variety"},{"t":7509,"text":"of others, including the union club, just down the hill."},{"t":7512,"text":"Uh, and so I actually think this is a remarkable"},{"t":7515,"text":"adaptation of a new 21st century version of all of"},{"t":7519,"text":"that elegance in that design. And I think for all"},{"t":7521,"text":"of the reasons that have been expressed earlier around housing,"},{"t":7524,"text":"around residents, around oversight around all of the things that"},{"t":7527,"text":"have been mentioned, uh, this is quite a lovely proposal"},{"t":7530,"text":"and I'm quite happy to support it. With that then,"},{"t":7534,"text":"it would appear, oh, Councillor Kim, sorry, I didn't see"},{"t":7536,"text":"your hand. Go ahead. Go ahead. It's okay. Uh, through"},{"t":7538,"text":"the chair, um, I would just also add beyond what's"},{"t":7541,"text":"been said, the fact that it is purpose - built"},{"t":7543,"text":"rental and offers so many housing options actually not only"},{"t":7550,"text":"activates and provides more residences downtown, but more mixed income"},{"t":7554,"text":"and mixed family styles, which diversifies what Downtown will look"},{"t":7558,"text":"like. And that to me is the kind of Victoria"},{"t":7561,"text":"want to see moving forward. Thanks. Thank you very much."},{"t":7565,"text":"Leave everyone's head a chance to question and speak. So"},{"t":7568,"text":"all those in favor of the application. Councillor Dell. Councillor"},{"t":7572,"text":"Kim, Councillor Cardona, Councillor Loton, myself, Councillor Coleman and Councillor"},{"t":7576,"text":"Thompson in opposition, Councillor Hammond and Councillor Gardner. Noting two"},{"t":7582,"text":"in opposition, that application is approved at committee and I"},{"t":7586,"text":"suspect we'll return to us in due course when all"},{"t":7588,"text":"of these different thresholds have been met. Thank you very"},{"t":7590,"text":"much, Staff. Very much appreciate your presentations and all of"},{"t":7593,"text":"the work that went into getting us here. We'll move"},{"t":7595,"text":"on now to item G2, which is a rezoning application"},{"t":7599,"text":"and development permit with variances application for the property at"},{"t":7603,"text":"1114 Rockland Avenue. And once our staff settle themselves, we'll"},{"t":7607,"text":"turn it over to them for a presentation and introductions."},{"t":7639,"text":"Welcome."},{"t":7650,"text":"Good afternoon, Mayor Council. Uh, Patrick Carroll, senior planner with"},{"t":7656,"text":"development services. The application I'll be presenting today as a"},{"t":7661,"text":"rezoning and a development permit. With variances application. For 114"},{"t":7669,"text":"Rockland Avenue. The proposal is to amend the GRD1, General"},{"t":7677,"text":"Residential District. To add hotel as a permitted use. And"},{"t":7683,"text":"to increase density. To 2. 35 to one Floor Space"},{"t":7688,"text":"Ratio. The amendment is required in order to construct a"},{"t":7695,"text":"sick story. 30 guest room, hotel. So moving to the"},{"t":7704,"text":"matters for council's consideration, uh, they include the supportability of"},{"t":7708,"text":"the Rezoning, as well as the proposed variances. And also"},{"t":7712,"text":"the consistency of the proposed design. With applicable design guidelines."},{"t":7719,"text":"So first here is site context. You'll note the location"},{"t":7724,"text":"near the corner of Rockland and cook. And this red"},{"t":7729,"text":"line denotes the boundary of the downtown core area. You'll"},{"t":7735,"text":"note the property is along this boundary. Here's the aerial"},{"t":7741,"text":"photography. The surrounding area is comprised of a mix of"},{"t":7747,"text":"commercial and residential uses in a variety of built forms."},{"t":7754,"text":"Here is a 3D aerial. First, this is the vacant"},{"t":7759,"text":"subject property. And here are three properties along Cook Street."},{"t":7765,"text":"The first two are from the corner. Our heritage designated"},{"t":7771,"text":"commercial conversions. 10 - 15 COOC is a five -"},{"t":7776,"text":"story rental residential. That was constructed in 2022. In addition,"},{"t":7784,"text":"to the north and east, there are three and four"},{"t":7789,"text":"- story apartment buildings. Here's the subject property. Looking north"},{"t":7795,"text":"towards some of the mentioned residential buildings. Here to the"},{"t":7801,"text":"west, uh, this is the rear yard of the three"},{"t":7805,"text":"already mentioned Cook Street properties. You'll note the paved surfaces"},{"t":7809,"text":"along Rockland Avenue. Moving now to the east. This is"},{"t":7817,"text":"1126 Rockland. It is a four story walk up apartment"},{"t":7821,"text":"and it's double fronting. You'll note in the lower photo,"},{"t":7827,"text":"the large sequoia. Tree that is near the boundary line"},{"t":7831,"text":"between these two properties. It is proposed for retention and"},{"t":7836,"text":"is noted in your Committee of the Holt report. To"},{"t":7841,"text":"the north, now this is the north of Budding property"},{"t":7844,"text":"at 1137 Mir Street. This is a three - story."},{"t":7851,"text":"Six unit Strata development that was constructed in 2009. So"},{"t":7858,"text":"now we can move to the official Community Plan. The"},{"t":7862,"text":"subject property is identified as within a priority growth area"},{"t":7867,"text":"of the residential fabric. However, as the thematic map shows,"},{"t":7872,"text":"the property is also adjacent to the downtown core area."},{"t":7877,"text":"So moving to OCP policies now. Primarily residential uses, as"},{"t":7883,"text":"well as limited commercial, our envisioned for the residential fabric."},{"t":7889,"text":"Up to six stories generally within a priority growth area."},{"t":7893,"text":"However, noting the adjacency to the downtown core, this opens"},{"t":7897,"text":"up more of a range of commercial uses, which does"},{"t":7900,"text":"include tourist uses. I would note that this is reinforced"},{"t":7907,"text":"in the OCP, which emphasizes the importance of expanding tourism"},{"t":7912,"text":"assets across the city. Uh, outlining a specific target of"},{"t":7918,"text":"1, 500 rooms by 2035. So moving to the design"},{"t":7927,"text":"objectives within the OCP. As you're aware, the perimeter block"},{"t":7932,"text":"form is prioritized within the residential fabric. This is where"},{"t":7939,"text":"generally open spaces adequate and located within the rear yard."},{"t":7946,"text":"In assessing this application, although the 6 - story building"},{"t":7950,"text":"height is consistent with what is envisioned in a priority"},{"t":7954,"text":"growth area. And there is rear yard green space, as"},{"t":7958,"text":"well as a rooftop amenity that is shared. The proposal"},{"t":7963,"text":"does come short of the desired 8 metre rear yard"},{"t":7967,"text":"setback that is considered appropriate in this location. Moving to"},{"t":7974,"text":"the rezoning and development policy. Which supplements the OCP, with"},{"t":7981,"text":"general guidance for rezonings. The policy discourages development that could"},{"t":7986,"text":"result in orphaned adjacent sites. This is not considered a"},{"t":7991,"text":"concern in this application. As I would reiterate that to"},{"t":7996,"text":"the west, our two heritage designated commercial buildings. And to"},{"t":8001,"text":"the east as an existing walk - up apartment that"},{"t":8005,"text":"is double fronting as noted, but also is exceeding 30"},{"t":8009,"text":"metres in width. Also consistent with the policy. The proposal"},{"t":8017,"text":"includes sustainable mobility options. It also includes a mix of"},{"t":8023,"text":"indoor and outdoor common areas. And there are design mitigations"},{"t":8029,"text":"most notably step backs above the fourth story, which I'll"},{"t":8032,"text":"cover in a following slide. As noted, there is the"},{"t":8039,"text":"eight metre rear yard setback that staff would recommend, uh,"},{"t":8043,"text":"to further mitigate impacts. So here is the site plan."},{"t":8050,"text":"There is a dedicated lobby. This is for check -"},{"t":8053,"text":"in and with the service attendant. There is a two"},{"t":8057,"text":"- way parking entrance into limited parking within the building."},{"t":8062,"text":"And there is a separate guest entry which provides direct"},{"t":8065,"text":"access to the elevators. Here is the rear yard setback."},{"t":8071,"text":"It is at 5. 4 metres as proposed and as"},{"t":8075,"text":"noted, eight is recommended. Here is the West Side setback."},{"t":8083,"text":"It is at two metres. At the ground level. And"},{"t":8087,"text":"apologies for there is a typo there. Uh, that should"},{"t":8090,"text":"say three metres above the fourth story. So the step"},{"t":8093,"text":"- in is actually above the fourth story. Apologies for"},{"t":8096,"text":"that. Going to the east side, this is near zero"},{"t":8102,"text":"lot line for the first story, but this widens out"},{"t":8106,"text":"to 2. 4 metres above the first story. There are"},{"t":8110,"text":"additional step - in locations along this building face that"},{"t":8113,"text":"are more minor. Here's the front yard setback, and it"},{"t":8120,"text":"is set at 4. 1 metres. And I would note"},{"t":8124,"text":"that it is necessitated by the proposed pad - mounted"},{"t":8128,"text":"transformer. Which is located in the front yard. So here"},{"t":8135,"text":"now is the landscape plan. You will see appropriately plantings"},{"t":8141,"text":"and trees are concentrated in the rear - yard area."},{"t":8145,"text":"There is a lesser extent of park of plantings along"},{"t":8148,"text":"the west side yard. There's also two proposed street trees."},{"t":8154,"text":"And you'll know the large circle passing through a portion"},{"t":8157,"text":"of the building footprint. That is the expected root zone"},{"t":8163,"text":"for the notable sequoia - tree already mentioned. And as"},{"t":8168,"text":"noted, it is proposed for retention. In terms of numbers,"},{"t":8175,"text":"in terms of open - lot space, it is above"},{"t":8177,"text":"the 40 percent for the GRD - 1 at 46."