{"videoId":"uJwLP3_w52w","source":"serpapi","segments":[{"t":97,"text":"Just checking audio live stream. Thanks."},{"t":313,"text":"Hopefully that's the most exciting thing that happens this evening."},{"t":317,"text":"Mr. Green is not a party until I do."},{"t":336,"text":"Mr."},{"t":338,"text":"You're the engineer. The engineer's just going to sit there. He's not going to help."},{"t":344,"text":"You know, I'm in. [laughter] All All right, enough of the shenanigans here. Everyone, come on."},{"t":355,"text":"Welcome everybody to our regular council meeting for July 27th, 2026. Uh to call the meeting to order. I just want to acknowledge that we gather on the traditional territories of the coast and"},{"t":363,"text":"straight salish peoples and specifically we recognize lungan speaking people known today as the sanghes and the casaps of more squamalt nations and how"},{"t":371,"text":"their connections to these lands and adjoining waters continue to this day."},{"t":375,"text":"Our first order of business uh is approval of the agenda. Can I have a move seconded? Any discussion?"},{"t":382,"text":"All those in favor? Any opposed? None opposed. We have two adoption of minutes from the regular council meetings on July 13th. Same mover and seconder. Uh"},{"t":392,"text":"any changes, corrections, or amendments to the minutes?"},{"t":396,"text":"Not seeing any. All those in favor? Any opposed? None opposed. And then just a motion to receive the comm the Heritage Commission minutes June 3rd. Move second. All those in favor? Any opposed?"},{"t":406,"text":"We have no rise and report. My mayor's remarks will be brief. Um I just want to acknowledge the very rare rare cancellation rain cancellation that we had with with the music in the park."},{"t":415,"text":"That's the first time in my experience that that's happened. Um I just want to thank the staff and participants who did set up and tear down the stage uh with anticipation of a break in the web that"},{"t":424,"text":"never happened. Um so um uh just uh but it is still continuing this summer. So make sure you get out to see those. Um I"},{"t":433,"text":"was able to attend on July 21st the change of command. So um this is the CFB squymalt. So Kevin Whiteside uh took"},{"t":441,"text":"down his penant and Captain Navy Doug Leighton has taken over as base commander. uh seems a bit remote from Oak Bay, but uh they're actually very"},{"t":448,"text":"engaged with municipalities uh across the region, both in housing as well as many other uh initiatives. Um in fact,"},{"t":456,"text":"the base commander often joins we have a semi-regular lunch meeting with the mayors in the region and he often joins us as that as for some of the common uh"},{"t":464,"text":"common issues. So uh Mr. Captain Whiteside has been done a great job."},{"t":468,"text":"We're looking forward to working with uh the new Captain Leighton. Um, I also just wanted a little reminder uh that"},{"t":475,"text":"school district school district 61 is in changing their electoral system to award system which means that uh this year"},{"t":483,"text":"will be the first year that Oak Bay uh elects a Oak Bay specific representative on the school board. So just [clears throat] uh wanted to make that"},{"t":492,"text":"uh raising it here just for public awareness if people are interested in representing the interests of Oak Bay at the school district 61 table. Uh it is an election process. you would have to"},{"t":500,"text":"put your name forward and I'm just encouraging people to to consider that."},{"t":504,"text":"Um, also not directly in Oak Bay, although you can watch it partially from Oak Bay, the the official viewing site of the Snowbirds is happening on August"},{"t":511,"text":"4th at 5:00 p.m. at Clover Point uh with a very strict warning that there's very very very little parking. So, if you want to go walk uh or ride uh your way"},{"t":521,"text":"down there, again, August 4th at 5:00 p.m."},{"t":524,"text":"And finally, just a reminder that we have we do have many activities, including music in the park, but also yoga in the park, open air piano"},{"t":531,"text":"concerts, um um and of course, one more night market in August and one in in September coming up. So, uh council takes a bit of a breather over August."},{"t":542,"text":"We don't have any scheduled meetings, though. We sometimes have to have special meetings, but typically we don't. Um, so I just want to thank uh staff and council for all the work so"},{"t":550,"text":"far this year and wish everybody uh some relaxation and renewal over the next month. I know obviously staff uh and even council are continuing to work"},{"t":558,"text":"through the month. Uh that concludes my comments. Uh we now go to section seven which is public comment and question"},{"t":564,"text":"period and I um an opportunity for people to address council. This is on items not on the agenda u but of general"},{"t":573,"text":"interest to the community. an opportunity to raise uh make comments or make ask questions of council. Um and we did have a a member of the public"},{"t":582,"text":"actually send us a picture ahead of time and wanted to speak. So we have the picture uh and that is Mr. Tatty who I see has raised his hand online. So why"},{"t":589,"text":"don't I start there and Mr. Tatty you can demonstrate the process which is to state your full name and your municipality of residents not your address just your municipality. Welcome."},{"t":599,"text":"Uh Tim Daddy Oak Bay. Um can you hear me? Okay we can. Thank you. Now, thank you very much and and thank you to staff. I got"},{"t":607,"text":"this picture to them uh late this afternoon and I was very appreciative of their quick response to get it to you."},{"t":614,"text":"I'll be very very brief. I always appreciate these opportunities, Mr."},{"t":617,"text":"Mayor. Um I was struck at one of the recent council meetings when um a gentleman uh raised the issue of beach"},{"t":626,"text":"access uh with regard to the marina lease for taking his kayak and canoes and whatnot on wheels and walking down"},{"t":633,"text":"the street and putting them on. And it reminded me of something that's been in my back of my mind and it may involve a couple of departments. So I thought I'd"},{"t":641,"text":"go through you. Um, this is the foot of Baler and I would just draw your attention to several quick things. The"},{"t":649,"text":"passageway where walkers go, many, many of us have been there, has [clears throat] a telephone pole and another concrete abutment and a concrete"},{"t":658,"text":"abutment with Chris Hidlay's very good signs that they put so much effort into."},{"t":663,"text":"And then as you go, there's a chain in the garbage can and then a stack of signs, the top of which is uh ruined and"},{"t":672,"text":"vandalized and and it's just a hodgepodge of signs. So my proposal, again, this is related to access, and"},{"t":680,"text":"there's the obviously the blue multimat, which is excellent. So my quick proposal is for uh staff or council, however this"},{"t":688,"text":"works, to look at making some some very inexpensive changes that would make accessibility"},{"t":695,"text":"u easier for everybody. So the first thing I would propose is please note that [clears throat] the sign to the"},{"t":703,"text":"left pointing to the left has no parking and that is I think because of the chain I think that must be because of picking"},{"t":710,"text":"up garbage. to the right. Parking is midnight to 6:00 a.m. So, what I propose, um, if you'll go back to the"},{"t":718,"text":"walkway, the chains have been up year round usually, but whether it's been vandalized or whether one's been taken down, they've been up across."},{"t":728,"text":"Cars are parked hodge podge there all the time. This one was taken without cars. And the only option if one is uh"},{"t":736,"text":"trying to get through to the blue mat is to go through the walkway and across the sand of course, but there's the"},{"t":744,"text":"telephone pole. And it's equally hard for old people like me with kayaks and canoes to wheel down through there. You can't actually bend the kayak. So my"},{"t":754,"text":"proposal would be pretty simple that you take advantage of the opportunity to clean up the signage. Keep them all."},{"t":760,"text":"They're all very important. but somehow clean them up. Make the no parking sign"},{"t":767,"text":"uh clear to the left and take down that chain so that people like uh that that can't lift their kayak can take it down"},{"t":776,"text":"whether the blue mat's there or not because the blue mat's seasonal. But I'm proposing the the access for wheeling in"},{"t":783,"text":"where there's no parking to be year round. And then to the right, I'm proposing that you make that handicap parking. there's plenty of space so that"},{"t":792,"text":"in fact the garbage truck would still be able to get his garbage because that's where people like me would take our kayaks through on wheels. Um,"},{"t":800,"text":"[clears throat] walkers would not be impeded and we would be introducing a handicap parking spot so that when"},{"t":807,"text":"people do want to take advantage of the blue mat, they don't have to do an awkward twirly around to get to it or"},{"t":814,"text":"come down from up higher on on Willows Beach where the parking lot is. And and so that's essentially it. I appreciate you listening to me. I know you can't"},{"t":823,"text":"respond, but if you can move that forward if you think it makes sense, I'd really appreciate it. Thank you."},{"t":829,"text":"Thank you very much, Mr. Teddy. And and we do have our director of engineering in the in the hall here. And I think I'll leave that as a bit of a conduit to"},{"t":837,"text":"staff for for consideration of those pieces. So, uh and yeah, generally speaking, um these a lot of the great"},{"t":844,"text":"ideas in our community do come from the community as people walk about and see these kind of things. So, um always appreciate people raising them. You don't have to come to the council."},{"t":853,"text":"You're certainly welcome to. Uh you can often just send a note in to staff. uh you can CC Oak Bay Council on these things. Uh but generally they're the"},{"t":861,"text":"ones who go do an assessment and see if it makes sense. So appreciate you raising it. So have a good evening. Uh next in our speaking agenda I have here"},{"t":870,"text":"uh is anybody in the room who wishes to speak? I'll invite the person in the room come forward."},{"t":875,"text":"Mayor, do I stand or uh come come up to the chair. Thank you."},{"t":879,"text":"And what we'll have you do is uh again you can demonstrate for those in the room. If anybody else wishes to speak, have a seat. You can push the button in the middle. Okay."},{"t":887,"text":"And just state your name, municipality of residence. Then you have up to three minutes."},{"t":890,"text":"Okay. Perfect. Thank you. Good evening, Mr. Mayor and Council. Uh my name is David King, and I'm here this evening with my wife and neighbors. Uh we reside on Hampshire."},{"t":900,"text":"I would like to address a bit about the property at 1538 uh Montterrey that is owned by the municipality and is going"},{"t":907,"text":"to be subject to a temporary use permit application this evening."},{"t":912,"text":"Uh the property was purchased by very pardon me. We'll actually have an opportunity to speak to that when it's on the agenda."},{"t":918,"text":"Would I be able to just put this comment forward or um Sure. I guess."},{"t":922,"text":"Sure. Okay. Thanks. It's it's um I live very adjacent to the property."},{"t":928,"text":"Uh the property was purchased in Oak Bay in 2016. Has been allowed to fall into disrepair."},{"t":934,"text":"Um if you visit the old house this evening, the yard's unckempt, the buildings run down. uh windows are open"},{"t":941,"text":"as they have been for months and resulting as I understand in pest and rodent issues."},{"t":947,"text":"Uh the site is also used as overflow parking and smoking hole for local businesses and uh people in the area and"},{"t":955,"text":"the fences are falling down. The site is actually covered in cigarette butts and garbage."},{"t":960,"text":"Um recently the house has been used as a training facility for the Oak Bay Fire Department. When this first happened, I"},{"t":967,"text":"was alarmed to see smoke billowing from the windows and firemen on the site in full protective gear."},{"t":974,"text":"It turns out there was no fire. Uh but the house was being used for training using simulated smoke and houses being"},{"t":981,"text":"dragged through the house. Um I recognize the the requirements for training and I really do appreciate our local fire department."},{"t":989,"text":"I do have questions about the property and the tup. Um, Oak Bay is already using it as an immersive training facility without putting the appropriate TUP in place beforehand."},{"t":999,"text":"What I would ask today is that we as the neighbors um be consulted on this. Um, I"},{"t":1007,"text":"understand that the first thing I saw was a flyer come to my door on the TUP and uh I had seen no consultation before"},{"t":1015,"text":"that. I see that a lot of the things that are being uh asked for in the TUP are already being done on the property."},{"t":1023,"text":"Um I have had conversations with the municipality about other things such as parking in in in uh theater lane which have been an issue. Um I've had some"},{"t":1031,"text":"responses but no thorough responses back."},{"t":1035,"text":"So um I think this property has been treated somewhat poorly."},{"t":1042,"text":"And what I would ask is that Oak Bay act as good neighbors. Um, and really what I"},{"t":1049,"text":"would ask is that they consult us before um any of the tups and other actions go forward. Uh, I I I'm I'm not against"},{"t":1058,"text":"development on the site or any other location, but I would love to be involved in the uh the process. So, thanks Mayor. That's all I have to say."