},{"t":8182,"text":"5 percent. Lock coverage is at 57 percent. And it"},{"t":8188,"text":"does meet the minimum contiguous landscaped area required in the"},{"t":8191,"text":"zone. Uh, and it's actually at 75 square metres. And"},{"t":8195,"text":"of course, is located in the rear yard area. As"},{"t":8201,"text":"noted, there is recommended revision to the rear yard setback,"},{"t":8206,"text":"and this provides you a visual of that location. I"},{"t":8208,"text":"would clarify that it is a set of the rear"},{"t":8211,"text":"set of stairs, as well as bathrooms to some of"},{"t":8214,"text":"the smaller hotel rooms are located within this encroaching area."},{"t":8222,"text":"Now we can move to the elevations. This, of course,"},{"t":8225,"text":"is the street fronting elevation. You'll note the building height"},{"t":8231,"text":"at 19 metres. And you can see some of the"},{"t":8236,"text":"architectural features such as the trellis and the sunshade that"},{"t":8241,"text":"is proposed for the rooftop. Moving to the back of"},{"t":8250,"text":"the building, this is the north elevation. So this is"},{"t":8253,"text":"facing 1137 mirrors. And here is a good view of"},{"t":8258,"text":"the rooftop amenity. I would note it is over 300"},{"t":8262,"text":"square metres in total. It's quite large and does consume"},{"t":8266,"text":"the majority of the rooftop space. Here now is the"},{"t":8273,"text":"east elevation. So this is facing the four - story"},{"t":8276,"text":"walk - up apartment. That is located on Rockland Avenue."},{"t":8282,"text":"And here is the West elevation. Again, it is facing"},{"t":8286,"text":"the two heritage designated commercial conversions. In terms of materiality,"},{"t":8294,"text":"the two dominant materials are pre - finished metal in"},{"t":8298,"text":"a wood grain finish. As well as painted stucco in"},{"t":8302,"text":"two colours. There's also already mentioned some accents in wood."},{"t":8307,"text":"And of course, there's aluminum guards for the balconies as"},{"t":8311,"text":"well as the rooftop. So as your report indicates this"},{"t":8317,"text":"property is within DPA1. So the General Urban Design Guidelines"},{"t":8322,"text":"do apply. Consistent with the guidelines, the proposal includes well"},{"t":8330,"text":"articulated building facade, particularly along the street. A recess garage"},{"t":8335,"text":"door. As well as upper level step backs to mitigate"},{"t":8339,"text":"the impact of the proposed height. There's also higher quality"},{"t":8344,"text":"materials, considered appropriate to the context. And I'd already mentioned"},{"t":8350,"text":"the variety of features to add visual interest. However, as"},{"t":8355,"text":"noted, the recommended revisions are most notably to reduce the"},{"t":8360,"text":"portion of the building encroaching into the rear yard 8"},{"t":8364,"text":"metre area. And there are more minor revisions also recommended,"},{"t":8369,"text":"including reduction in the width of the vehicle entrance leading"},{"t":8372,"text":"into the parquet. And also, we did encourage an in"},{"t":8380,"text":"- building transformer as opposed to the pad - mounted"},{"t":8384,"text":"transformer. However, that is not contained in your motion as"},{"t":8387,"text":"the applicant decline to pursue that option due to costs."},{"t":8396,"text":"Finally, we can go to a few of the renderings."},{"t":8399,"text":"This is the rendering from the street. And here is"},{"t":8405,"text":"more of a contextual rendering showing the building and relation"},{"t":8409,"text":"to some of the nearby residential buildings. To conclude, the"},{"t":8416,"text":"proposal is considered consistent with the use and height and"},{"t":8421,"text":"visioned in the OCP. And further, the proposal would advance"},{"t":8427,"text":"key OCP objective to expand on tourism capacity. As noted,"},{"t":8432,"text":"there are the recommended motion does include revisions, most notably"},{"t":8436,"text":"to the increased rear lot line setback. And therefore, it"},{"t":8441,"text":"is recommended that the application be advanced to bylaw readings,"},{"t":8446,"text":"subject to the revision's contained in the motion. Thank you,"},{"t":8450,"text":"and I'll take a questions. Thank you, Mr. Carroll. Before"},{"t":8453,"text":"we go to Councillor Gardner, who asked this to be"},{"t":8455,"text":"removed from consent, one clarification, you mentioned in your presentation"},{"t":8459,"text":"that removing that space there in the Red Block would"},{"t":8464,"text":"have an impact on the provision of bathrooms in the"},{"t":8467,"text":"hotel rooms. Does that mean that it's possible to do"},{"t":8470,"text":"that. You noted one of the revisions that you suggested"},{"t":8474,"text":"was declined. The other two, I presume, are doable. Including"},{"t":8477,"text":"this one. Thank you, Mayor. Thank you for the question."},{"t":8482,"text":"Uh, yes, to clarify, so that what is occupying this"},{"t":8485,"text":"space is actually bathrooms that extend past the smallest of"},{"t":8491,"text":"the guest rooms towards the rear. There's also the rear"},{"t":8494,"text":"stairs. We have had discussions with the applicants related to"},{"t":8500,"text":"this, um, condition contained. And it is certainly possible to"},{"t":8507,"text":"redesign the bathrooms back into the building as it was"},{"t":8512,"text":"initially shown that way in previous iterations. However, the applicant"},{"t":8517,"text":"did indicate that the removal of the stairs and the"},{"t":8520,"text":"redesigning that into the footprint of the building behind that"},{"t":8525,"text":"eight metre setback line would be more challenging. And that"},{"t":8529,"text":"was why they wish to be advanced to council, and"},{"t":8533,"text":"they would have to further consider, uh, what can be"},{"t":8535,"text":"done there. A quick estimate is that somewhere in the"},{"t":8539,"text":"realm of maybe five guest rooms could be lost to"},{"t":8543,"text":"pull all of that portion of the encroachment back within"},{"t":8546,"text":"the building footprint. Very good, thank you. Uh, Councillor Gardner,"},{"t":8551,"text":"you asked for this to be removed from consent. Why"},{"t":8553,"text":"don't you start by asking me your questions? Thank you."},{"t":8556,"text":"Thank you for the presentation at Clarify a lot. Really"},{"t":8559,"text":"did. Several questions. Would this hotel have been stacked 24"},{"t":8563,"text":"- 7. Do you know that, Mr. Carroll? Uh, through"},{"t":8568,"text":"to the mayor, thank you for that question. Uh, contained"},{"t":8572,"text":"in our zoning bylaw, there is a requirement that it"},{"t":8576,"text":"be staffed and that there'd be an available attendant at"},{"t":8580,"text":"all hours of the day. So the applicant has tailored"},{"t":8583,"text":"the proposal to meet that definition. So the answer would"},{"t":8585,"text":"be, um, yes. Okay, available means on - site. Mr."},{"t":8590,"text":"Girl. Uh. Through to the mayor, I would have to"},{"t":8596,"text":"maybe defer to one of my colleagues that might have"},{"t":8600,"text":"more specific knowledge on that. Mr. Handy. Uh, thank you,"},{"t":8607,"text":"Jim Handy acting assistant directed balance. So I can't hear"},{"t":8610,"text":"you. Sorry, Jim Handy acting assistant director development services, um,"},{"t":8615,"text":"through the language in the zoning bylaw is left deliberately"},{"t":8619,"text":"flexible to allow hotel operators to put forward different kind"},{"t":8627,"text":"of management programs in place to manage the property and"},{"t":8632,"text":"provide attendance on site. So, uh, whilst the lobby has"},{"t":8636,"text":"been provided, um, an attendant could be provided in many"},{"t":8640,"text":"different ways. Um, so there's no guarantee, and the zoning"},{"t":8645,"text":"by a law that the attendant is on site, um,"},{"t":8647,"text":"24 hours, um, seven days a week. They could put"},{"t":8651,"text":"forward a different proposal, all that stuff would review to"},{"t":8654,"text":"demonstrate compliance with the zoning biolog. So the answer is"},{"t":8657,"text":"no. Okay, thank you. Where is Staff parking. Miss Carol,"},{"t":8664,"text":"do you know that? Or is there staff parking on"},{"t":8666,"text":"this site? Through to the mayor, so the parking count"},{"t":8672,"text":"is based on the use. And so unlike a residential"},{"t":8676,"text":"use where there's specified visitor parking as well, um, as"},{"t":8680,"text":"unit parking, we do not have designated stalls except for,"},{"t":8686,"text":"uh, accessibility parking. Um, so we don't have that, um,"},{"t":8690,"text":"outlined, and, uh, I haven't been given that level of"},{"t":8694,"text":"clarification by the applicant. Thank you. So no staff necessarily"},{"t":8700,"text":"and no parking for staff. Where is the waste management"},{"t":8703,"text":"in this. Girl. Uh, thank you for the question. Through"},{"t":8708,"text":"to the mayor, it is located in the lowest level."},{"t":8713,"text":"So the first story of the building, and it is"},{"t":8715,"text":"located adjacent to the vehicle parking. Inside. Through to the"},{"t":8722,"text":"mayor, that's correct. And you're thinking of narrowing a driveway."},{"t":8728,"text":"Uh, through to the mayor, thank you for that question."},{"t":8731,"text":"This was something in consultation with our transportation team. Um,"},{"t":8735,"text":"we are recommending that there could be a reduction in"},{"t":8739,"text":"this dry vial with, at least for the, um, driveway"},{"t":8743,"text":"crossing portion. So that's the portion that is adjacent to"},{"t":8746,"text":"the planted street trees. So staff had an inclination that"},{"t":8750,"text":"that if possible would benefit, um, the street tree is"},{"t":8753,"text":"being proposed. And so we know certainly that it is"},{"t":8757,"text":"feasible for the driveway crossing portion. And whether that reduction"},{"t":8763,"text":"and width can carry forward right to the garage door"},{"t":8766,"text":"is something we'll have to have a discussion with the"},{"t":8769,"text":"applicant in their architect on with waste vehicles, I hope."