},{"t":1069,"text":"Thank you very much. Uh, I move to uh the uh Eric Zelka online."},{"t":1082,"text":"Mr. Zelka, you have your hand raised online."},{"t":1086,"text":"Yes. Can you hear me? All right. How's that sound? We can. Yes. Thank you."},{"t":1089,"text":"Wonderful. Um, uh, hello. My name is Eric Zulka. Uh, living in northern part of Oak Bay, uh, proper. And, uh, I just"},{"t":1098,"text":"wanted to follow up on an additional item. Um uh ripping off of uh Tim Teddy's uh suggestion from a few moments ago, that area uh um uh that has the"},{"t":1108,"text":"wonderful map that heads down right down to the water for the um accessibility aspect. That area uh especially if the chain is going to be adjusted, it really"},{"t":1115,"text":"needs two additional items. Every time I go down there, especially when I'm leaving the beach, which be wonderful to have an opportunity to wash my feet like"},{"t":1123,"text":"I do at almost every other beach in the uh in the district. Uh plus down at Willows Beach, you know, uh there is a way to wash your feet in the water"},{"t":1131,"text":"fountains. Uh unfortunately, I don't want to do it in the water fountain. I don't know where else to do it, but a foot wash would be fantastic. It's"},{"t":1139,"text":"something that could also be um you know, nice for the for the dogs as well, maybe not combined. Uh and uh ideally a"},{"t":1146,"text":"washroom because I do notice that uh for those who who have a need, there's a certain smell in that area. And for those of you who visit the bu the bushes"},{"t":1155,"text":"nearby, especially the house that lives right next door to that, I'm sure everyone would appreciate a washroom right there. Uh since uh unfortunately nature calls. Thank you."},{"t":1165,"text":"Thank you very much, Mr. Zulka. Uh I do think those are probably slightly more complicated implementations than some of the other signage pieces, but we can"},{"t":1173,"text":"certainly have a look at that as well as consideration for future projects."},{"t":1178,"text":"Anybody else in the room wish to speak to council? Again, uh it's intended for items not on the agenda. Um"},{"t":1187,"text":"okay, I don't see any other hands raised either online or in person. Uh so with that, we will uh conclude this portion of the agenda and move on to the uh next"},{"t":1196,"text":"piece which is recommendations from the meeting held on July 20th. Uh we had one uh recommendation that came out of that that council direct staff to engage with"},{"t":1204,"text":"community green map and report back on the organization's proposed partnership model. So can someone move that recommendation? Thank you. Seconded. Um"},{"t":1214,"text":"discussed it at that meeting, but if there's any further discussion, happy to take some now. Not seeing any others in favor. Any opposed? None opposed. Thank"},{"t":1223,"text":"you. Uh not everything's going to be this quick. Uh so we now move to item 9.1, which is preliminary performance"},{"t":1231,"text":"measures and council signoff. Um we have Mr. Bull here, our director of community building and planning. Um this was a fairly lengthy discussion at the uh"},{"t":1240,"text":"committee of the whole and there's been some uh some additions uh based on that conversation coming back to this table. So over to you Mr. Bull."},{"t":1250,"text":"Thank you mayor. Just pulling up my notes. [clears throat] So today's report follows up on the broader discussion that council had last"},{"t":1258,"text":"week and it responds directly to council's direction from April uh to return with preliminary performance measures and KPIs and also seeking final"},{"t":1265,"text":"sign off on part two of the project and optimizing development processes has been a key component of the housing"},{"t":1272,"text":"action program and is intended to prepare the district for increasing development activity, new provincial housing requirements and anticipated growth under the up propos updated OCP."},{"t":1285,"text":"Part two of the project builds on the assessment completed in part one last year which included process reviews, municipal benchmarking, industry"},{"t":1292,"text":"consultation and the identification of opportunities to improve development and building permit processes. The the"},{"t":1299,"text":"report before council today is about ensuring that we not only implement process improvements but also establish clear ways to measure whether those"},{"t":1306,"text":"improvements are delivering better outcomes for applicants, staff, council and the community. A total of 11 initiatives are proposed that are"},{"t":1314,"text":"intended to improve the entire applicant journey from initial inquiries and pre-application discussions through to development approvals and building"},{"t":1323,"text":"permitting and construction rather than focusing on a single part of the process. Miss Cook will um continue the introduction with a couple of additional"},{"t":1331,"text":"details regarding the proposed performance measures. Thanks. Thank you and welcome Miss Cook."},{"t":1337,"text":"Thank you. Good evening, Mayor and Council. Um, as you'll see in the report, staff undertook an updated outcomes impact assessment to analyze the cost benefit of each initiative."},{"t":1347,"text":"This included assessing each initiative by the level of effort required, the anticipated outcomes, and then rating the level of impact from high to low."},{"t":1355,"text":"This assessment indicated that some initiatives are anticipated to have a higher level of impact than others, but um that the proposed initiatives are"},{"t":1363,"text":"anticipated to generally have a high level of impact on the targeted outcome or beneficiary. Following the updated"},{"t":1370,"text":"outcomes impact assessment, staff identified preliminary performance indicators to provide a framework to measure the success of the initiatives."},{"t":1378,"text":"This includes quantitative and qualitative key performance indicators as appropriate for a particular initiative including time frame KPIs"},{"t":1386,"text":"i.e. achieving an output of a particular initiative on time and within budget customer and staff surveys to measure"},{"t":1394,"text":"qualitative impacts and quantitative data on improved sorry improved process time frames for development approvals and building permitting. Staff"},{"t":1402,"text":"anticipate that further KPIs will be identified after each initiative is launched and more detailed scoping specific to the initiative is"},{"t":1409,"text":"undertaken. KPIs will be used to provide updates to council on the success of the initiatives and the project as a whole."},{"t":1416,"text":"Considered altogether staff anticipate that the 11 initiatives will systematically improve the development and building application processes and"},{"t":1424,"text":"to end. Therefore, all 11 initiatives are recommended for inclusion in CPP78."},{"t":1429,"text":"staff are seeking today for sign off from council on CPP78 after which we will begin the process of pro procuring external support and launching the"},{"t":1438,"text":"project. Um we're happy to take any questions that you may have. Thank you."},{"t":1442,"text":"Great. Thank you very much for that. Are there questions for members of council to staff? Go ahead. Ed Watson and then Green."},{"t":1450,"text":"Yes. Thank you very much. Thanks mayor for allowing me to raise something. Um, and this is very high level to staff and"},{"t":1458,"text":"it it was something that really just came to me today when I was rereading this package and thinking about the"},{"t":1465,"text":"overall process and how the public um perceives their their the service level."},{"t":1473,"text":"and it was about the relationship between public works permits and planning permits and the extent to which"},{"t":1481,"text":"um there is coordination around that and well I guess maybe I'll just think about my issue here"},{"t":1489,"text":"for certain projects I assume like larger ones people need both planning and development permits and they also"},{"t":1497,"text":"need engineering and public works permits because they've got driveway winding they may have sewer or water upgrades they need to do. And I wondered"},{"t":1504,"text":"to what extent that those processes would end up as a result of this being"},{"t":1510,"text":"integrated and sort of um managed to the same level or standard so that um somebody who's got one of those bigger"},{"t":1519,"text":"projects, these improvements around planning and building also spill over to the other things that they have to do to get their project through the pipeline."},{"t":1528,"text":"So I just a comment about that. I'm not expecting anything more than just a reflection on that. Sure, Mr. Bull."},{"t":1535,"text":"Yeah, thank you, Mayor, through you. Um, yeah, there's a number of related permits that uh might come up during either development applications which"},{"t":1543,"text":"are the planning stage or building permits uh in preparation of construction. Um so usually those are"},{"t":1551,"text":"coordinated because the the development application has been made and some preliminary comments are made and some requirements will be identified at that"},{"t":1559,"text":"time and for building permits it's more practical. For tree permits for example uh tree protection fencing needs to be identified and installed and for any"},{"t":1567,"text":"servicing needs uh uh the engineering and public works department identifies the requirements and so that usually"},{"t":1575,"text":"makes sure that all these things are coordinated. the timing might be sometimes u different. Um but when we did the"},{"t":1582,"text":"review last last year uh the focus was very much on the development application process and the building permit process not so much on the other permit"},{"t":1590,"text":"processes. We we had uh definitely input from those groups as well u wasn't coming up as a as a as a major issue at"},{"t":1599,"text":"that point in time. So uh I think the the improvements that we have here uh do have some relation those other kind of permits as well because in the case of"},{"t":1607,"text":"simplification for example for building permits there may be uh options where a little bit of time can be gained if there's either less or no involvement"},{"t":1615,"text":"from other teams or there's less people involved of a certain permit but so that's kind of the general answer I can give or flection I guess. Thanks."},{"t":1624,"text":"And if I could just follow up. So there's um one of the projects and it's a large one is about applicant resources and I just wondered if in the in the in"},{"t":1633,"text":"the scope of that project applicant resources will will applicants be pointed to these other things as part of that pre-screening all the things for"},{"t":1641,"text":"this project I might have to do so that if they point to parks you mentioned for parks tree permits and and other kinds of permits that that that in effect"},{"t":1650,"text":"becomes part of this project even though it relates to departments outside your Cook, thank you for the question through you, mayor. Um, I would say definitely yes."},{"t":1659,"text":"When we think about the applicant resources, it will be anything that we consider is important to the applicant as part of their permitting process. So,"},{"t":1668,"text":"I think we'd be looking at applicant resources related to working with parks, working with engineering, and working with fire as those are all interrelated"},{"t":1675,"text":"with our building permitting as well as our development approvals. Thank you. Thank you."},{"t":1681,"text":"Thank you, councelor Watson. Councelor Green."},{"t":1687,"text":"Thank you very much. Um and thank you for the report through you mayor. Um just a couple of questions on on the"},{"t":1694,"text":"report. One is around the demolition permits and waste management. Um I just"},{"t":1701,"text":"wanted to ask uh first of all expediting demolitions. um wondered what the rationale was behind that. And then"},{"t":1709,"text":"secondly, on the waste management side um of of the demolition waste and I'm asking the question only because I know"},{"t":1717,"text":"many Oak Bay residents are concerned about demolitions and and older housing stock. So that was the the purpose of"},{"t":1724,"text":"the question. And my other question is what is meant by right-sized? And and that's just my own"},{"t":1733,"text":"my own question. I I I wasn't clear how that was being used and and the context for that. Thank you, Mr. B."},{"t":1741,"text":"Yeah, thank you to you, mayor. Um, for demolition permits, oh, sorry. Uh, there's a couple of steps that need to"},{"t":1748,"text":"be followed. It's it's some one of the types of permits we'd like to look at."},{"t":1752,"text":"It's not specifically on the radar to be faster or or slower. Um, right now, um,"},{"t":1759,"text":"it's just one type of permit. uh we have some OP policies that in the future we might look at uh dealing differently"},{"t":1766,"text":"with construction waste but right now we don't have specific uh requirements for de demolition permits besides uh if they"},{"t":1774,"text":"are a designated or registered property uh in certain cases it does come to council be first uh but in most cases it"},{"t":1781,"text":"won't um then with regards to what right sizing means um it's it's contrasted"},{"t":1788,"text":"with um the current approach particularly for building permits where um every permit"},{"t":1796,"text":"uh most building permits as you say this doesn't apply typically to plumbing permits but building permits are treated first in first out so everybody gets"},{"t":1802,"text":"their turn but everybody regardless of the size of their project a small kitchen ren or new house or complicated"},{"t":1810,"text":"renovation perhaps all goes in the same queue and that is a one sizefits-all that's not very efficient for the smaller scope projects right sizing it"},{"t":1819,"text":"about uh is there other ways and pathways or a route for a quicker approval for something that is small and"},{"t":1825,"text":"also u less eyes that already happens I think the the smaller projects don't have as many reviewers of course uh but"},{"t":1832,"text":"to try to create a separate shorter route for for those projects that don't need that much time or review time effort that's what we uh try to convey"},{"t":1842,"text":"with the term right sizing thanks thank you and just a quick followup"},{"t":1848,"text":"through you on on um on demolition. I think there was at one time I I don't know if it was a policy, but it was a"},{"t":1857,"text":"suggestion to deconstruct as opposed to demolish. Could you tell me where that um that approach is at this moment in in"},{"t":1866,"text":"Oak Bay? Thank you, Mr. Bull."},{"t":1871,"text":"Yeah, thank you, Mayor Through. Um it's sometimes it already happens. Um but what the what council has considered a"},{"t":1878,"text":"while ago was a project options analysis for a deconstruction bylaw. I think that is currently still on the long list long listed list of projects future potential"},{"t":1887,"text":"projects that might be picked up in the future. So that's the current status of that particular topic. Thanks. Thank you very much."},{"t":1895,"text":"Thank you. I I will note there is a uh CRD is working on a model bylaw based on the city of Victoria's bylaw that they will be sharing with other municipalities."},{"t":1905,"text":"Um and just procedurally here I have one more person on our council uh list of questions uh too. Um procedurally if"},{"t":1913,"text":"anybody wishes to speak to this item um after council ask questions. This is true for all things with public input."},{"t":1919,"text":"Council ask questions then we will go to the public for any comments and questions. Then we'll come back to this table. Council may have more questions"},{"t":1927,"text":"or they may give direction and we'll speak to motions to give some some things forward. So that's the process for all of these. So at this point we're I'll come back to this table for"},{"t":1935,"text":"questions. Councelor Braithweight and then Patterson."},{"t":1937,"text":"Thanks so much mayor and just a little bit on the technology. I'm just wondering if the new digital tools that we're going to be using are compatible"},{"t":1944,"text":"with our existing software and if there's going to be any ongoing licensing or maintenance costs that that"},{"t":1951,"text":"are going to remain after the grant funding ends that we'll have to take on. Mr. B."},{"t":1959,"text":"Thank you mayor through you. um um not for e apply in my district. Those are"},{"t":1965,"text":"specifically tools that connect to um a wider tempest system that the district already uses and it's simply building"},{"t":1973,"text":"out our toolbox so to say and using more of the bells and whistles that that program allows for. So um I don't"},{"t":1980,"text":"anticipate increased cost there except for uh what will happen through this project uh making sure it's all set up and works"},{"t":1988,"text":"properly. that is something that we can mostly do with in-house expertise. Uh but we do need from time to time some support from basically the provider of"},{"t":1996,"text":"that software to make sure all the all the things connect as they should."},{"t":2000,"text":"Thanks Patterson."},{"t":2004,"text":"Yes. Thank you, mayor, and through you to staff um in the uh initiative 10 performance measures and monitoring."},{"t":2013,"text":"It's recommended that we um utilize the services of a consultant to um help develop those performance measures. Um,"},{"t":2022,"text":"and I I just wonder if staff could speak to is there a standardization or a tailorization for these because I"},{"t":2029,"text":"imagine some of the performance indicators are um uh kind of tailored"},{"t":2036,"text":"for each community in that um big communities might have a different way of processing things than the"},{"t":2044,"text":"smaller communities and there will be certain things that they'll that both um developers or permit that applicants or"},{"t":2052,"text":"the general public um consider important here with this this process. So, I'm"},{"t":2058,"text":"wondering how uh if it if it's a hybrid, if it's something they take from um"},{"t":2065,"text":"generalized um benchmarks that other municipalities would use, and um also if"},{"t":2073,"text":"what will be captured with this reporting is uh not only what is recommended, but what items may have"},{"t":2082,"text":"been examined and um considered perhaps too um resource intensive"},{"t":2089,"text":"um so that they they're they're not chosen as a performance indicator. So just a bit of the the"},{"t":2097,"text":"background on on the on what we would be seeing as a council. Sure. I'll give it to Miss Cook."},{"t":2103,"text":"Thank you through you, Mayor. Um so I'd say that for the one big piece of that question. So they'll definitely be tailored to Oak Bay. So as part of part"},{"t":2112,"text":"one, we already have done some municipal benchmarking, but as we move into that initiative, we'll definitely look at, you know, what other municipalities in"},{"t":2120,"text":"the region do in terms of key performance indicators and performance measures and we'll tailor it to what's important um to Oak Bay. Um in terms of"},{"t":2129,"text":"the use of a consultant, I would say that in terms of determining the performance measures, we already do some performance measuring within uh planning"},{"t":2136,"text":"and building permitting. the use of the consultant won't be I'd say more focused on what those um KPIs will be but more"},{"t":2144,"text":"setting up um the tools and the software um to establish that and I'm not actually I may have to ask you to repeat the last part um of that question if you"},{"t":2153,"text":"don't mind councelor Patterson thanks I think that captured it but something else councelor Patterson yes and the last part was just um"},{"t":2161,"text":"whenever you go through these examinations part of it is uh you can get all kinds of data in in a report,"},{"t":2168,"text":"but sometimes the it's resource intensive so that it it it's hard to justify actually including that. So, I'm"},{"t":2175,"text":"wondering if uh when we get this there there will also be just some highlighting of things that were"},{"t":2182,"text":"considered and then were decided the decision was to not include them because of them being resource intensive."},{"t":2192,"text":"I think that's more Thank you, mayor. Is the is that specific to the initiatives or the measuring of of of yeah performance measures within that initiative?"},{"t":2202,"text":"It it's really I think through you may it it's really about the performance reporting and and the data that's gathered because some data can it it's"},{"t":2212,"text":"so resource intensive that we can't we can't justify it reasonably."},{"t":2217,"text":"Thank you through you mayor. think that we'll definitely focus our performance measures on data that we think is important um to the district and that we"},{"t":2225,"text":"would think would be um important to our senior leadership team um and to council. I think that um what we're"},{"t":2232,"text":"looking to do is set up um a tool that makes measuring performance actually quite simple. So, we'll be putting in"},{"t":2239,"text":"the effort to set up something that's going to help support our uh housing target order um reporting by um so we already have the data in Tempest and"},{"t":2248,"text":"it's going to be kind of produced into a dashboard that's actually going to make it a lot easier for us to to report on our performance. Thank you."},{"t":2257,"text":"Thank you."},{"t":2258,"text":"Um I guess I just my my questions here are um uh I should probably leave more probably more comments and questions."},{"t":2268,"text":"Yeah, I'll leave my my questions at this point and come back to it. So uh is there any members of the public? Uh I don't have anybody with their hands raised online at this point but I would"},{"t":2277,"text":"certainly if you [clears throat] have wish to speak I do have one. Anybody in the uh room here who would like to speak to item this is item 9.1 performance measures."},{"t":2288,"text":"Okay, I'll go to Mr. Zulka online related to item 9.1. Uh, hello. Can you hear me?"},{"t":2297,"text":"Please go ahead. Um, oh, hello."},{"t":2299,"text":"We can hear you, Mr. Zulka. Please, please go. Can you hear me? Thank you very much."},{"t":2303,"text":"Okay. Hello, Eric Zulka again. Um, north part of Oak Bay. Uh, regarding this item on the agenda, um, yes. Uh, [laughter]"},{"t":2311,"text":"this is near and dear to my heart. Uh, first of all, I do note that uh when I look up on the British Columbia uh digital building permit uh website, if I"},{"t":2319,"text":"put my address in there, I'm informed that Oak Bay does not participate in this digital program. Check with local government to learn how to apply. Okay."},{"t":2328,"text":"So, I'm hoping that uh that the $200,000 that was received by Oak Bay will not go to consultants, but will somehow allow Tempest or whatever it is can to connect"},{"t":2336,"text":"to this system since there's quite a number of uh of benefits uh to be able to offload some of this uh uh work to"},{"t":2343,"text":"the province since they're offering it anyway. Number two is now that we've got this situation where a homeowner who"},{"t":2350,"text":"would normally go to apply for a single residence and is treated as a home residential owner for what's referred to"},{"t":2358,"text":"as small projects, you know, and obviously uh um is treated that way."},{"t":2363,"text":"Now, this residential owner who's wanting to uh expand uh can now put up three, four, five, six, six units on"},{"t":2371,"text":"their single family home property, they're now being treated by OPAY staff as full-fledged developers."},{"t":2379,"text":"The language is not appropriate. The uh the assistance uh uh for the two or three situations that I'm aware of is"},{"t":2386,"text":"not appropriate. the forms that that come through are it's it's just gobbly goop to to a to a homeowner who's used to putting in a a a bathroom and now"},{"t":2395,"text":"just wants to put in two additional units for their grown-up kids to live with them and they're being treated like a developer. So when you talk about all"},{"t":2403,"text":"these wonderful buzzwords I see in the report, great buzzwords make sense to council, make sense to development staff, makes no sense to the residents"},{"t":2411,"text":"of Oak Bay in general. So please, when you're talking about customer service, just realize you've got people out there who haven't a clue what you're talking about. Thank you very much."},{"t":2423,"text":"Thank you, Mr. Zulka."},{"t":2425,"text":"Uh any other uh members of the public online or in person to speak to this item?"},{"t":2432,"text":"I don't see any other hands. We'll come back to this table. Uh we have a recommendation here and my understanding of this uh is really that uh the"},{"t":2441,"text":"recommendation here is to approve this is this will advance the projects the 11 priority projects. It gives authority to"},{"t":2447,"text":"going go forth and do those projects. Um uh but that the specific uh measures and so forth will will be coming back at a future time for for final approval."},{"t":2459,"text":"There's some suggested uh KPIs and measures there but they're not final we're not approving those at this point."},{"t":2464,"text":"and it's really approving the the projects at this point. Is that is that accurate?"},{"t":2470,"text":"Yeah, thank you mayor. That's that's correct. Um um a number of the initiatives do require council input particular for bylaws particular but"},{"t":2477,"text":"also particularly the ones for performance measures and uh right sizing of processes. Those will definitely come back to council and some of the other"},{"t":2484,"text":"more um less complicated or less or not really needing further direction. they will simply be implemented um as as we"},{"t":2494,"text":"go by but we'll definitely keep council posted of what the progress is on this program. Thanks."},{"t":2499,"text":"Okay. Um at this point we haven't we haven't define the reporting back correct like the reporting back on the"},{"t":2505,"text":"uh the status of the projects or the uh or the KPIs like are they going to be annual semiannual by we haven't"},{"t":2513,"text":"determined any of that at this point. Is that correct? Uh yes mayor that's correct."},{"t":2518,"text":"Okay very good. Um any move the recommendation."},{"t":2523,"text":"Thank you. Move and seconded. Uh any discussion?"},{"t":2530,"text":"Uh"},{"t":2532,"text":"[laughter]"},{"t":2533,"text":"uh yeah I I just have a couple of uh comments here. One, thank you. I mean I think these are all incredibly important projects and uh and good to see them"},{"t":2541,"text":"moving forward. Um I do think that there's probably benefit for us to kind of uh have the outcome metrics come back"},{"t":2548,"text":"to this table for sign off at some point in the future and probably also the um excuse me for my voice is just coming in"},{"t":2555,"text":"and out for some reason the last couple of weeks. um uh that the the timeline for the status reporting and so forth should probably also we should figure"},{"t":2563,"text":"that out uh at some point not in the immediate future but I think as we develop those KPIs and so I'm just uh going to uh turn to staff because I had"},{"t":2570,"text":"a thought of perhaps just amending [clears throat] the seeing the motion amended just to be clear that the target outcome metrics that they that they do"},{"t":2578,"text":"come back to council for signoff and that the reporting timelines uh come back as well. uh is that something that count that staff would see as as reasonable?"