},{"t":8774,"text":"Okay. Um, slide number 21."},{"t":8789,"text":"Okay, what is the, uh, setback on the adjoining property"},{"t":8793,"text":"to the sidewalk and on this proposed property to the"},{"t":8796,"text":"sidewalk. Skill. COUR. Through to the mayor, could you clarify"},{"t":8803,"text":"which adjoining property we'd be speaking of the one walkup"},{"t":8807,"text":"apartment on Auckland? Yes. I just give me one moment."},{"t":8840,"text":"Okay. So this will be an approximation because I am"},{"t":8843,"text":"just using my mapping, um, but from what I can"},{"t":8846,"text":"see to be the building face. We have."},{"t":8858,"text":"Approximately seven metres. Which. And it believes it does appear"},{"t":8864,"text":"that the entrance is a little bit less. So it"},{"t":8867,"text":"would be, let me get that for you as well."},{"t":8869,"text":"So about five and a half metres, it appears from"},{"t":8871,"text":"the front entry to the fronting property line on Rockland"},{"t":8875,"text":"Avenue. And on the fourth story. That's on the fourth"},{"t":8879,"text":"story. Okay. And how much on the proposed one? Uh,"},{"t":8881,"text":"so it is just over four metres through the marriage,"},{"t":8884,"text":"just over four metres, 4. 1 actually. So this will"},{"t":8887,"text":"jump forward one and a half metres further than the"},{"t":8889,"text":"other. What is they set back of the building next"},{"t":8892,"text":"to the four story. I'm looking at the whole street"},{"t":8895,"text":"scape to see if this interrupts it. So just to"},{"t":8901,"text":"be clear, you're asking for the building that's not in"},{"t":8903,"text":"this picture? That's to the east? Yes. Yes. So that"},{"t":8907,"text":"just for those watching through to the mayor, that would"},{"t":8910,"text":"be 1144 Rockland. And I'm seeing it's a bit further"},{"t":8914,"text":"set back, closer to seven metres for that. So this"},{"t":8919,"text":"will really change the street skate. Okay. Um, how given"},{"t":8924,"text":"the schematic of zero on the, um, you side, I"},{"t":8928,"text":"guess it is. How about they have access to the"},{"t":8931,"text":"property with zero setback. For repairs or anything else. Uh,"},{"t":8937,"text":"through to the mayor, thank you for that question. Maybe"},{"t":8939,"text":"I will just go back to a site plan as"},{"t":8942,"text":"a visual. So the, in terms of that side, so"},{"t":8950,"text":"the zero near zero lot line side, that is only"},{"t":8953,"text":"for the first story. And it would be for that"},{"t":8956,"text":"guest entry. So you would not be able to walk"},{"t":8959,"text":"down that side, um, but there is a full pedestrian"},{"t":8962,"text":"access on the opposite on the west side that does"},{"t":8966,"text":"allow you to go around to the rear of the"},{"t":8968,"text":"building. And there is even provision for a short path"},{"t":8973,"text":"for maintenance purposes to the service of the building. I'm"},{"t":8976,"text":"thinking of repair for the east side. Painting, repair, a"},{"t":8981,"text":"leak. Should there be something that needs to be done"},{"t":8985,"text":"to the east side of the building? How would they"},{"t":8987,"text":"access that? Uh, through the mayor, I can see some"},{"t":8991,"text":"of my colleagues are leaning in. They may have more"},{"t":8993,"text":"information than I on that. Thank you through the mayor"},{"t":8999,"text":"Charlotte Wayne, manage of neighbourhood development planning. Um, the application"},{"t":9002,"text":"has been reviewed by our permits and inspections department and"},{"t":9006,"text":"the proposal would need to meet all the relevant building"},{"t":9009,"text":"code requirements in terms of separation space. Um, so, so,"},{"t":9016,"text":"uh, there would be a solution for maintenance. Sorry. We"},{"t":9020,"text":"would expect there would be a solution for maintenance. Because"},{"t":9025,"text":"the poser would be required to meet building code requirements"},{"t":9029,"text":"from engineering have determined that there is a manageable way"},{"t":9033,"text":"for that work to be done given the application. So"},{"t":9039,"text":"our stuff of the mayor, all we could indicate is"},{"t":9042,"text":"when our, our applications are reviewed by various departments. Our"},{"t":9046,"text":"permits and inspections team did review this and they did"},{"t":9048,"text":"not indicate as specific concern. That's as much as I"},{"t":9051,"text":"could say to that. Good engineering, please reply. Mr. Doyle,"},{"t":9057,"text":"do you have anything to add. Sorry, did we bear"},{"t":9064,"text":"nothing to her? Nothing to add? Okay. Councillor. You mentioned"},{"t":9069,"text":"the backstairwell how many stairwells are there in the building."},{"t":9072,"text":"How many stairways? Ms. Carol? Uh, through to the mayor,"},{"t":9076,"text":"there is a single elevator, but there are two stairs"},{"t":9078,"text":"as required under the building code. And the, the encroaching"},{"t":9082,"text":"portion is the rear stair, of course. Thank you. Um."},{"t":9090,"text":"I'm going by some comments we got from people who"},{"t":9092,"text":"wrote into us. Uh, what is the most common room"},{"t":9095,"text":"size. Down to the mayor. Just give me one second."},{"t":9101,"text":"I do have this all noted. Uh, so through to"},{"t":9110,"text":"the mayor, I'll give you a bit of a summary."},{"t":9113,"text":"So seven of the 30 units are less than 250"},{"t":9116,"text":"square feet. There are 10 that are less than 300"},{"t":9120,"text":"square feet. The majority of them 15 of them are"},{"t":9124,"text":"with between 300 and 450 square feet. And there are"},{"t":9129,"text":"five that are more than 500 square feet. And the"},{"t":9132,"text":"two that are above 600. And some of them do"},{"t":9135,"text":"contain two rooms. Although the majority would be single room."},{"t":9142,"text":"Yeah. So I would think so. That square footage. It'd"},{"t":9143,"text":"be single. So the restaurant, who are the intended clientele"},{"t":9148,"text":"given this small size of these rooms and no real"},{"t":9151,"text":"facilities on site. Mr. Girl? Uh, sure. That's part of"},{"t":9155,"text":"the material consideration of the application, but you're welcome to"},{"t":9159,"text":"venture an opinion. Uh, through to the mayor, thank you."},{"t":9162,"text":"Uh, all I could weigh in is what was provided"},{"t":9164,"text":"in terms of the letter to Marin Council and discussions"},{"t":9167,"text":"with the applicant. And in terms of target market, there"},{"t":9171,"text":"were no details specified about a specific target market, but"},{"t":9175,"text":"rather that there would be demand for, um, more of"},{"t":9178,"text":"a boutique type hotel with kitchenets and this format, um,"},{"t":9182,"text":"and that there would be a market for that. Are"},{"t":9184,"text":"the 250 or less than 250 square feet? Uh, going"},{"t":9187,"text":"to have kitchenets. Uh, through to the mayor, uh, the"},{"t":9192,"text":"application and the proposed plans do show at least some"},{"t":9195,"text":"level of kitchenette for all units. I do know that"},{"t":9198,"text":"the counter space and the size certainly is relative to"},{"t":9201,"text":"the size of the unit as well. So, and we"},{"t":9203,"text":"don't receive details about specific appliances at this phase. Well,"},{"t":9208,"text":"they have closets. Mr. Carroll. Through the mayor, I believe"},{"t":9214,"text":"they do. I would have to go, I'll double check"},{"t":9217,"text":"that because maybe it's possible, um, maybe some of the"},{"t":9220,"text":"smaller ones do not. Okay. Given the food service, what"},{"t":9226,"text":"is the anticipated activity. Or use of the rooftop open"},{"t":9230,"text":"space since we don't have real kitchens and a lot"},{"t":9233,"text":"of them. So you don't have fridges. So what's the"},{"t":9236,"text":"use of the rooftop when the food services? So you're"},{"t":9238,"text":"not going to kind of wander up there for a"},{"t":9240,"text":"meal. Ms. Carol. Uh, through to the mayor, again, these"},{"t":9247,"text":"are just not details that we receive. I do note"},{"t":9250,"text":"the kitchen appliances or any of those aspects on the"},{"t":9254,"text":"roof. So the roof is really just a large area"},{"t":9256,"text":"for gathering. And I think it would come down to"},{"t":9258,"text":"the hotel operator to furnish it as the, as they"},{"t":9261,"text":"would. Thank you. The vote to our operator that isn't"},{"t":9265,"text":"on sight. Okay. I've we discussed the waste. I had"},{"t":9268,"text":"another question story. It was out of order. The ways"},{"t":9270,"text":"pickup area is going to be inside thinking of narrowing"},{"t":9273,"text":"the driveway yet with trucks humans can be a truck"},{"t":9276,"text":"during the pickup. It's going to have a turning radius"},{"t":9279,"text":"that may interrupt with the street. Will it? I mean,"},{"t":9283,"text":"how are we dealing with a turning radius going into"},{"t":9285,"text":"a more narrow driveway and going in there for waste"},{"t":9289,"text":"pickup. Girl? Uh, thank you for the question. Through to"},{"t":9293,"text":"the mayor, I can say that the turn radius of"},{"t":9297,"text":"the park installs and the drive I'll lead into it."},{"t":9301,"text":"We're all reviewed as part of a parking study that"},{"t":9304,"text":"the applicant had submitted in 2015. So I would lean"},{"t":9307,"text":"on my, um, my, my colleagues in transportation as they"},{"t":9311,"text":"may be able to elaborate. But I can say that"},{"t":9314,"text":"the, um, turning radius, uh, was analysed and not considered"},{"t":9319,"text":"an issue in this case. Um, there were a few"},{"t":9321,"text":"iterations of parking that I do believe did relate to,"},{"t":9325,"text":"um, stalls that were not as maneuverable. And those have"},{"t":9328,"text":"been since removed. Thank you. I was thinking of stalls."},{"t":9330,"text":"I was thinking of the trucks for waste pickup. Mr."},{"t":9333,"text":"Kenny, do you have anything to add to this as"},{"t":9335,"text":"to the accessibility from service vehicles for this particular design."