},{"t":2589,"text":"Thank you, mayor. Definitely the targets and the performance measures uh progress reporting uh other council priority projects we usually report on"},{"t":2597,"text":"semiannually for the updates that we provide for all projects. Uh so that would be um our intent. Uh but if"},{"t":2605,"text":"there's something different that council would like to see for this particular project, uh definitely open to hearing that. Thanks. [laughter] I see Miss H reaching for the microphones. Walter inter."},{"t":2615,"text":"Thank you, your worship. I just wanted to clarify when you speak about status reporting, are you meaning in terms of the implementation of the various initiatives or status reporting once we"},{"t":2623,"text":"have those outcome metrics that we would be reporting back to council on an annual basis with with a measure of you know the metrics against the targets. Uh"},{"t":2632,"text":"so just to clarify that please. Yeah, I I think probably the the important piece from a governance level I would see being more the uh a retainment of the"},{"t":2640,"text":"KPIs once we've signed off on those. I you know at a high level here um you know my my hope is that and this is sort"},{"t":2648,"text":"of a a bit of a maybe a cultural shift but you know I mean ideally we're not as a council getting into too so far into the weeds on the individual projects."},{"t":2658,"text":"Um, you know, it's helpful to have the information, but at the end of the day, we're, you know, here to essentially set the the goals and and and staff to come"},{"t":2666,"text":"back with with with projects that help achieve that can achieve those. Um, and and hopefully if we're setting, uh, you know, the outcomes, the desired"},{"t":2673,"text":"outcomes, then, you know, if we all agree on that, both staff and council, then we're, you know, that sh that should shape decision- making. So, as you're working on the projects and you"},{"t":2682,"text":"have to prioritize to say, \"Okay, well, we've all agreed that these are the priorities and here's the outcomes and and if there's things that staff, you know, need to come back and check in for"},{"t":2689,"text":"council to get approval on, then that's clear, right? That's so the intention here is to kind of get us back to the KPI piece.\" And I think that's the primary piece. The status of the"},{"t":2698,"text":"individual projects, I think, is less important than it is the status of the outcomes. Um, they're obviously driven by the status of the outcome of the of"},{"t":2705,"text":"the individual projects. Does that m Yes. Thank you very much. that helps."},{"t":2710,"text":"And uh what I may suggest is that um uh we introduced a trimester reporting progress uh report just recently which"},{"t":2718,"text":"primarily included financial and HR indicators. Uh we can build on that trimester reporting um to include you"},{"t":2725,"text":"know community building uh and planning indicators. Um you know we could do an annual performance report. I think um you know there are avenues where we're"},{"t":2733,"text":"already reporting to council in terms of KPIs and we can add uh to that. you know, the annual report is another one."},{"t":2739,"text":"Um, so I think if you let us take that away, we'll make sure that um, you know, we figure out the best um, reporting back process on that. In terms of"},{"t":2748,"text":"determining what those targets are, I think what Mr. Bow um, mentioned is that as we work through sort of the bylaw"},{"t":2755,"text":"changes that that we will become to council and talk about those bylaw changes and um, there will be choices for council in terms of how they relate"},{"t":2764,"text":"to the outcomes. And so at that point we'll be having more of a discussion around those outcomes that council wants to see because if we make a bylaw"},{"t":2772,"text":"amendment in one way there might be a certain outcome uh or target associated with that but if we do it in a different way there would be a different target or"},{"t":2780,"text":"outcome associated with that and so I think those discussions will will come as part of the process in terms of um uh"},{"t":2787,"text":"yeah for finalizing the initiative. So I'll let Mr. Bull add on if he has anything further."},{"t":2793,"text":"Okay. Oh thank you. So just for my clarification uh and I'll get to the main motion here in a second. um just"},{"t":2803,"text":"because we haven't yet defined those KPIs and they will drive the decision-m that goes forward like when does is like"},{"t":2810,"text":"I guess my question here is either can you can we be clear about when those KPIs will come back to council for sign off or is it something that we should"},{"t":2818,"text":"just put in as a as a as a amendment to the motion that those will come back to council so that there's actually on the record that they're coming back uh for"},{"t":2827,"text":"council Sorry. Thank you, Miss Cook."},{"t":2836,"text":"Thank you, mayor. Um, so yeah, the [clears throat] initiative 10 performance measures and monitoring has kind of two phases um in which we're"},{"t":2844,"text":"planning on rolling it out. Um, so there's kind of that Sorry, just let me go back to the program."},{"t":2858,"text":"So the first phase um so Q3 2026 so about I'd say about October um of this year we will um have established some"},{"t":2867,"text":"some KPIs and performance measures that we'll then use to measure the success um of the initiative and I think that that"},{"t":2874,"text":"it'll be a bit of an ongoing process um because as I mentioned before when we get into the more detailed scoping of each initiative we'll be developing kind"},{"t":2883,"text":"of further KPIs to measure that specific initiative. So, I think we can report back on performance measures um when we"},{"t":2890,"text":"first established them in Q3 2026, but I do think potentially through that tri um trimester uh report that we could update"},{"t":2898,"text":"on KPIs specific to each initiative if that's something that council would like to hear from us. Thank you. Okay. Yeah, Mr."},{"t":2906,"text":"maybe to add um specifically for building permits for example uh because that's worked on uh starting later this"},{"t":2913,"text":"year and next year in the first quarters uh I anticipate we would as part of that initiative come back to you about how"},{"t":2921,"text":"those processes can be changed and that will also directly relate to number 10 performance measures so I see that with those two initiatives coming together"},{"t":2929,"text":"there and we'll come back to you with options and specifics at that point in time so you get to direct specifically for building permits at that time and"},{"t":2938,"text":"then at other times other topics may come up that require your input. Thanks."},{"t":2942,"text":"Okay. So, just for my clarification, there's not a spec in October we expect some of the KPIs to be coming back and and presented to council. Is that what"},{"t":2951,"text":"I'm I'm hearing? Is that the sort of Well, October is a terrible time because it'll be right in the middle of an election. [laughter] Probably early in the new year."},{"t":2963,"text":"Yeah. Your worship. Um I think let us take it away. Uh we I understand exactly what you're looking for. You're looking for council to set the targets in terms"},{"t":2971,"text":"of those broader outcomes. Um and we will make sure that we return to council to have that discussion as we work through this project um later this year as we look at the individual uh KPIs."},{"t":2982,"text":"That goes to councelor Patterson's. I don't want to get me down in a whole variety of different KPIs and I think what you're looking at are those top"},{"t":2989,"text":"level ones in terms of outcomes and uh we will make sure we come back to council once we've got into this um to have that discussion with you."},{"t":2997,"text":"Okay. Is there any benefit in amending the motion to sort of be clear about that? Is okay. I'll leave that to turn to council"},{"t":3004,"text":"if they feel that's important um um to have that language in there, but otherwise it's just a general understanding that that will come back for council consideration."},{"t":3015,"text":"Um council read, I think that um it's my understanding that staff, both planning staff and"},{"t":3023,"text":"senior staff have an understanding of of what you were talking about. I'm not sure we need an amendment per se, but No, that's fine. I I I tend to agree"},{"t":3032,"text":"sometimes it's beneficial to have clarity, but it's not always required."},{"t":3035,"text":"So, um I'll leave my comments there and thank you to staff for the for the work that's been going on on this. So, right now we have a motion on the floor which"},{"t":3044,"text":"is the staff recommendation. I don't see any other discussions. We'll call the question. All those in favor? Any opposed? Not opposed? That carries and good luck with all the projects."},{"t":3055,"text":"Uh move to section now section 10. These are also both available for public input. Uh item first one up is uh item"},{"t":3063,"text":"10.1 288 Hampshire Lane. This is a request for a development variance permit. Um and I will hand this over to is it Miss Clever. Welcome."},{"t":3075,"text":"Thank you. Good evening Mayor and council. Uh the purpose of this report and application pertains to an"},{"t":3082,"text":"application for a development variance permit as you just mentioned to specifically increase the lot coverage"},{"t":3089,"text":"and also reduce um the setback requirement of 3 mters between buildings and structures um to permit the"},{"t":3098,"text":"[clears throat] construction of pergola in on an existing patio um of a relatively newly developed residential"},{"t":3105,"text":"lot. Um the property owners and applicant are actually here today if you have any questions later. But essentially they're asking for this"},{"t":3112,"text":"permit um to for a custom design pergola um to better enjoy their their rear yard"},{"t":3120,"text":"um and also just for protection from the sun for health purposes. So uh design plans are in um attached as attachment"},{"t":3129,"text":"five um which also the rationale behind the intentionality of the project is in"},{"t":3135,"text":"attachment six. So as I mentioned before the variance triggers two requirements."},{"t":3142,"text":"So the increase of block coverage as well as the um reduction of sighting between um or the spatial separation of"},{"t":3152,"text":"3 m between buildings and structures um so that it can be positioned in a specific place that makes sense uh on"},{"t":3159,"text":"the existing patio. Um ultimately they've they've consulted neighbors."},{"t":3164,"text":"They have strata approval um to proceed and uh staff recommend approval of the development variance permit. Thank you."},{"t":3173,"text":"Thank you very much for the overview."},{"t":3174,"text":"Are there any questions from members of council to the applicant or to staff? Go ahead, councelor briefly. Um, thanks very much. My question would be to staff. I'm just wondering if um the"},{"t":3183,"text":"reduced separation would create any um fire separation or building code concerns um or will those have been um"},{"t":3191,"text":"addressed through the building permit process? Thank you."},{"t":3194,"text":"Yeah, great question. Uh the 3 m setback historically was developed decades and decades ago um for that very reason to"},{"t":3202,"text":"ensure that if a fire occurs that it doesn't um spread. Uh ultimately because of the nature of uh the opening of the"},{"t":3210,"text":"pergola. Yes, it goes through a building permitting process. The building officials will evaluate this. But ultimately um the nature of the"},{"t":3219,"text":"pre-existing patio, what's there uh staff have already kind of evaluated that there wouldn't be that um that that"},{"t":3228,"text":"hazard. Um but it still has to go through the B building permit process."},{"t":3235,"text":"you may just one other question and this is probably for the applicant and I'm just wondering if the um pergola is intended to remain open or is there a future intention to enclose it at all?"},{"t":3247,"text":"I'm going to ask the applicant and property owners to come to the stage or to the podium I should say."},{"t":3256,"text":"Oh, just come to the desk here. You can actually go and sit right there. No, it's okay. All right. Okay."},{"t":3262,"text":"So, you probably heard the process. just state your name and municipality and uh you can answer the question about the I'm new to Oak Bay so I'm going to say"},{"t":3269,"text":"Oak Bay um and my name is Kevin Flanigan and it's going to the intent is to remain open it will be a slant or"},{"t":3277,"text":"slanted uh pergola so that it kind of gives you some protection from the sun thank you any other questions for the"},{"t":3285,"text":"applicant not seeing any um we then open this floor up to uh members of the public who wish to address any of the"},{"t":3293,"text":"issues related to this variance. Um, again, this is for 2088 Hampshire. I did lower a hand that was online earlier, so"},{"t":3301,"text":"I'm not sure if there seems if the speaker I think it was just a legacy hand remaining from an earlier uh request. So, does anybody any members of"},{"t":3309,"text":"the public either in person looking around not seeing any uh or online uh don't see any public input?"},{"t":3317,"text":"Staff recommendations second."},{"t":3319,"text":"Seconded. Thank you. Um, any further discussion?"},{"t":3323,"text":"All those in favor? Any oppose? You're approved. Good luck with the project."},{"t":3328,"text":"Enjoy the pergola. Hope we get some sun that you can actually use it. Um item number 10.2, which is 1538 Montterrey"},{"t":3336,"text":"Avenue. This is the temporary use permit. Um for 1538 Montter Avenue. We have Mr. Green here, our deputy director of community building and planning to"},{"t":3345,"text":"introduce the item. Same process will take place. There will be staff introduction, questions from council and then opportunity for public input. So"},{"t":3353,"text":"you can come back and speak again if you wish. Please go ahead, Mr. Green. Uh good evening, members of council."},{"t":3359,"text":"[clears throat] The district has received a temporary use permit application for the property uh at 1538 Montre Avenue. The applicant is the"},{"t":3367,"text":"district's facilities department who has submitted a temporary use permit in order to allow the use of the property to be used for temporary municipal"},{"t":3374,"text":"office storage space and staff training facilities for the Oak Bay Police Department and the Oak Bay Fire Department for a period of three years."},{"t":3382,"text":"Staff have reviewed the proposal in context with the science area and based on this review staff believe the TU is supportable in accordance with the legislation and in accordance with"},{"t":3390,"text":"council's development application procedure bylaw. uh staff did give uh notification so a development notification letter was sent to all"},{"t":3397,"text":"properties within 50 meters as well as an advert placed in the Oak Bay news on two separate occasions. Uh the applicant is also here to answer any questions"},{"t":3404,"text":"that council may have on the application and planning staff are also happy to answer any questions that council have on the technical merits of the application."},{"t":3415,"text":"Thank you very much Mr. Green by the applicant as Mr. Graham. Is that the green? Welcome. Good to see you."},{"t":3421,"text":"Councelor Patterson and Councelor Green and then councelor Briew."},{"t":3424,"text":"Yes. Thank you, mayor, and through you to staff. Um just to follow up on uh Mr."},{"t":3429,"text":"King did speak about this earlier on, but his comments are certainly echoed by many of the residents that are u"},{"t":3436,"text":"particularly on Mterrey. And so as part of this temporary use permit and the"},{"t":3443,"text":"uses we're we're planning for this um what are the plans to uh provide more"},{"t":3451,"text":"particularly um clean up and maintenance of the of the green space around the building proper."},{"t":3459,"text":"Mr. Graham uh through your worship uh currently we maintain the property to just a minimum"},{"t":3466,"text":"standard uh with in alignment with our budget uh restraints and parks generally cleans it and cuts the loans twice a"},{"t":3472,"text":"year. So currently it wasn't our intent to change that."},{"t":3481,"text":"I have councel green in the brief. Thank you and through you uh to staff."},{"t":3486,"text":"Thank you very much for the report. Um just wondered following on councelor Patterson's comments. Just wondering um"},{"t":3494,"text":"what if any plan consultation there will be with immediate neighbors that obviously have concerns about about the"},{"t":3500,"text":"property. Um I think the end result will address many of their concerns as it becomes utilized and maintained. But is"},{"t":3509,"text":"there any plan to at least talk with them and and just um get a really good understanding of what what is concerning to them? Thank you."},{"t":3521,"text":"Um I guess from planning staff's perspective obviously we have complied with the legislation in terms of sending a notification letter out to everybody"},{"t":3528,"text":"within 50 meters as well as place an advert in the paper and obviously this is the opportunity for the public to have their say on the vacation."},{"t":3535,"text":"Obviously, if the applicant uh wants or if council wants the applicant to do further consultation, then that's the will of council, then that could also be"},{"t":3543,"text":"an opportunity that you could add a condition to the temporary use permit or either as a pre-issuance condition or before council considers that"},{"t":3550,"text":"application to for the applicant to host some kind of information session with the immediate neighbors is also an opportunity for that could be if council so chooses."},{"t":3560,"text":"Thank you."},{"t":3562,"text":"Thank you, councelor Green. Councelor Braith in Appleton. Oh, thanks so much."},{"t":3565,"text":"And my mine were around um some of the neighborhood impacts as well. Um and questions around like um you know, how often will the fire department training"},{"t":3572,"text":"occur, the police training occur? Is it in evenings, weekends, overnight? Um will there be sirens, smoke machines? I think we've heard that there are smoke"},{"t":3581,"text":"machines. Um you know, similated emergencies, those kind of all came up when I was reading the report. You know, where will the trainee park? Um will"},{"t":3589,"text":"there be any impact on the neighborhood parking? and how will the neighbors know when the training is going to occur? So, those are some of the questions I have."},{"t":3598,"text":"Over to you, Mr. Graham."},{"t":3600,"text":"Uh, thank you through your worship. Um, if if I missed any of the questions, just there was a list there. Um, signage is placed out in front of the building"},{"t":3607,"text":"whenever there's um training. Uh, training um I won't say will happen daily, but based on the training requirements we have under the"},{"t":3615,"text":"provincial legislation, it could be that often. It is done during the day, not in the evening. So it would meet with our um all of our um noise bylaws and those"},{"t":3625,"text":"sort of things. Um generally we do um I won't say occasionally, quite regularly use an actual smoke machine. Uh the"},{"t":3632,"text":"other opportunity with um the fires, they'll use full blackout face masks, but the intention is to create as realistic conditions as possible. Uh we"},{"t":3641,"text":"typically leave the windows open for a few hours afterwards to allow the smoke to come out. It's just a standard smoke machine that you'd use on any film set"},{"t":3648,"text":"type of a condition. Um, did I miss sorry parking for the trainees that are there?"},{"t":3656,"text":"Oh, for parking being that it's so close to the um uh the fire department, the police department. Uh generally they just bring the apparatus over."},{"t":3666,"text":"Thank you. And then um the the report also mentions plumbing upgrades and safety upgrades and and do we know what"},{"t":3673,"text":"plan what um work is um is actually planned and and what the cost of that might be"},{"t":3680,"text":"uh through your worship that uh building permit is actually related to our ongoing maintenance of the building."},{"t":3685,"text":"It's not related to the temporary use permit. Um we did some uh extra bracing on the back deck for instance just recently. Uh, I believe there's a toilet"},{"t":3693,"text":"in there we're looking at replacing, but being that the building isn't in use, we're likely just going to shut that toilet off."},{"t":3700,"text":"Um, thank you. And if I may, mayor, um, and what I noticed in the report, it said that we're going from two lots to one lot for the TU. I think it said"},{"t":3709,"text":"somewhere in there that we we have to make it into one lot. Is that correct, Mr. through your worship to council bra from planning stress perspective. We are"},{"t":3718,"text":"adding that as a condition to the TU that consolidates the lot given that I think there's an expectation that this lot be brought into compliance with the zoning bar rather than being a a legal"},{"t":3726,"text":"non-conforming use. And so the planning staff have recommended that condition be added to that draft permit."},{"t":3733,"text":"Thank you. And so then my question would be um after the 3 years if if um the TU is has ended after the three years will"},{"t":3741,"text":"it then go back to the two lots or will it stay as the one lot?"},{"t":3746,"text":"Mr. through your wish to cancel the to in order then to create two lots the uh the applicant or the land owner need to"},{"t":3755,"text":"submit a subdivision application to subdivide a property into two lots if that is the what is the requirement but at the end of that three years there's"},{"t":3762,"text":"an expectation that the slight be yeah uh remain as it was prior to uh commencement of the development but"},{"t":3770,"text":"there isn't the lot consolidation is a a condition that we are the planning staff are recommending be um undertaken."},{"t":3782,"text":"You go ahead, councelor Appleton."},{"t":3784,"text":"Thank you, worship. So, just expanding on the idea of of just public information. So, I heard that there was the proposal to put signage out to sort"},{"t":3792,"text":"of inform people what was going on. I just and this may be more a question for the fire service rather than Mr. But is there any other is the nature of the"},{"t":3801,"text":"training and the timeline of the training consistent enough such that we the fire service might be able to uh"},{"t":3808,"text":"provide to local neighbors at least a rough idea of approximately the the timing and the nature of what to expect"},{"t":3816,"text":"as far as that I think that might help neighbors a lot uh threeear worship I can't speak in"},{"t":3824,"text":"detail because the fire chief isn't here but generally The answer is yes. We're consistent of training short of being called out on actual emergencies. Uh the"},{"t":3831,"text":"training would be uh set regularly uh during the uh daytime. Go ahead, Council."},{"t":3839,"text":"Thank you, Worship. Less of a question, more just a comment. I think it would be I guess yeah, without being able to speak directly to fire services. I think that it would be useful if there was"},{"t":3847,"text":"even some kind of circular bulletin or some type of regular posting on the district's website that local residents could consult to just sort of get a"},{"t":3855,"text":"sense of when those things might be going on. So, just make that notation for staff."},{"t":3862,"text":"Before I go back to second time questions, uh are there any the first time? Um I just have questions to follow up on on the line of questioning"},{"t":3870,"text":"already. Um the while there's what's proposed for us is the is a maintenance or continuation"},{"t":3878,"text":"of the current maintenance model. There is a possibility that we could direct that maintenance level becreased with a thing with that thing. Thank you. The"},{"t":3887,"text":"other question I have was just around parking there that is because it's adjacent to the village is a high use uh space. Does the and you you there's a"},{"t":3896,"text":"comment made that the equipment would come over from the fire hall, but that's would that parking space would it would that be uh impacted? Would that be have"},{"t":3904,"text":"to be reserved for chunks of the day for the fire department use or would that would they be able to use their equipment around the corner or other places that doesn't use up parking in the village or adjacent to the village?"},{"t":3914,"text":"Mr. Graham, uh to your worship, the the apparatus usually parks in the front of the building right on Mterrey. Uh there is a"},{"t":3923,"text":"fire hydrant there. So there is a no parking section that they generally park on. From observing the the the test exercises that we've done there to see"},{"t":3931,"text":"how well the apparatus fits, it will take up a couple of parking spots on Montre Avenue. We don't generally bring the apparatus down a theater lane to"},{"t":3939,"text":"park. Um the firefighters would carry ladders around to the back of the building and do um practice evacuations um things like that."},{"t":3948,"text":"Okay. So So do we have a sense of what would be required then? If it's using up two parking spaces, would those parking spaces have to be reserved ahead of time"},{"t":3956,"text":"because obviously people might be parking there on a regular basis and then the parking the equipment couldn't park there if they if they needed the space."},{"t":3964,"text":"Uh to your worship, yes, they generally the days that they're going to be training, they would put up signs really early in the morning to uh block those spots open."},{"t":3972,"text":"Okay. And again, do we have a sense of the frequency of that training?"},{"t":3977,"text":"Worst case scenario would be daily. I think it would be fairly consistent that it would be almost daily."},{"t":3983,"text":"Okay. Uh and the other uh question I have is just in the uses here. I mean there was temporary municipal office"},{"t":3990,"text":"office storage uh and staff training for the police and fire departments. So is there any in thought here that that would actually would would this be used for municipal offices or office storage?"},{"t":4003,"text":"Uh to your worship, we do store some spare furniture in there. Part of it is mockups for the uh the fire department to maneuver through um uh almost like a"},{"t":4011,"text":"little bit of a maze. Uh we do have it set up in case there is a flood or other emergency just as part of business continuity for the district. If we had"},{"t":4018,"text":"to, we could move people in there temporarily to do temporary repairs or something. But to date, we've never had to do that and we're not really expecting to."