},{"t":9340,"text":"Uh, through the mayor. So typically for most sites, what"},{"t":9343,"text":"we're seeing is like a, like a swamper truck. So"},{"t":9346,"text":"a smaller pickup truck that attends sites to move the"},{"t":9348,"text":"bins to a place at the larger waste collection vehicle"},{"t":9351,"text":"can get to them. Um, generally we're looking again, storage,"},{"t":9355,"text":"um, on site. In this case, you know, what we"},{"t":9358,"text":"see in many buildings is, um, designated, you know, spots"},{"t":9361,"text":"on the roadway where we're seeing bins be collected, accommodating."},{"t":9366,"text":"For a large full size garbage pickup, you know, would"},{"t":9369,"text":"have likely have major implications on the building itself, just"},{"t":9372,"text":"given the height and width and other issues. So, um,"},{"t":9376,"text":"and the narrower driveway in this case allows us to"},{"t":9378,"text":"plant two boulevard trees, which we saw as beneficial. Thank"},{"t":9380,"text":"you. So were there be dedicated space on the street"},{"t":9382,"text":"for the truck to wait while the little vehicle goes"},{"t":9384,"text":"in and picks up the waist? Uh, through the mayor."},{"t":9389,"text":"So typically what we're seeing is, you know, the, the"},{"t":9391,"text":"vehicle in front is, you know, is a ways ahead"},{"t":9394,"text":"of that larger truck. Um, and, you know, and does"},{"t":9397,"text":"circles of the block and pulling out multiple buildings. So"},{"t":9399,"text":"they're, well, they work together in tandem. Um, you know,"},{"t":9403,"text":"they're not necessarily there at the same time, you know,"},{"t":9406,"text":"backing up and moving together. Um, typically what we're asking"},{"t":9411,"text":"is also for any of these buildings that in the"},{"t":9413,"text":"interim that those bins are put on private property. So"},{"t":9417,"text":"not stored on the roadway, though in this case, um,"},{"t":9420,"text":"we don't have that dedicated on the building site, but"},{"t":9422,"text":"would be a requirement that we would ask for. I'm"},{"t":9424,"text":"a bit confused. So the truck that's a bigger truck"},{"t":9427,"text":"rather than one that's moving the stuff out. Where will"},{"t":9429,"text":"it park. To pick up the load. Mr. Kenny? Um,"},{"t":9435,"text":"so the truck that is actually picking up the waist"},{"t":9437,"text":"would be somewhere else. So the bin would not be"},{"t":9439,"text":"stored on Rockland. Um, what we require, sorry, I'm just"},{"t":9443,"text":"getting notes from my planning team here. Um, but typically"},{"t":9446,"text":"what we would see is bins going to, uh, you"},{"t":9448,"text":"know, somewhere offsite. So not on the arterial road and"},{"t":9452,"text":"in what we ask, it requires it to be on"},{"t":9454,"text":"a private lot somewhere else. So we don't know where"},{"t":9457,"text":"that bin would be when it goes from the smaller"},{"t":9460,"text":"truck to the larger track, but the larger truck would"},{"t":9462,"text":"not be there on Rockland servicing the site directly. Is"},{"t":9467,"text":"there a place in the city that weed. I'm getting"},{"t":9469,"text":"quite confused by this. Sorry. Through the marriage, this isn't"},{"t":9473,"text":"one that we regulated this time. Though, you know, the"},{"t":9476,"text":"storage of bins on the public street, even for pickup"},{"t":9479,"text":"is currently contrary to the bylaw. I'm sorry. I need"},{"t":9487,"text":"clarification. So you've got a little truck that takes things"},{"t":9489,"text":"out. I know this because of our building, but you"},{"t":9491,"text":"need a place for the big truck. So that big"},{"t":9492,"text":"truck could be wearing, okay? I mean, where's the bigger"},{"t":9495,"text":"truck that they're going to take things to. Mr. Kenney,"},{"t":9499,"text":"can you, in a simple fashion, describe exactly how this"},{"t":9502,"text":"will work? Or Mr. Carroll. Is one of you. Through"},{"t":9508,"text":"the mayor, so the small truck, uh, would pick up"},{"t":9511,"text":"that bin and take it to a private lot somewhere"},{"t":9514,"text":"else. And we do not regulate where that is happening"},{"t":9517,"text":"currently for say multifamily buildings such as this. Um, and"},{"t":9521,"text":"then they would service it on their own business practice."},{"t":9524,"text":"So that could be somewhere in Rock Bay. That could"},{"t":9526,"text":"be somewhere else in the city, a surface parking lot"},{"t":9528,"text":"where they have an agreement, but we don't know. So"},{"t":9531,"text":"we just regulate again that the garbage is there and"},{"t":9533,"text":"that they're not, uh, legally allowed to store it on"},{"t":9536,"text":"the city right of way. Okay. Um, thank you. Um,"},{"t":9540,"text":"the project data table under existing zone density suggests an"},{"t":9544,"text":"amenity contribution for the shifter density from one to two."},{"t":9548,"text":"What was that amenity amount, even if it is not"},{"t":9551,"text":"an effect now, what was that amount before the change"},{"t":9554,"text":"of use. Give me one second just to bring that"},{"t":9561,"text":"up. And that's in the zoning under the GRD one"},{"t":9564,"text":"zone. Mr. Handy. Thank you Meroralton. And through you, sorry."},{"t":9573,"text":"I just had this on my screen so I can"},{"t":9575,"text":"speak to it. And this related to a form of"},{"t":9579,"text":"proposal for residential development on the site. It's a different"},{"t":9583,"text":"proposal. Um, the base density that was allowed, um, and"},{"t":9587,"text":"under the zone associated with that proposal was one -"},{"t":9589,"text":"to - one FSR up to two FSR. If they're"},{"t":9594,"text":"provided an amenity contribution to 144, 000 dollars, um, and"},{"t":9603,"text":"also entered into a housing agreement to secure two of"},{"t":9606,"text":"the residential units as below market affordable housing. Okay. And"},{"t":9610,"text":"that, of course, wasn't realised because they didn't proceed, correct?"},{"t":9613,"text":"Thank you. Okay. A few weeks ago, 84 million dollar"},{"t":9616,"text":"benefits through an attacks exemption was approved for hotels. What"},{"t":9619,"text":"might be the exemption for this hotel? Mr. Carroll, is"},{"t":9625,"text":"that something you can answer? Uh, through to the mayor,"},{"t":9628,"text":"perhaps my colleagues could weigh in. I'm not aware. All"},{"t":9631,"text":"I do know is I followed that in the council"},{"t":9634,"text":"discussion and did make the applicant aware of the status"},{"t":9638,"text":"of discussions, as I understood them, but that would be"},{"t":9640,"text":"the extent of my discussions. Ms. Thompson, is that something"},{"t":9642,"text":"that you have been involved with at that conversation? Um,"},{"t":9647,"text":"through you mayor. So the council will still have to"},{"t":9650,"text":"consider a bylaw for this program. So this program actually"},{"t":9654,"text":"does not exist yet. We do have council direction to"},{"t":9656,"text":"bring something forward. And at that time, uh, that would"},{"t":9659,"text":"outline the program objectives as well as, uh, which properties"},{"t":9664,"text":"would be eligible. So it is too early to say"},{"t":9667,"text":"whether this property would be eligible under that program, um,"},{"t":9670,"text":"until the time that council actually considers the bylaws. Very"},{"t":9673,"text":"good. Thank you. Okay. So just to clarify though, rather"},{"t":9676,"text":"than the city receiving an amenity of a hundred and"},{"t":9680,"text":"what was it. 144, 000 dollars. Uh, there's going to"},{"t":9686,"text":"probably be some tax exemption, not yet a determined, which"},{"t":9690,"text":"means we're talking quite a bit of difference in here"},{"t":9692,"text":"in the use has created much more, shall we say,"},{"t":9696,"text":"um, obligation on behalf of the taxpayer to subsidize this"},{"t":9701,"text":"building in one way or another. So I just want"},{"t":9703,"text":"to make sure that I have that right. The question"},{"t":9705,"text":"there, Councillor? Okay. No, I just want to clarify. Is"},{"t":9707,"text":"that, is that interpretation more or less correct. Down that"},{"t":9713,"text":"sounds a little bit like a financial question. Um, through"},{"t":9716,"text":"Marisol, it will depend on that ultimate bylaw program by"},{"t":9721,"text":"law, that council will consider. So at this point we"},{"t":9723,"text":"can't say whether this property would be eligible or not."},{"t":9726,"text":"Thank you. I'd like to make an amendment. Now the"},{"t":9728,"text":"time there. Uh, it's not on the floor yet. We're"},{"t":9731,"text":"still doing. Okay. What an ears on the floor. I'll"},{"t":9733,"text":"have an amendment. Thank you. Council Heyman, do you had"},{"t":9736,"text":"some questions. That's mayor I do. The OCP describes this"},{"t":9742,"text":"area's residential fabric primarily intended for residential use. What is"},{"t":9748,"text":"the planning principle that makes a 30 room hotel appropriate"},{"t":9753,"text":"here simply because the site is close to downtown. Mr."},{"t":9758,"text":"Carroll. Uh, through to the mayor, thank you for that"},{"t":9761,"text":"question. Uh, so as noted in the presentation as well"},{"t":9765,"text":"as the council report, um, we do look at the"},{"t":9768,"text":"OCP in terms of less in terms of hard boundary"},{"t":9772,"text":"lines and do kind of consider walkability and proximity to"},{"t":9777,"text":"various, um, either villages or the downtown in this case."},{"t":9781,"text":"And so in this case, given that the property is"},{"t":9784,"text":"directly abutting the downtown core area, uh, where a full"},{"t":9788,"text":"range of commercial type uses, including tourism accommodations would be"},{"t":9793,"text":"not just supported, but encouraged. We did feel that the,"},{"t":9797,"text":"uh, and determined that the, um, the OCP does support"},{"t":9802,"text":"this location for a standalone commercial, um, property. Okay. So"},{"t":9808,"text":"where then does the around the downtown core end? What"},{"t":9812,"text":"prevents hotel uses gradually extending further into residential streets. Ms."