},{"t":4028,"text":"Okay. Thank you for those answers. I have second time speakers and Patterson."},{"t":4032,"text":"Uh thanks mayor. Actually, you you've kind of asked one of mine questions, which was um because the the report emphasizes the value of the site for the"},{"t":4041,"text":"training, but it doesn't ever indicate how many days a month it'll be used or how long the ex exercises will typically typically last. But what I heard you say"},{"t":4048,"text":"was that they're daily and they could go on all day. So, okay. Um if that if there's it would be nice for the"},{"t":4058,"text":"neighbors um that that they would have that because then we can maybe assess the impact for for them if if they knew"},{"t":4067,"text":"in advance exactly how many days um the training was going to go on."},{"t":4073,"text":"I think it's more of a comment than a question. So we'll uh do you say anything Mr. Grim?"},{"t":4078,"text":"Uh through your worship uh training at at like I say at worst could be daily."},{"t":4082,"text":"It's usually only a few hours is our intent. Um there's uh I can get you those exact details on the provincial standards for the number of hours of training they have to put in per week."},{"t":4092,"text":"Um but uh I'm I'm like I say I'm I'm showing kind of worst case scenario could be every other day but I I do want to be clear it could be every day for a"},{"t":4100,"text":"few hours. Usually they try and take care of it in the morning and um the afternoons get a little busier for callouts."},{"t":4108,"text":"Councelor Patterson."},{"t":4110,"text":"Yes. Thank you, Marin. I I will just comment because I have I have to maneuver through the area when we d when"},{"t":4118,"text":"the training is is going on and um it is very close to the accessible parking in the village. So, I think that that's"},{"t":4127,"text":"something that we unfortunately the fire chief is not here to speak to it tonight, but that's something we have to consider. I have also been caught a"},{"t":4134,"text":"couple of times of um there wasn't good direction for where pedestrians go. uh"},{"t":4141,"text":"because you then might have to maneuver out into the street and walk around the fire truck on till they get set up"},{"t":4148,"text":"because there's obstructions across the sidewalk. But also, I've been caught in the um uh the circumstance of I guess"},{"t":4156,"text":"they had an alarm and so everybody had to come running out of the house and get on the truck and away they go, which if you're a pedestrian caught up in that,"},{"t":4164,"text":"it's so I think logistically there needs to be uh um some uh review"},{"t":4172,"text":"of this. But also a question through you, Mayor, uh for Mr. Graham. I believed at some point in time you"},{"t":4178,"text":"talked about um removing the uh the garage from the site and if if Mr."},{"t":4186,"text":"Graeme could just refresh my memory on that."},{"t":4190,"text":"Mr. Graham uh three worship that was one proposal I think it was in January that we looked at if we did want to turn part of that"},{"t":4198,"text":"site into parking. Um it was it was not something we were moving forward with at this time. We do find people, we have"},{"t":4206,"text":"had garbage dumped off around that garage. As soon as we notice it, we clean it up. Uh we've also put uh doors and secured that building much better"},{"t":4214,"text":"than it was. So, uh hopefully that happens a lot less often, but there's no intention of removing the garage at this point in time."},{"t":4225,"text":"I don't see other questions for members of council. So, if there's any members of the public who wish to speak to council, yeah, uh you're welcome to come forward. Uh same process as before, just"},{"t":4233,"text":"uh state your name, municipality of residence."},{"t":4236,"text":"Hi again. Uh David King. Uh thank you very much. I'm sorry I didn't realize the procedure before, but um I live actually immediately adjacent to the"},{"t":4244,"text":"property and uh our neighbors are here who are also adjacent and I have actually been in conversations with our neighbors who are directly beside it as"},{"t":4252,"text":"well and we're all kind of collectively on the same page. I'd like to challenge a couple things um around the parking"},{"t":4259,"text":"and the way these exercises have gone. I mean, number one, we have not been informed. Um, as you're aware, the alley"},{"t":4266,"text":"between Montree and Hampshire is one way that does not exit on the north. Our only exit is onto Theater Lane. Theater"},{"t":4273,"text":"Lane is already exceptionally busy. Uh, garbage pickup every day, large garbage pickup, deliveries to local businesses,"},{"t":4280,"text":"with trucks, uh, to the pubs, and to all the businesses there."},{"t":4285,"text":"when you have added the fire trucks in the last little while because the fire trucks were actually on Mterrey in"},{"t":4292,"text":"theater lane and up our alley and when I've asked the firemen cuz I was unable to get out if they would move the"},{"t":4300,"text":"trucks. They were very very polite and kind but it did take them 10 or 15 minutes to gather somebody up to to be able to move a truck. Um, I also just"},{"t":4309,"text":"say it is it is a pretty, you know, with the with the smoke coming out and the firemen coming around, it it I think it's a lot more activity than most"},{"t":4318,"text":"people would want in a daily basis um in their backyard."},{"t":4324,"text":"Um, I'd also like to speak if I could on the the minimum standard that was discussed about mowing the lawn twice a"},{"t":4331,"text":"year. I I really would love to go out with the mayor and council and have a walk over the property because um it is"},{"t":4340,"text":"actually frankly a little bit embarrassing this the state of of the property and um and the lack of the lack"},{"t":4347,"text":"of maintenance on the property. Um so so really as I said we always probably understood that there would be some development there and I understand that"},{"t":4355,"text":"there is a requirement for that but what I would appreciate is some more consultation with us with the neighbors."},{"t":4363,"text":"uh this letter I got. I appreciate it, but it was the first time I'd heard about this. And when I had and when our neighbors had tried to make inquiries to"},{"t":4372,"text":"the municipality about the nature of the training, we we didn't get much of a response. And uh there are other"},{"t":4379,"text":"elements with that property that are uh that are a challenge right now. And again, that is the the the parking on"},{"t":4387,"text":"Theater Lane. Again, uh as I said, Theater Lane's very busy. It is being used as temporary parking. The municipality did put up no parking"},{"t":4396,"text":"signs. Um what happens is the people come, they throw the signs behind the the buildings and they park there"},{"t":4403,"text":"anyways. And when I've made my inquiries to the municipality, I've been told they're going to look into it. I've yet"},{"t":4410,"text":"to ever hear back. Uh last thing is on the garbage. Um I would challenge what was said. uh that area is used as a"},{"t":4419,"text":"pretty reg routine dump and that that material is left there for months and if you were to go and have a look there now"},{"t":4427,"text":"people are using it as their as their garden dump and dump for other materials behind the garage. Um I would really ask"},{"t":4436,"text":"that at this stage uh there's some time for that this be denied. There be some more time for consultation with us and"},{"t":4444,"text":"see if there is more that can be done uh to support us and figure out a way forward with this property. So thank you very much Mary. I really appreciate the time the opportunity to speak."},{"t":4454,"text":"Thank you very much Mr. King. Yes. Please come forward."},{"t":4459,"text":"Exactly the same protocol. Just uh have a seat. uh turn to the microphone on your name and municipality and then uh please address council."},{"t":4468,"text":"Good evening. I'm Michael Shan Danaher."},{"t":4470,"text":"I'm next door neighbor to the person that just spoke um living in Oak Bay on Hampshire and I am the property directly"},{"t":4477,"text":"adjacent behind uh the property we're discussing. I would just like to reiterate my neighbors comments the"},{"t":4485,"text":"state of disrepair. I don't want to be disrespectful, but I don't think I would be a good neighbor if I cut my grass twice a year."},{"t":4494,"text":"I don't think I would be a good neighbor if I didn't take care of my trees, my shrubs, if I left garbage in my yard, if I left my house in a state of disrepair."},{"t":4506,"text":"I think Obey is a beautiful community. A lot of people take great pride in their buildings and it's a black eye on the township."},{"t":4518,"text":"You really should take a look at the state of it. Several months ago, there's a garage that's um gravity is slowly"},{"t":4527,"text":"winning the battle and garbage and refuence was in disrepair. So, temporary"},{"t":4535,"text":"fencing was put up. The township's solution was rental fencing, green rental fencing because cars were"},{"t":4542,"text":"illegally parking. They there's a pub nearby. There are restaurants nearby."},{"t":4547,"text":"Parking is a premium and they were coming into the laneway and illegally parking. So solution, let's put"},{"t":4555,"text":"temporary fencing up. Um temporary is temporary half a year."},{"t":4562,"text":"I I just I I don't want to be disrespectful, but I don't think this property is being taken care of properly. And now an application has"},{"t":4569,"text":"been put in to put the h the house in greater state of disrepair."},{"t":4575,"text":"It's let's abuse it. Let's have firemen regularly conduct drills in there. And at some point, I imagine the house will"},{"t":4584,"text":"be torn down for a future developer because not much is being done to maintain it. As has already said, a"},{"t":4591,"text":"toilet is in disrepair. Okay, let's just shut that toilet off. So, as a neighbor, I see the writing on the wall that this"},{"t":4599,"text":"house is going to be abused until it comes down and the town will cut the grass twice a year and barely maintain"},{"t":4606,"text":"standards until someone actually builds something and uh respects property."},{"t":4613,"text":"Thank you for your comments."},{"t":4618,"text":"Uh, any other members of the public wish to speak to council?"},{"t":4624,"text":"Oh, hi."},{"t":4635,"text":"Just thank you and council. Um, my name is Anton Brackage. Um, resident of Oak Bay."},{"t":4642,"text":"Live fairly near to the the area in question and and pass through the area fairly frequently."},{"t":4649,"text":"Um, I guess what I would like to ask is since this location, as I understand, is being used for training for police and"},{"t":4658,"text":"fire, um, if this was not approved, what is the alternative for training, is there any alternative location they could use"},{"t":4668,"text":"or would this just mean not being able to meet the training standards? And I think that's something I'd like some clarification on."},{"t":4676,"text":"Thank you. Thank you for that."},{"t":4680,"text":"Any other members of the public? Uh we have a hand up online. Eric Zelka, please go ahead."},{"t":4688,"text":"Uh council, uh mayor, uh thank you. Uh Eric Zulka from the north part of Oak Bay. Oh my goodness. Uh quite a"},{"t":4695,"text":"interesting bit of information regarding this property. Uh so many things to talk about. Number one is um the state of the"},{"t":4703,"text":"property is rather I agree with many other members who have spoken. The state of the property is terrible. Absolutely terrible. It reflects incredibly bad on"},{"t":4711,"text":"the owner of the property which is the district of Oak Bay and is an indication a proxy measure of the lack of standards"},{"t":4720,"text":"of the lowering of standards within Oak Bay. Now this may not be true but it sure looks that way with the way Oak Bay treats this property and treats the"},{"t":4728,"text":"neighbors in that area. So absolutely the property must be um uh uh at the very least they grass cut more than twice a year. That's ridiculous. Number"},{"t":4736,"text":"two is um I know the the fire department has been looking for training uh uh uh places for quite a number of years. Uh I"},{"t":4745,"text":"know they were looking at the uh fifth Gary Oak uh building at one point but uh I guess that didn't work out. Uh mutual aid. This is what this is the point of"},{"t":4753,"text":"mutual aid. I don't know know why we are not uh um getting into contract with uh with Sandwich Fire or with uh Victoria"},{"t":4760,"text":"Fire or if we have to drive all the way over to Souk or whatever to do our training, why is it why why aren't we uh uh considering mutual aid or is there"},{"t":4768,"text":"something else going on? This is definitely a place for mutual aid. Uh number three, uh I'm I'm quite alarmed."},{"t":4775,"text":"Thank you uh councelor Braithway for bringing forward the question about the two lots being forced to combine into one. I was on council years ago with"},{"t":4783,"text":"many of you when we the building was purchased. It's a land bank and having two lots gives greater flexibility to"},{"t":4790,"text":"council for what it can be done in the future. Forcing it to be combined is ridiculous. So council should tell staff that no, do not combine the two lots."