},{"t":9819,"text":"Wayne. Thank you through the mayor. Um, I'll respond to"},{"t":9824,"text":"this one. I just, I feel like I've got a"},{"t":9825,"text":"couple of points just to add to Mr. Carroll's point"},{"t":9828,"text":"from the previous question. Hopefully this will answer your question"},{"t":9830,"text":"now. Um, so through the mayor, as Mr. Carroll mentioned,"},{"t":9835,"text":"um, our boundaries are defined when it becomes to zoning"},{"t":9841,"text":"regulations and development permataries. They follow property lines. And there"},{"t":9845,"text":"is a very distinct, um, clear boundary for those parts"},{"t":9848,"text":"of the regulations and approved council policy. However, the official"},{"t":9853,"text":"community plan that council has adopted is a lot more"},{"t":9856,"text":"broad in its application. Um, so when we look to"},{"t":9861,"text":"see whether changing uses supportable, we look to the official"},{"t":9864,"text":"Community plan. This site is well within the downtown core"},{"t":9869,"text":"broad strokes of the, uh, of the urban structure concept."},{"t":9872,"text":"And so that is how staff have determined that, um,"},{"t":9877,"text":"proposal is supportable in terms of its use. Um, as"},{"t":9882,"text":"we've mentioned in previous responses to this question, every application"},{"t":9885,"text":"is viewed on its own merits. Um, and, uh, the"},{"t":9890,"text":"supportability of this one does not necessarily imply that another"},{"t":9893,"text":"hotel would be supportable on the same street. And when"},{"t":9898,"text":"you responded through the mayor, when you're funded, you used"},{"t":9900,"text":"air quotes. So we're, just to give any kind of,"},{"t":9904,"text":"um, um, sort of consideration for the neighbourhood. When do"},{"t":9909,"text":"those air quotes end? Um, as to, like, is it"},{"t":9913,"text":"a block from there? Would that still be okay for"},{"t":9915,"text":"a hotel? Like a block further, um, east. Is win."},{"t":9921,"text":"Thanks for the question through the mayor. I think the"},{"t":9925,"text":"intention of this urban structure concept diagram was, was to"},{"t":9928,"text":"be flexible. And the OCP is, is by its nature"},{"t":9932,"text":"very flexible and its approach. Um, I guess, uh, it's"},{"t":9939,"text":"hard to determine where they end because by its nature,"},{"t":9942,"text":"it is intended to be, um, a high level document."},{"t":9949,"text":"I think that's the best way I can answer that"},{"t":9951,"text":"question. Hopefully that has given you. That's fair answer. The"},{"t":9956,"text":"difficulties it won't lead to a lot of certainty for"},{"t":9958,"text":"neighbourhoods, I think. So council previously approved the residential development"},{"t":9963,"text":"here. What public policy benefit justifies replacing an approved residential"},{"t":9967,"text":"use with visitor accommodation. Ms. Wayne, this seems to be"},{"t":9973,"text":"something that you're dealing with primarily, unless Mr. Carroll, you'd"},{"t":9976,"text":"like to weigh in. I think. Mr. Johnson wants to."},{"t":9980,"text":"Or Mr. Johnstown. Thank you through the mayor. I just"},{"t":9985,"text":"wanted to elaborate on some of Ms. Wayne's comments as"},{"t":9988,"text":"well. Um, in terms of the question of, you know,"},{"t":9992,"text":"where might be deemed in appropriate location for a hotel"},{"t":9995,"text":"in different parts of the city. And I just wanted"},{"t":9996,"text":"to add that, um, hotels can take many different forms."},{"t":10000,"text":"Uh, and can operate it various scales. So we have"},{"t":10004,"text":"had examples of hotels that are quite small with only"},{"t":10007,"text":"six units. Um, there was one that recently came to"},{"t":10009,"text":"council and was approved. Um, all the way up to"},{"t":10013,"text":"full service hotels. And I think the appropriateness, uh, we're"},{"t":10016,"text":"looking at the context and how the design, how the,"},{"t":10020,"text":"how the proposal responds to the context in this case,"},{"t":10024,"text":"um, while this is a hotel application, the design of"},{"t":10028,"text":"the building still maintains that sort of residential type character"},{"t":10032,"text":"that fits well in the residential fabric in this transitional"},{"t":10035,"text":"zone, uh, on the edge of Downtown, um, whereas a"},{"t":10038,"text":"different design approach might be more appropriate in a more"},{"t":10041,"text":"residential area of the city. So I think it's, it's"},{"t":10043,"text":"hard to say definitively, you know, which areas may be"},{"t":10047,"text":"appropriate for hotels and which wouldn't. I think we would"},{"t":10049,"text":"be looking at each application on its own merits. And"},{"t":10052,"text":"it's, um, ability to achieve the objectives in not only"},{"t":10055,"text":"our policies, but our design guidelines. I hope that's helpful."},{"t":10059,"text":"Thank you. Councillor. Sure. Thanks. Now this development, um, and"},{"t":10064,"text":"we heard from the developer that was first considered for,"},{"t":10068,"text":"uh, condos, I believe. And then for rental. And they"},{"t":10072,"text":"concluded it wasn't financially viable. So is a project viability"},{"t":10076,"text":"for the current owner itself of planning justification or should"},{"t":10080,"text":"council primarily consider whether hotel use is preferable to residential"},{"t":10084,"text":"use of this location. Ms. Wayne. Thanks to the question."},{"t":10089,"text":"The viability is not a matter of. Council's considerations. We"},{"t":10092,"text":"don't have any policies that speak to that. The Community"},{"t":10096,"text":"Consultation was based on five stories in the proposal subsequently"},{"t":10100,"text":"became six. Why should council advance it before the new"},{"t":10104,"text":"scale has actually gone back to the neighbourhood. Mr. Geryl."},{"t":10111,"text":"Uh, through the mayor, thank you for the question. Uh,"},{"t":10113,"text":"so that is included in one of the conditions, which"},{"t":10117,"text":"is not typical. Normally we would go back to the"},{"t":10120,"text":"CALOC prior to proceeding to council. Um, in this case,"},{"t":10125,"text":"uh, when the reviews were concluded and the applicant was"},{"t":10128,"text":"informed that Second Community meeting would be triggered due to"},{"t":10131,"text":"the increased height. At the time, um, it was, uh,"},{"t":10137,"text":"we reached out to the CALOC and they do have"},{"t":10139,"text":"the opportunity to waive that meeting. And we are still"},{"t":10142,"text":"waiting for a reply from that. So we did choose"},{"t":10145,"text":"to advance the application and keep that in as a"},{"t":10149,"text":"condition, uh, rather than completing that, um, prior to returning"},{"t":10153,"text":"to council. Okay. Thank you. And through the mayor, then"},{"t":10157,"text":"let's say this gets approved. It goes to calik. They"},{"t":10160,"text":"say, no, do you come back to us or no?"},{"t":10162,"text":"It's true. Uh, through the mayor, thank you for that"},{"t":10165,"text":"question. Uh, correct. So if council advances the application today,"},{"t":10170,"text":"of course you're not approving your, your advancing the application"},{"t":10173,"text":"to send out the notifications. There's also the conditions that"},{"t":10177,"text":"are design related. And so the intention would be if"},{"t":10182,"text":"it precedes as per the recommended motion, the applicant would"},{"t":10186,"text":"make the revisions contained in the conditions. There would be"},{"t":10189,"text":"the added benefit of the CALUC then seen the closest"},{"t":10194,"text":"to final version of the plans. And they would need"},{"t":10197,"text":"to complete that meeting. And we would be reporting back"},{"t":10200,"text":"to council through as part of the report update report,"},{"t":10205,"text":"where we brought forward introductory readings. Thanks. The advisory design"},{"t":10212,"text":"panel recommended declining the earlier five - story proposal because"},{"t":10215,"text":"of setbacks. We now have a different use and additional"},{"t":10219,"text":"story. Why was the second ADP review not warranted? Mr."},{"t":10224,"text":"Carroll. Uh, through to the Mayor, thanks you for that"},{"t":10228,"text":"question. Uh, so the ADP, the previous ADP meeting, as"},{"t":10232,"text":"you know, the use was at that time residential. However,"},{"t":10235,"text":"I would emphasize that the proposed design was actually very,"},{"t":10240,"text":"very similar. Now, it was not reflecting the six story."},{"t":10245,"text":"The additional story, because that's actually one of the latest"},{"t":10247,"text":"revisions made by the applicant. Uh, but at the time"},{"t":10250,"text":"when we brought in this new rezoning for the proposed"},{"t":10254,"text":"hotel use, the design was not significantly different. So we"},{"t":10259,"text":"made the choice not to return to the advisory design"},{"t":10262,"text":"panel, given there was not substantial differences at that time."},{"t":10267,"text":"So you're feeling that the, there's been further, sorry, reduced"},{"t":10273,"text":"setbacks since that time. Is that the case or no?"},{"t":10277,"text":"I know there's been extra height. Yeah. Through to the"},{"t":10280,"text":"mayor, uh, thank you for that question. That's an excellent"},{"t":10283,"text":"question. Actually, the increase in height was an effort from"},{"t":10286,"text":"the applicant to address staff concerns that the rear yard"},{"t":10290,"text":"setback was insufficient. So the setbacks have been improved since"},{"t":10293,"text":"it was presented to the, um, ADP. And I would"},{"t":10297,"text":"note that what was presented to the ADP was also"},{"t":10300,"text":"approved by council. And when you're talking about the setbacks,"},{"t":10306,"text":"um, staff or say that you need to approximately eight"},{"t":10311,"text":"metres. And this proposal for 5. 4 metres. And then"},{"t":10314,"text":"I notice of some reference to that in your presentation."},{"t":10318,"text":"So is the idea that, um, that you would work"},{"t":10321,"text":"on getting that larger, somewhere between 5. 4 and eight"},{"t":10325,"text":"metres or two eight metres. Mr. Carol. Uh, through the"},{"t":10328,"text":"mayor, uh, exactly. Yes. The intention and what we've encouraged"},{"t":10332,"text":"with the applicant is to achieve eight metres full across"},{"t":10336,"text":"that rear side for the benefit of course advancing urban"},{"t":10341,"text":"forest objective store motor objectives and amenity space as well"},{"t":10346,"text":"as the adjacency with the abutting property to the north."},{"t":10350,"text":"And therefore, through the mayor that if that tree is"},{"t":10354,"text":"in serious risk or risk, uh, then staff would not"},{"t":10358,"text":"be proposing going ahead if it gets, um, council approval."},{"t":10363,"text":"Through to the mayor, all I could say perhaps my"},{"t":10367,"text":"parks, uh, colleagues want to elaborate, um, however, at least"},{"t":10372,"text":"the arborist report provided and staff have concurred with its"},{"t":10375,"text":"findings to date is that the tree is suitable for"},{"t":10379,"text":"retention even at the 5. 4 metre setback. However, it"},{"t":10385,"text":"has been made clear to me by staff that, um,"},{"t":10388,"text":"it would benefit the long - term survival of that"},{"t":10391,"text":"tree to have more breathing room and more space. And"},{"t":10395,"text":"also for the full growth of the proposed new trees"},{"t":10399,"text":"that are also in the great thanks. And I think"},{"t":10402,"text":"the last one is about parking and it's different and"},{"t":10405,"text":"slightly different way. But how confident is staff that force"},{"t":10407,"text":"basis are sufficient for a 30 hotel room or 30"},{"t":10411,"text":"hotel rooms employees deliveries and guest drop offs on a"},{"t":10414,"text":"street where parking is already limited. Through the mayor, again,"},{"t":10419,"text":"my colleagues in transportation may want to elaborate, but I"},{"t":10423,"text":"can weigh in as there was a parking study provided"},{"t":10426,"text":"and the Parkinson study that was provided did not indicate"},{"t":10431,"text":"a specific concern with either the traffic flow or the"},{"t":10435,"text":"parking and noted that the TDM proposed seem suitable to"},{"t":10441,"text":"the proposed variance. So that's about as much as I"},{"t":10443,"text":"could say without leaning on my colleagues. And this might"},{"t":10447,"text":"be my last question then, and perhaps I missed it,"},{"t":10451,"text":"but has staff estimated how many hotel guests and employees"},{"t":10453,"text":"will be arriving by car, um, and therefore, depending on"},{"t":10457,"text":"surrounding street parking. Secure? Uh, through the mayor, unfortunately, I"},{"t":10463,"text":"don't have that information pulled from the Parkinson study. I"},{"t":10467,"text":"believe it likely is, um, described in it. So I"},{"t":10470,"text":"would have to defer to my team in transportation who"},{"t":10473,"text":"did review that parkie. Okay. Mr. Kenney has left us"},{"t":10477,"text":"for the moment. And so I'm not sure whether he"},{"t":10479,"text":"has someone else. Mr. Doyle, do you have something that"},{"t":10480,"text":"you could offer. Just on comment from my colleagues on"},{"t":10486,"text":"the EcoPAST? More specifically, uh, that it's intended to, it's"},{"t":10490,"text":"directed at staff. And, uh, tended to reduce the need"},{"t":10493,"text":"for parking. But not for hotel guests. Correct. That would"},{"t":10499,"text":"just be for staff. And so we don't know how"},{"t":10501,"text":"many guests we expect to arrive with the car. Through"},{"t":10506,"text":"the mayor, the intensity of parking need generally various by,"},{"t":10510,"text":"by type. And so, uh, if this was a 30"},{"t":10513,"text":"unit residential building, the expected vehicle demand would be greater."},{"t":10517,"text":"But for a hotel, there tends to be a mix"},{"t":10519,"text":"of people, maybe arriving by taxi and vehicles. So less"},{"t":10521,"text":"intensive than if it was, say a comparably size department"},{"t":10524,"text":"building. Right. And therefore they feel, Staff feels comfortable that"},{"t":10529,"text":"four is good enough. Through the merit in conjunction with"},{"t":10533,"text":"the transportation to Biden management measures that the applicant has,"},{"t":10537,"text":"has been receptive too. We do believe it's sufficient. For"},{"t":10541,"text":"staff. But and then you're saying it's, it's, you don't"},{"t":10543,"text":"think many people believe the staff have answered the question."},{"t":10547,"text":"The question is yes, they are satisfied. Okay. Thank you."},{"t":10551,"text":"Anything else? No. Any other questions. Don't you Coleman? Thank"},{"t":10557,"text":"you. And through you your worship. Could you remind us"},{"t":10564,"text":"of this isn't an apartment style hotel, which is different"},{"t":10568,"text":"than a full service hotel. Could you give us some"},{"t":10571,"text":"other examples of apartment style hotels, uh, in the region"},{"t":10577,"text":"in the Victoria specifically. Mr. Carroll, are you aware of"},{"t":10581,"text":"any of such examples? Uh, through the mayor, um, fortunately"},{"t":10586,"text":"I'm not coming to anything that I would consider comparable"},{"t":10589,"text":"enough, um, but perhaps somebody else, um, one of my"},{"t":10593,"text":"colleagues may offhand know of a similar example. I'm not"},{"t":10598,"text":"seeing anybody leaning in. Councillor Kimet would be an appropriate"},{"t":10601,"text":"for you to offer anything at this point. So the"},{"t":10604,"text":"answer is we don't know. That's fine. Um, the reason"},{"t":10607,"text":"I ask is. I may be incorrect, but my understanding"},{"t":10611,"text":"is apartment hotels have the opportunity for full time, long"},{"t":10615,"text":"- term tendency and short - term tendency. Is that"},{"t":10619,"text":"your understanding. Mr. Girl, has that been raised in this"},{"t":10623,"text":"application? Uh, through to the mayor, uh, based on the"},{"t":10626,"text":"application materials, that is not the intention. The intention is"},{"t":10630,"text":"for a short - term stay hotel meeting our definition"},{"t":10634,"text":"in the zoning bylaw of hotel. Okay. So then a"},{"t":10639,"text":"follow on question would be this, the ownership of the"},{"t":10643,"text":"building stays in its entirety with the applicant. There is"},{"t":10647,"text":"no strategy. You can't buy into this. Through to the"},{"t":10651,"text":"mayor, thank you for that question. Yes, it has been"},{"t":10654,"text":"made clear that this is not, uh, intended to be"},{"t":10657,"text":"stratified and is, um, proposed as a strata hotel, which"},{"t":10661,"text":"is considered an objectively looked at differently in the zoning"},{"t":10665,"text":"bylaws definitions as well. Okay. Thank you. So then, um,"},{"t":10669,"text":"any rental activity that accrues to this will generate, uh,"},{"t":10674,"text":"destination marketing tax funds. Is that correct? Ms. Thompson, is"},{"t":10680,"text":"that correct. Three America. Do you please repeat the question?"},{"t":10684,"text":"So this is, there are some, if I look at"},{"t":10688,"text":"other, if I can give an example, if I look"},{"t":10691,"text":"at other places like the region hotel, there are some"},{"t":10695,"text":"permanent residents in there and there are some rooms that"},{"t":10698,"text":"are set for rental stock. Um, my understanding is the"},{"t":10703,"text":"rooms that are rented under hotel management generate some destination"},{"t":10708,"text":"marketing tax that goes to the DMRT. Is that correct?"},{"t":10712,"text":"And would that apply here. Um, uh, through the mayor,"},{"t":10717,"text":"I believe you are correct. Um, anything that would be"},{"t":10720,"text":"considered a hotel room, uh, and would fall under the"},{"t":10723,"text":"MDRT. And then that would flow as all other hotels."},{"t":10728,"text":"Okay. Thank you. Um, I'm getting, I'm going to bridge"},{"t":10734,"text":"into comments. So I'll hold off on that. Thank you."},{"t":10736,"text":"Thank you. Any other questions. Councillor Cardonell speak with you"},{"t":10742,"text":"about that matter a little bit later. Are there any"},{"t":10745,"text":"other questions. Would someone like to move staff recommendation. Councillor"},{"t":10749,"text":"Dellen, Councillor Cardona. Councillor Del, go ahead. Um, just to"},{"t":10756,"text":"say that I think this is a thoughtful proposal. I"},{"t":10759,"text":"like it. We need more hotel space in the city."},{"t":10762,"text":"Uh, I'm disappointed by the notion that hotels need to"},{"t":10765,"text":"be downtown. A lot of people don't want to stay"},{"t":10766,"text":"downtown. We have a great hotel in Oak Bay. Oak"},{"t":10769,"text":"Bay is a good spot. Rackland's a good spot. South"},{"t":10771,"text":"Jubilee by the hospital in my neighbourhood is a good"},{"t":10773,"text":"spot. So this is a great spot for a hotel"},{"t":10775,"text":"for people who don't want to be downtown. I'm also"},{"t":10778,"text":"supportive of the lack of parking. A lot of people"},{"t":10781,"text":"get to work without cars. I get to work every"},{"t":10783,"text":"day without a car. Um, actually that's reality in our"},{"t":10786,"text":"city is people can't afford cars, especially when they're working"},{"t":10788,"text":"cleaning hotel rooms, not a spot where you drive an"},{"t":10791,"text":"expensive vehicle up. We take transit and we walk. So"},{"t":10794,"text":"everything about this, it's compliant with the OCP. It's online's"},{"t":10798,"text":"with our hotel strategy with we need. It fits nicely"},{"t":10800,"text":"into the COX 3 corridor of a six - story"},{"t":10802,"text":"building. I think it's a very thoughtfully designed building. So,"},{"t":10805,"text":"uh, I'm very supportive of this. I think it's been"},{"t":10807,"text":"great. Great for the neighbourhood. Thank you, Councillor Caradona is"},{"t":10810,"text":"the secondary. Yes. Thank you. And thank you to staff"},{"t":10813,"text":"for answering all the questions as detailed as they were."