},{"t":4800,"text":"Keep them separate. And if staff insists because of some, I don't know, provincial regulation, well then do the tup only on one of the two lots. do not"},{"t":4810,"text":"combine the two lots until we know we the royal we all bay what's going to be done to to with that area whether it's"},{"t":4817,"text":"going to be a new police station whether it's going to be what the money was was intended for which is a parking for downtown businesses or some other"},{"t":4826,"text":"appropriate uh use uh that that's uh that's a benefit to all of Oak Bay. Uh so thank you very much uh uh council and"},{"t":4834,"text":"please um u uh you know brush up, paint up uh uh make us proud uh as opposed to being a terrible example for the rest of us. Thank you."},{"t":4844,"text":"Thank you for your comments, Mr. Zulka."},{"t":4847,"text":"Don't see any other hands of people wishing to speak."},{"t":4851,"text":"Okay. Uh I don't see any more online. So I'm going to come back to this table. Uh we have a report in front of us. We've had an opportunity for questions. Is"},{"t":4858,"text":"there any further questions from members of council at this time?"},{"t":4864,"text":"If not, go ahead, councelor Watson, then I'll seek a direction and we have a motion."},{"t":4868,"text":"Yes. I just like to follow up on the question that we got from a member of the public about alternative locations for this training. Um uh and I I"},{"t":4877,"text":"understand we don't have our fire chief here, but I think that's a fair question. if not here, is there anywhere else within the municipality that we can"},{"t":4885,"text":"we can meet our requirements and standards for that that very regular training? Um, so I I don't know who to give that to. Maybe I guess it is Mr."},{"t":4893,"text":"Graham. Thank you, Mr. Graham."},{"t":4896,"text":"Uh, through your worship, the there were a couple of uh comments made. One was having training off off outside the district. If we do that, we have to take"},{"t":4904,"text":"the crew offline. So, we'd basically be paying two crews uh to do it. Uh there's no other training that's within the"},{"t":4911,"text":"response time zones. The the training being very close to the existing fire hall allows us to keep that crew in an active status and that"},{"t":4920,"text":"that if there is an emergency call, they can respond immediately. Uh getting too far outside of um you know, too far south or too far north, the trucks won't"},{"t":4928,"text":"be able to respond adequately. Um so there is no other location that we've currently identified."},{"t":4937,"text":"Thank you, Mr."},{"t":4939,"text":"Uh, thank you. I'm going to just do a followup before I go to councelor Braithweed and that is just the the fire department does do current training. I"},{"t":4947,"text":"think it is in the scout hall or some other areas. Is there uh and you may not know this question maybe more for the fire chief but is there a mechanism by"},{"t":4955,"text":"which um the frequency of use of this building is not daily or near daily but is more sort of uh as is used more"},{"t":4963,"text":"episodically and the existing uh sites that are being used continue Mr. Mr. for him."},{"t":4970,"text":"Uh to your worship, I can certainly explore that with the fire chief and and get a more accurate schedule from him and get that uh bring that information back to council."},{"t":4979,"text":"Councelor Brie."},{"t":4981,"text":"Uh thank you, mayor. I'm just wondering um if this uh if we did want to go and have a meeting with u the neighbors"},{"t":4988,"text":"around um this property uh and it puts um a bit of a delay on this. Is there"},{"t":4995,"text":"would there be any issues with with putting a temporary delay on on passing this um to give us an opportunity to"},{"t":5003,"text":"perhaps get some more information um for the public and from the public?"},{"t":5009,"text":"Graham uh through your worship that what I would want to refer to the fire chief. I know that um if we're not doing training"},{"t":5018,"text":"adequately enough we we do fall out of our our standards but we do have we do have some leeway um currently some of the training we've been doing um in the"},{"t":5026,"text":"parking lot which creates its own issues with the playground adjacent to it um is meeting the minimum standards but um we"},{"t":5034,"text":"are now falling out of standard. We need we need a structure to work with. M Anderson."},{"t":5041,"text":"Uh thank you, mayor. I believe Chief McDonald has joined us online."},{"t":5048,"text":"Uh do you want to put that Yeah. Do you want to put that question to the uh Chief McDonald?"},{"t":5052,"text":"Uh sure. Um, Chief McDonald, I'm not sure if you heard the question, but it was in regards to um if we uh if we did"},{"t":5059,"text":"um delay this decision uh so that we could go out to the public and perhaps get more information for them and um for"},{"t":5067,"text":"for council, um would that um would that be an issue for the fire department?"},{"t":5075,"text":"Go ahead, Chief."},{"t":5078,"text":"Hi. Can you hear me, your honor? And um yes, I heard the uh the question. Uh uh thank you and good evening. I have"},{"t":5086,"text":"been uh following the uh the past 10 minutes or so. Um yes, if we do delay that that will have somewhat of an"},{"t":5093,"text":"impact on our our day-to-day uh uh training. Uh we can do some limited interior training at the fire hall, but"},{"t":5101,"text":"we can't do multifloor training and we are extremely limited with regards to our options to perform our provincial job uh performance requirements under"},{"t":5110,"text":"the uh the OFC um playbook and the provincial training requirements where we can do interior search and multifloor"},{"t":5117,"text":"training. Uh this is one of the few locations that we can actually do it in the district."},{"t":5125,"text":"Thank thank you very much. Um because I I'm just trying to find a a solution um that we could uh move forward with this"},{"t":5133,"text":"but and yet give the the the the residents an opportunity to have some input into um or to gather more"},{"t":5142,"text":"information for them um to be able to make them feel comfortable about this happening within their neighborhood as well. And I'm just not really sure how to go about that."},{"t":5153,"text":"Okay."},{"t":5154,"text":"Yeah. If I uh uh if I may, um we we c we do have a um a training calendar for the"},{"t":5160,"text":"year and it is possible for us to uh you know de develop a schedule uh that we can make uh available. We could also uh"},{"t":5168,"text":"post it when we do plan on on being on premises providing our operational schedule uh allows it."},{"t":5177,"text":"Thank you for that chief. Um, I guess my other question would be around the maintenance as well. Um, because that"},{"t":5184,"text":"that to me is is kind of shocking um in regards to uh us allowing a property to be if it's in that sort of disrepair."},{"t":5194,"text":"Um, I would like to know um from staff if we can up the maintenance on that property and take care of some of the um"},{"t":5201,"text":"the things that the the residents around there have have talked about tonight because that to me seems like that would be an issue that we would really want to take care of."},{"t":5213,"text":"We give that to the chief. Chief, how's your green thumb? Mr. Graham. Oh, miss."},{"t":5220,"text":"Well, through the chair, I I I can jump in actually in in assistance with to Mr."},{"t":5225,"text":"Graham. Uh, you know, the fire department does have uh some um some funds that were allocated for capital uh improvements to support training uh"},{"t":5234,"text":"which you might be able to to work with facilities to provide some uh support and financial options um uh over the coming uh period of time."},{"t":5244,"text":"Wanted to add something?"},{"t":5245,"text":"Yes. Uh thank you, worship. uh you know, council could direct staff to uh to consult with the neighbors and have a conversation with them, report back to"},{"t":5254,"text":"council in terms of what we can do, um you know, u to increase the maintenance and the the costs and resources involved in that. We can report back to council,"},{"t":5262,"text":"but uh that is something that council could direct staff to do."},{"t":5267,"text":"Right. Thank you for that. Uh I'll go to councelor Green and then I have a question."},{"t":5271,"text":"Um are you taking comments yet or just questions at the moment? We don't have a motion on the floor, but uh so probably try and really keep us to questions at"},{"t":5279,"text":"this point, then we can get some direction from council and speak to that for comments. [snorts] Okay, then through you mayor to staff and thank you very much um for all the"},{"t":5287,"text":"information. Um, it says in the report that part of the intended use was temporary municipal"},{"t":5296,"text":"offices. And I guess my question is what is required to make those habitable then given the state of of what the neighbors"},{"t":5304,"text":"have reported and and the fact that the house is being used for something very different at the moment. Um, what was"},{"t":5311,"text":"the plan around um temporary office space? Thank you."},{"t":5317,"text":"Go ahead, Mr. Green."},{"t":5318,"text":"That will be a question for the applicant."},{"t":5320,"text":"Okay. Yeah, Mr. Sorry, I thought I saw you raise your hand. Uh, Mr. Graham, my my impression here is that the municipal office space is essentially not not really on the books at this point."},{"t":5329,"text":"Uh, through your worship, there's there's no active plans to do that. It is an emergency backup for business continuity. If if one of our other facilities had a flood or something like"},{"t":5338,"text":"that, the interior of the building is is clean, usable. There's one toilet that I would probably replace if I had it. Uh, the roof doesn't leak, the windows are"},{"t":5346,"text":"sealed. Um it is not in uh in inside it is in good condition. Thank you."},{"t":5355,"text":"Thank you. Um and then I'll my question is is probably to Mr. Green and I'll sorry I'll go to councelor Smart first."},{"t":5363,"text":"Oh thank you um three mayor just a procedural question to staff. Um just following up on the conversation around the table. Um just trying to take into"},{"t":5370,"text":"consideration the the timelines but the um needs we've heard today. I wondered if we were potentially to go ahead with"},{"t":5377,"text":"option two to approve with conditions and to request that council um have an opportunity to approve a proposed maintenance and training um schedule."},{"t":5388,"text":"Would that address some of the um concerns around um delaying approval of the project um at all or would it have"},{"t":5397,"text":"the same um time implications that were a concern for the chief?"},{"t":5404,"text":"Mr. Green for your worship to council smart I guess um you know council could approve this with some conditions that"},{"t":5412,"text":"are delegated to staff to work with the applicant on. So you could say that you know council could approve subject to uh"},{"t":5420,"text":"pre a preissuance condition subject to receiving a maintenance plan or a training schedule from the applicant to"},{"t":5427,"text":"address council's concerns or you could ask for that to come back. You know, the benefit of a temporary use permit is that council can add whatever generally"},{"t":5436,"text":"whatever condition they so choose as long as it's generally related to that application. That is the benefit of a temporary use permit. And so council"},{"t":5443,"text":"could ask add a specific condition to that permit. Or you could defer it to receive that information and defer a"},{"t":5450,"text":"decision to a later date. I it would be ideal to a specific date. So then we wouldn't need to give notification again if you indeed deferred it to a specific"},{"t":5458,"text":"date um to receive that further information. That is also an option for council as well."},{"t":5466,"text":"Um and then my question is to Mr. Green and it just touches on a couple of comments made in the course of the of the discussion and that is"},{"t":5475,"text":"around the uh the uh combining of the two lots. There is certainly some some value for us to continue to keep them as"},{"t":5482,"text":"they as they currently are. Um, so is there is there a legal require I know the building does straddle both lots. Um, but is there a legal requirement?"},{"t":5490,"text":"Could we do two temporary use permits essentially bridging both lots or is there a legal requirement for a temporary permit to be attached to a"},{"t":5497,"text":"single lot? Mr. Green, thank you worship. No, I guess from the planning department's perspective, we've been treating this applicant as if they"},{"t":5504,"text":"were any other applicant. And so if this was a private land owner, not the district, then we would have that same requirement that we would want to try"},{"t":5513,"text":"and address that legal non-conforming nature, i.e. there's an expectation that a property is brought into compliance with uh the district's zoning bylaw."},{"t":5521,"text":"Acknowledging that if if from a council's perspective, if council wanted to remove that condition because they felt that it would be uh more uh"},{"t":5530,"text":"beneficial in the long run to have two legal locks rather than one, then obviously council could delete that condition. Um but it's just that we"},{"t":5538,"text":"would have been essentially acting as a as this development authority and treating this applicant like we would treat any other applicant uh in this process."