},{"t":10816,"text":"And for the report, I'm strongly supportive of this proposal."},{"t":10820,"text":"We all know that the city has a huge dearth"},{"t":10822,"text":"of hotel capacity right now. And I think adding 30"},{"t":10825,"text":"spaces in this location is the right call. I think"},{"t":10829,"text":"there are a lot of folks who, when they visitwn,"},{"t":10831,"text":"they want to be on the edge of downtown because"},{"t":10833,"text":"it's a little bit less loud. Uh, some guests that"},{"t":10835,"text":"we had recently chose to stay in hotels just out"},{"t":10839,"text":"of downtown for that reason. Noting also that there are"},{"t":10841,"text":"a lot of hotels and little ins and BNBs across"},{"t":10844,"text":"Victoria, including in Fairfield and in Rockland, uh, that, um,"},{"t":10848,"text":"that have a different style and shape and feel, but,"},{"t":10851,"text":"uh, but do welcome in a lot of guests and"},{"t":10853,"text":"travellers who are coming from afar. And that's another reason"},{"t":10855,"text":"why I think that the relatively low parking is not"},{"t":10858,"text":"a huge deal. I think a lot of people are"},{"t":10859,"text":"going to come in via clipper and coho and flying"},{"t":10863,"text":"in and coming in other than driving. Um, I think"},{"t":10867,"text":"that the design itself is very sharp. It looks really"},{"t":10870,"text":"nice. The rooftop amenity looks fantastic. I think it is"},{"t":10874,"text":"a hotel that's going to be very well used. And,"},{"t":10877,"text":"um, I've got no concerns with it. So I'm happy"},{"t":10879,"text":"to move forward. Thank you very much, Councillor. Thank you."},{"t":10883,"text":"This is a bit busier street in many that are"},{"t":10887,"text":"near where I live. And I frequently see people, and"},{"t":10891,"text":"especially I'm thinking that will be what will happen here."},{"t":10894,"text":"Walking down the middle of the world with a luggage."},{"t":10897,"text":"And this is Fairfield and Cook. And you're going to"},{"t":10899,"text":"see that. A lot of people are going to 200"},{"t":10901,"text":"square feet are going to be carrying the luggage from"},{"t":10903,"text":"wherever they came. And they're going to be dragging along"},{"t":10906,"text":"in the middle of the road to the sidewalks aren't"},{"t":10907,"text":"good place to take luggage. So I'm just saying that"},{"t":10910,"text":"because I see it all the time in Jamie's Bay."},{"t":10914,"text":"And it could be quite worrisome. I'm given this intersection."},{"t":10917,"text":"It truly is. But I have an amendment, please. I'd"},{"t":10921,"text":"like to mend item number three to add another item."},{"t":10923,"text":"Perhaps best between C and D. Right? And then at"},{"t":10927,"text":"M would be plan revisions to ensure the transformer is"},{"t":10930,"text":"contained within the billing envelope. Mr. Carroll, did you not"},{"t":10937,"text":"answer that question earlier by noting that it is in"},{"t":10940,"text":"fact within the building envelope. Uh, through to the mayor,"},{"t":10945,"text":"apologies if I was, um, unclear, uh, so know the,"},{"t":10949,"text":"the current proposal is for what we call a pad"},{"t":10952,"text":"mounted transformer. So a transformer that's external to the building."},{"t":10956,"text":"Um, we did have extensive discussions encouraging as we always"},{"t":10959,"text":"do, uh, in building. Um, transformers and alternative. However, uh,"},{"t":10966,"text":"the response from the applicant is we do commonly here"},{"t":10969,"text":"is that there's a significant cost to that and that"},{"t":10972,"text":"the cost was, uh, not considered acceptable or something they"},{"t":10976,"text":"could absorb. And so they did decline to make that"},{"t":10979,"text":"revision. So it is still proposed as Pad - mounted."},{"t":10984,"text":"And based on the discussion, we didn't include it as"},{"t":10986,"text":"a condition in the recommended motion. Very good. That's my"},{"t":10990,"text":"error. All right. Then that seems appropriate. Is your secondary"},{"t":10993,"text":"for that. He did. Is there a secondary for that"},{"t":10997,"text":"amendment. Councillor Hamitz II. Go ahead. Councillor Gardner on the"},{"t":11000,"text":"amendment only. Thank you. I'm concerned about, first of all,"},{"t":11004,"text":"noise too and possible tampering, uh, with from others. And"},{"t":11008,"text":"so I really believe the transformer should be inside. Thank"},{"t":11011,"text":"you. Thank you. Councillor Hammond is the secondary. Nothing to"},{"t":11014,"text":"add anybody else of anything to add on the amendment."},{"t":11017,"text":"Councillor Caradona. Thanks. And to the mayor, I oppose the"},{"t":11022,"text":"amendment. What I heard was significant increase in cost and"},{"t":11025,"text":"that this issue was already significantly debated between the proponent"},{"t":11028,"text":"and staff, uh, it seems like micromanaging a proposal and"},{"t":11034,"text":"also is quite technical. And I don't think provides non"},{"t":11038,"text":"- experts such as our self a reasonable basis to"},{"t":11040,"text":"make that decision. So this is one where, uh, I"},{"t":11043,"text":"defer to staff in what was proposed in the proposal."},{"t":11047,"text":"The Q Councillor Kim on the amendment. Thanks for the"},{"t":11049,"text":"chair. I sympathize with the mover of this amendment. I"},{"t":11053,"text":"for one really can't stand the stand of Transformers, but"},{"t":11056,"text":"also I have chosen not to live near them or"},{"t":11058,"text":"go to hotels near them. So, um, it's also right"},{"t":11062,"text":"by a main, like an arterial like Cook Street Village."},{"t":11064,"text":"So frankly with all the other ambient noise, I don't"},{"t":11067,"text":"see a concern with, um, the project as it's proposed."},{"t":11071,"text":"Thanks. Thank you very much. Anyone else on the amendment."},{"t":11076,"text":"Cancer Dell. I hate to get to do this, but"},{"t":11079,"text":"this is, this is completely inappropriate for council to be"},{"t":11083,"text":"directing where transformers go within a business. Like I can't"},{"t":11086,"text":"even believe this is suggested. Like we need to take"},{"t":11087,"text":"it up. We are getting way in the weeds of"},{"t":11090,"text":"garbage truck turnarounds and it's been quite aggressive towards staff"},{"t":11094,"text":"today on stuff that's in there wheelhouse. We are a"},{"t":11096,"text":"board of directors at a high level. So I don't"},{"t":11099,"text":"even know if this is a good idea. I know"},{"t":11100,"text":"these are things developers talk about what BC Hydro and"},{"t":11103,"text":"staff, but this is absolutely not where council should be."},{"t":11106,"text":"And it's been a significant waste of time today. So"},{"t":11109,"text":"I'm going to be opposing this. Thank you. Anybody else,"},{"t":11112,"text":"Sonny Amendment. Councillor Gardner on the amendment. Thank you, Staff"},{"t":11118,"text":"Reese's issue, which means it's an important issue. Thank you."},{"t":11121,"text":"Thank you. Anyone else on the amendment. Let's see, again,"},{"t":11126,"text":"I'm also in the amendment. All those in favor of"},{"t":11127,"text":"the amendment. Councillor Hammond, Councillor Gardner. In opposition, Councillor Dell,"},{"t":11135,"text":"Councillor Kim, Councillor Caradona, Councillor Loth and Councillor Thompson, myself,"},{"t":11140,"text":"Ken Councillor Coleman. Noting seven in opposition, that amendment is"},{"t":11143,"text":"declined. You could remove that from the page, please staff."},{"t":11148,"text":"And Councillor Gardner, you still have the floor on the"},{"t":11150,"text":"main motion as amended. As not amended, I'm sorry. Anything"},{"t":11155,"text":"else? Just my final comment, I guess. Yep. I believe"},{"t":11161,"text":"the advisory design panel was right. The proposed will development"},{"t":11164,"text":"does not sufficiently meet the design guidelines and should be"},{"t":11167,"text":"declined. And the proposals, even before, is it even one"},{"t":11171,"text":"story higher than the proposal that went before the CALig,"},{"t":11174,"text":"which kind of pours a bit of salt into the"},{"t":11176,"text":"wound. And, uh, I'm really quite concerned about some parts"},{"t":11180,"text":"of it. And I just think this is an inappropriate"},{"t":11183,"text":"place to put a hotel, uh, and I think we'll"},{"t":11187,"text":"quite disturb the residential, um, well, the people that live"},{"t":11193,"text":"close by, especially with parking issues. And that has already"},{"t":11196,"text":"been raised. Um, through letters to us or emails that"},{"t":11201,"text":"were attached to the, uh, staff report. So I cannot"},{"t":11205,"text":"support this, uh, proposal. Thank you. Thank you very much."},{"t":11209,"text":"Anyone else on this matter. Councillor Hammond. Thanks Mayor. I"},{"t":11216,"text":"support redevelopment of the site. And for me, I actually"},{"t":11219,"text":"don't have a fundamental objection to six stories of this"},{"t":11222,"text":"location. My concern is the proposed use and fit with"},{"t":11226,"text":"the neighbourhood. Uh, this site is within the residential fabric"},{"t":11230,"text":"and council had already approved a residential project here. We"},{"t":11233,"text":"are now being asked to replace that with a 30"},{"t":11236,"text":"room commercial hotel with only four parking spaces in an"},{"t":11239,"text":"area where residents have raised real concerns about parking traffic"},{"t":11243,"text":"noise and the change from permanent housing to transient accommodation."},{"t":11247,"text":"I am also concerned that the project grew from five"},{"t":11249,"text":"to six stories after the original Community Consultation, again, not"},{"t":11253,"text":"my issue, but, um, which is why staff themselves are"},{"t":11256,"text":"requiring additional CALA consultation before Bylaw readings. I think that"},{"t":11262,"text":"consultation should come before council is asked to advance the"},{"t":11266,"text":"proposal not after. Also, I understand the economics of this"},{"t":11269,"text":"project have changed substantially since the original approval. Construction costs"},{"t":11273,"text":"have risen and the applicant has concluded that the previously"},{"t":11277,"text":"approved residential project is no longer viable. But council's responsibility"},{"t":11281,"text":"is not to guarantee that every property can produce the"},{"t":11283,"text":"return anticipated by its owner. We don't ask for extra"},{"t":11287,"text":"profits coming to us after someone makes more money from"},{"t":11290,"text":"the proposed plans they have. Our responsibility is to determine"},{"t":11293,"text":"what land use and development form are appropriate for the"},{"t":11296,"text":"neighbourhood and for the city as a whole. I also"},{"t":11299,"text":"think we need to be careful about the signal we"},{"t":11301,"text":"send to the land market. If the council routinely responds"},{"t":11305,"text":"to market economics by granting additional density or a more"},{"t":11309,"text":"lucrative use purchases will begin pricing land on the assumption"},{"t":11312,"text":"that council will later increase this development potential. Development economics"},{"t":11317,"text":"matter, but they cannot become the reason planning policy moves"},{"t":11320,"text":"every time a particular project is not pencil out. For"},{"t":11324,"text":"me, this is not a vote against redevelopment is vote"},{"t":11326,"text":"against this particular commercial use in this location in a"},{"t":11329,"text":"residential area for those reasons I'll be voting no. Thank"},{"t":11333,"text":"you very much. Anybody else? Okay. Uh, you have the"},{"t":11340,"text":"motion before you, Councillor Coleman, go ahead. Thank you. Um,"},{"t":11344,"text":"this is unusual. We do have lots of examples of"},{"t":11349,"text":"hospitality room opportunities in neighbourhoods. They tend to articulate themselves"},{"t":11355,"text":"as Bed and Breakfast, ends, or bed and breakfasts. And"},{"t":11358,"text":"now in the last decade, STRs. This is a change"},{"t":11367,"text":"that may become a trend. I don't know, or it"},{"t":11371,"text":"may be just a one - off response to hard"},{"t":11375,"text":"economic times. Uh, but it's, it is unusual in a"},{"t":11381,"text":"number of ways. And with bed breakfasts and bed and"},{"t":11384,"text":"breakfasts ends, and I differentiate between the two because it"},{"t":11388,"text":"talks about the volume of rooms that are involved and"},{"t":11391,"text":"has a parking impact. It has, we've learned over the"},{"t":11396,"text":"years in that post. Commonwealth Games period where we asked"},{"t":11400,"text":"people to embrace alternative lodging because we knew a lot"},{"t":11404,"text":"of people were coming and people found they liked it."},{"t":11408,"text":"And local people then started going, well, we could develop"},{"t":11410,"text":"a bed and breakfast. Industry. It took us a decade"},{"t":11415,"text":"to put that genie back in the bottle and try"},{"t":11418,"text":"and manage it properly. This may be the precursor of"},{"t":11421,"text":"a future trend. It will be harder to put back"},{"t":11425,"text":"in the bottle, I suspect. And it will have a"},{"t":11428,"text":"profound impact. If I'm correct. It will have a profound"},{"t":11431,"text":"impact on traffic patterns within neighbourhoods that take on this"},{"t":11440,"text":"new iteration. Um, I don't think this has been fully."},{"t":11445,"text":"Played through. I do think it does need more consultation"},{"t":11448,"text":"with, uh, the CALOC process. And the change from five"},{"t":11453,"text":"to six stories and the density that comes with that"},{"t":11455,"text":"are the more units will have a potential traffic impact"},{"t":11459,"text":"within the flow of the neighbourhood. So I recognise this"},{"t":11465,"text":"is an unusual, interesting application, but I find I'm against"},{"t":11468,"text":"it. Thank you. Anyone else. Not seeing anyone else. As"},{"t":11475,"text":"I mentioned earlier, it is on the table appropriately move"},{"t":11477,"text":"in seconded. All those in favor. Councillor Dell, Councillor Kim,"},{"t":11482,"text":"consecute on it, Councillor Lown, myself. Councillor Thompson. In opposition,"},{"t":11487,"text":"Councillor's Coleman, Hammond and Gardner. Noting three and opposition, that"},{"t":11492,"text":"is advanced to the next stage. Thank you very much,"},{"t":11494,"text":"staff, for your eloquent answers. And for answering every single"},{"t":11499,"text":"question we asked. I'm going to suggest that we take"},{"t":11501,"text":"a short break right now as we have been sitting"},{"t":11503,"text":"for quite a long time. It is almost 10 to"},{"t":11505,"text":"3. So let us resume at 3 o'clock and return"},{"t":11508,"text":"to the balance of our business at committee."},{"t":11519,"text":"Everyone, if we could return to our seats, we do"},{"t":11521,"text":"have a significant amount of work yet to do today,"},{"t":11524,"text":"both at committee and council. And so if we could"},{"t":11526,"text":"please take our seats and resume, that would be excellent."},{"t":11529,"text":"We are up to our committee agenda at item H."},{"t":11532,"text":"These are staff reports. There are two. The first one,"},{"t":11535,"text":"H1, the Vancouver Island injured Community Business licensing bylaw was"},{"t":11539,"text":"in fact placed on the consent agenda. And so that"},{"t":11543,"text":"will come back to us at a future daytime council"},{"t":11545,"text":"meeting for final consideration, which does take us then on"},{"t":11548,"text":"to item H2. This is the advisory panel bylaws. And"},{"t":11552,"text":"this was placed on the consent agenda and pulled by"},{"t":11555,"text":"Councillor Gardner. I'm going to ask Councillor Gardner whether she"},{"t":11558,"text":"needs a presentation or whether she just simply has questions."},{"t":11561,"text":"I just have a quick question. All right, why don't"},{"t":11563,"text":"we just go right to questions? And if it turns"},{"t":11564,"text":"out that we need a presentation at some point, we"},{"t":11567,"text":"can return to that at the beginning. Please go ahead."},{"t":11570,"text":"Okay, thank you very much for the information you provided."},{"t":11573,"text":"It was very useful. So I quite liked reading the"},{"t":11575,"text":"report. I'm sure because I found it quite valuable, even"},{"t":11577,"text":"though it was short, the Heritage Advisory and Advisory panel"},{"t":11581,"text":"bylaws are being altered, as you've mentioned. And during the"},{"t":11584,"text":"July 30th Committee of the Whole meeting, the approved motion"},{"t":11586,"text":"arise rising, emotionalizing, concerned the heritage committee dedicated to policies"},{"t":11592,"text":"for the historic commercial district Oldtown. And I'd like to"},{"t":11596,"text":"alter the recommendation to include the intent of that motion"},{"t":11598,"text":"if it's possible. It is not. It's not possible. No,"},{"t":11601,"text":"it is not. Okay, does Staff of any idea as"},{"t":11604,"text":"to when that motion will be honoured, and because it"},{"t":11607,"text":"almost fits into this spot. Do either of our stuff"},{"t":11612,"text":"here, or is this a Mr. Johnston? I'm not sure"},{"t":11614,"text":"who would be best placed to answer this. Please go"},{"t":11617,"text":"ahead and dispose of you introduced yourself as well. Thank"},{"t":11619,"text":"you, Mayor Alto. My name is Lauren Close. I'm the"},{"t":11621,"text":"manager of Community Planning. As we bring forward the scopes"},{"t":11625,"text":"to council to consider updating the Downtown Corps area plan"},{"t":11629,"text":"and renewing the Heritage Program, that's the time at which"},{"t":11631,"text":"council would have an opportunity to review what engagement would"},{"t":11635,"text":"look like, including with the Heritage Community per that motion."},{"t":11638,"text":"Thank you. And what time, man, we'd be looking for"},{"t":11640,"text":"that particular motion rising. We'd be looking to bring those"},{"t":11649,"text":"scopes of work forward later this year. Thank you. Is"},{"t":11654,"text":"that it? Okay. Any other questions. Not seeing any other"},{"t":11659,"text":"questions with someone like to move the Staff recommendation. Thanks,"},{"t":11662,"text":"Councillor Coleman, Councillor Garrett - Ona III, Councillor Coleman, any"},{"t":11665,"text":"thoughts. Not generally, no. On this matter, no. Councillor Caradona,"},{"t":11673,"text":"any thoughts on this matter? Nope, very good. Anyone else"},{"t":11675,"text":"wished to comment on this matter. Not seeing anyone else."},{"t":11679,"text":"Then it has been duly moved and seconded. All those"},{"t":11681,"text":"in favor. Is anyone opposed. That is unanimous. Thank you"},{"t":11688,"text":"very much for that. That would take us on to"},{"t":11691,"text":"items of new business. There was only one, and thank"},{"t":11693,"text":"you very much, Ta forging that forward. There was only"},{"t":11696,"text":"one item of new business that was the council member"},{"t":11698,"text":"motion with regard to finding approaches for the City of"},{"t":11701,"text":"Victoria to further respond to America's trade war. That was"},{"t":11704,"text":"placed on the consent agenda. And so we'll return to"},{"t":11707,"text":"us again for a final consideration. At a daytime council"},{"t":11710,"text":"meeting presently. That does take us then to item J,"},{"t":11714,"text":"which is in fact a motion to adjourn committee. Thank"},{"t":11718,"text":"you very much, Councillor Coleman, always reliable, seconded by Councillor"},{"t":11721,"text":"Kim. Any particular comment on that, seeing none all those"},{"t":11726,"text":"in favor. Anyone opposed. That concludes committee. I suggest this"},{"t":11730,"text":"if we just took a break that we just stay"},{"t":11732,"text":"in our places until staff have a chance to move"},{"t":11735,"text":"us into our daytime council, we'll proceed immediately when that"},{"t":11738,"text":"is ready."}],"words":30793,"fetchedAt":"2026-10-03T04:24:06.747Z"}