},{"t":5545,"text":"Right. Okay. Thank you. And yeah, I guess I'm looking at this really through the lens of the the the temporary part of the temporary use permit and and try"},{"t":5552,"text":"to minimize the uh both impact and and changes if we since we don't know what the future holds. So"},{"t":5560,"text":"I guess there one thing that I would add is that obviously that is a legal non-conforming building. It cannot the legal non-conformant can't be"},{"t":5568,"text":"exacerbated and so there can be no changes to that building that would exacerbate any of those existing"},{"t":5575,"text":"non-conformances and without either uh bringing that by bringing that property into compliance by removing the building"},{"t":5582,"text":"and meeting those setbacks or seeking a development variance permit to en allow those exacerbation of that that variance or that encroachment."},{"t":5592,"text":"Sure. And just to that point, is there anything in the proposed uses here that that would be anticipated?"},{"t":5601,"text":"No. Uh your worship, in terms of what the applicant has currently submitted is an applicant to use that building in its"},{"t":5608,"text":"current form with no further changes to the building in relation to u that legal nonconforming building in relation to F"},{"t":5617,"text":"and um the uh straddling of the uh that legal lot line. All right. Thank you very much."},{"t":5624,"text":"Any other questions? If not, we're going to try and seek a proposed motion here to to speak to councelor Appleton."},{"t":5633,"text":"Thank you, worship. So, I will I'll test the will of council here and see whether this works. Um, so I will uh propose a"},{"t":5639,"text":"motion based on option two. So, I will I will propose to move that council uh"},{"t":5646,"text":"approve the temporary use permit for the property located at 1538 Montterrey Avenue. uh with additional conditions of"},{"t":5653,"text":"use uh of which there are two. Uh firstly that Oak Bay facility services"},{"t":5660,"text":"and the fire service host a joint public information session to outline fire training scope and schedule and receive"},{"t":5668,"text":"feedback with respect to parking and site upkeep. And secondly, let the applicant explore options to utilize"},{"t":5676,"text":"fire services training capital funds to expand the program of site maintenance."},{"t":5683,"text":"second that and I would like to put a little amendment on there for one other condition if I could. We'll let the uh the mover speak to it first"},{"t":5691,"text":"and if there's a go ahead councelor Appleton your comments if you wish to hear councelor brief's proposed motion if you wish."},{"t":5698,"text":"I guess it depends on the scope thereof. Sure."},{"t":5701,"text":"My my my um amendment would just be around um a schedule of maintenance for the property to be included. I think"},{"t":5708,"text":"that was essentially included in there that that conversation that that was sort of the intent your worship but I think clarifying is fine."},{"t":5716,"text":"No, it's fine as long as as long as we have that maintenance for that property that's great."},{"t":5720,"text":"I think there's in the second part of that is to expand the program of site maintenance. I think we've heard that the current program of site maintenance"},{"t":5726,"text":"is is not adequate. So or at least as per the discussion."},{"t":5731,"text":"So why don't you speak to your motion councelor Appleton?"},{"t":5734,"text":"Thank you worship. Um, you know, just there is there's a balance to be struck here uh with with this and I and I hear loud and clear from the neighbors and"},{"t":5743,"text":"the members of the public that want more information about what's going on. It represents a change in in use of the property. There's no doubt about it. Um,"},{"t":5750,"text":"there's going to be an unsignificant amount of activity that's going on around the site and I think that everybody in the neighborhood deserves a chance to understand really clearly"},{"t":5759,"text":"what's happening um and at what time what to expect. That's important. and at the same time uh ensuring that the the"},{"t":5767,"text":"property as a whole is is kept up and hopefully you know improved cosmetically as part of the ongoing use of the site"},{"t":5775,"text":"for training. So I think that that would constitute an improvement. I do believe I am in favor as per the motion of the"},{"t":5782,"text":"temporary use permit going ahead now and it's important for the public to to be reminded of the fact that it is becoming"},{"t":5789,"text":"increasingly more complex for the fire service. Uh fire training requirements are expanding. Uh we have as the public"},{"t":5798,"text":"is well aware we have reduced training capacity ability on the actual firefighters park site because we were"},{"t":5806,"text":"in need of a new fire apparatus which requires its own building which requires an expanded footprint. This uh constrains what fire services can do on"},{"t":5814,"text":"the site and at the same time they have expanding training requirements. As has been referenced here, training cannot happen outside of the district. as we've"},{"t":5822,"text":"talked about around this table many times that we we only have one crew and so that's while training that service that crew has to be available to deploy"},{"t":5831,"text":"while they're doing that training. So it severely limits the number of potential options for training sites and and I can"},{"t":5839,"text":"certainly recognize that there are uh suboptimal things about this particular site. It is in close proximity to the"},{"t":5846,"text":"village. Um there's there's certainly a discussion to be had with the local community about how operations are"},{"t":5854,"text":"deployed on the ground and I'm sure our fire services will work with the community to kind of come up with the best solution on that side of things."},{"t":5860,"text":"But uh I think that there's a conversation there to have but I do think that it's important that the temporary use permit move ahead now with the understanding that uh those services"},{"t":5869,"text":"will consult with the public and have that conversation with the neighbors. Thank you worship."},{"t":5874,"text":"Thank you. Further discussion council in the briefly."},{"t":5879,"text":"Yes, Mayor, if I may. Um the the second part of that um the second part of those conditions does raise a question for me and I wonder if I could ask it to staff."},{"t":5890,"text":"It was about the actual source of the funds for the maintenance. Would that be in order?"},{"t":5897,"text":"It is. Although I'm not sure they would have an absolute answer at this point."},{"t":5900,"text":"We had a comment from M from the chief that they may have some funds available."},{"t":5904,"text":"Mr. Graham as the applicant. I'll give that over to you."},{"t":5908,"text":"Uh through your worship, if I understand the question correctly, is is the amount of funds or where they're coming from. Sorry."},{"t":5914,"text":"No, my question was going to be about this motion is very specific as to the source, but I wondered if it would if there was a possibility that there be"},{"t":5921,"text":"other places where those funds could be sourced from that weren't capital accounts that could also um solve this problem. So, I just didn't want our"},{"t":5930,"text":"motion necessarily to be too narrow if we we should go broader and that was with all respect to the mover."},{"t":5939,"text":"Mr. Graham, uh through your worship, uh we would actually we would actually have to use an operating account. We can't use a capital account for landscaping and and"},{"t":5946,"text":"upkeep that way. But, uh what we can do is through budget amendments. We can we can shift money around. I'm paraphrasing, but yes, we can make that work."},{"t":5956,"text":"Thank you. So, if I may, I maybe I would I if it's possible, I could suggest to the mover that we just make that language a bit more generic as opposed"},{"t":5964,"text":"to pointing to a fund that can't actually be used. Is that to the mover?"},{"t":5972,"text":"I'm amendable about your worship. Yeah, it's I I understand completely the end the the the inability to apply capital funds to maintenance. For sure. Um, I"},{"t":5980,"text":"was just reflecting what I've heard, you know, Chief McDonald reference as far as some available funds and that sort of thing. But, uh, certainly if there were,"},{"t":5987,"text":"uh, operating surplus or another, uh, another location that facility services might be able to find those operating"},{"t":5995,"text":"funds and if necessary amend the financial bylaw in order to reflect that, then I think that that's certainly an option as well."},{"t":6003,"text":"Sure. If I just before I go on with other comments, I just probably worthwhile just can you just read the proposed motion again just so we all have the uh the language fresh in our in mind."},{"t":6014,"text":"So then I would I guess then I'm looking to amend part two then your worship because that so I specifically referenced capital funds but I think it with your with the amendment to remove"},{"t":6022,"text":"the amendment would be and that the applicant explore options uh to uh"},{"t":6030,"text":"uh reallocate district funds to expand the program of site maintenance. Okay."},{"t":6037,"text":"Okay. Thank you. So there's two two parts to that. One is consultation with neighbors and and improved maintenance."},{"t":6042,"text":"Is that the two pieces? Okay, councelor Wraithweight."},{"t":6046,"text":"Uh yeah, thanks very much. Um and I think this this is far more supportable than um option one. Um I think that we do have to support our fire department"},{"t":6054,"text":"uh to assist with their fire training, but I also think that we have to support our the neighbors as well and the residents. So I hope it alleviates some"},{"t":6061,"text":"of um their concerns. Um and I'm sure that if it doesn't and if there's issues that they'll come back and talk to us."},{"t":6068,"text":"Thank you. Counc Patterson."},{"t":6073,"text":"Yes. Thank you, Mayor. I I will support the amendment put forward and and in general, I support this. In fact, it's"},{"t":6081,"text":"already being used for this. So, putting into place a temporary use permit is is is"},{"t":6088,"text":"a little late in coming because it is already being used. But, um I particularly um appreciate the uh"},{"t":6097,"text":"consideration of improved site maintenance. uh because we are not really being a good neighbor and it if"},{"t":6105,"text":"we if we want residents to maintain their properties in good condition. I think that it uh it's up to us to set"},{"t":6114,"text":"the example. So, and I I I think also um and chief isn't in the room, but I I"},{"t":6121,"text":"think that the fire department will uh be able to review just the logistics of how the training exercises are carried"},{"t":6128,"text":"out because it is a very very public area, heavily used during the day, and there isn't um there is not an easy way"},{"t":6137,"text":"to cross the street to avoid it unless you go all the way back to the the crosswalk at the fire hall. So um you"},{"t":6144,"text":"know so there are a few things but I think it we are already putting the building to this use. We understand the reasons why we have to do this to"},{"t":6152,"text":"support our fire department but we can certainly um look at improving the site conditions for the neighborhood."},{"t":6160,"text":"Thank you. Any other speakers on the Oh go ahead. Councelor Green."},{"t":6164,"text":"Thank you very much and I too will support the motion. But I just want to say I think this is a really good lesson for us as as a property owner. Um, we've"},{"t":6172,"text":"talked about a maintenance bylaw in Oak Bay off and on over the years. Um, this um, unfortunately we we're the poster"},{"t":6180,"text":"child for why we need a maintenance bylaw on this particular home. And that's not a criticism of of anyone, but I know this house has been the object of"},{"t":6188,"text":"many ideas and and and minations about its future. So, I'm very pleased with the motion. And I um appreciate uh"},{"t":6196,"text":"councelor Appleton's motion and and councelor Braithweight's amendments, but I I just want to say that, you know, we we must be good neighbors. We are"},{"t":6205,"text":"setting the example for the rest of the community. I think it's really important and that maybe we have a chance now to sort of reexamine that. I also agree"},{"t":6213,"text":"that we have to support our fire department. Um knowing the chief as I do, I think he will work hard to develop a working relationship with neighbors. I"},{"t":6221,"text":"think that's an absolute imperative. and I know the neighbors will appreciate that and I'm sure that they will get back to us if there are any challenges ahead. Thank you."},{"t":6234,"text":"Thank you, Councelor Green. Um I have one question for the chief with the motion that's on the floor uh to Chief"},{"t":6240,"text":"McDonald through myself. um you know hearing the concerns raised about the impact on the on the uh parking and on"},{"t":6248,"text":"the transport of people and on the village itself. Um as as the uh schedule"},{"t":6256,"text":"is developed uh is it fair to to uh assume that the fire department will look at the days of use of that"},{"t":6264,"text":"particular house recognizing that some have to be done on twotory as noted. uh there are some aspects of that that that the house is essentially unique in the"},{"t":6272,"text":"in the readily available sites but that they can look at that as to how often it has to be used and minimize the use of"},{"t":6279,"text":"that site uh to minimize the impact on the neighborhood. Um so I'm just going to give that over to you chief just because I think that's one of the"},{"t":6287,"text":"concerns that I've heard from the from the neighbors and I think probably from the business community would would reflect that as well."},{"t":6294,"text":"Uh thank you worship. Um, you know, excellent point and and yes, the you know, the fire department um can be very diligent in in developing our training"},{"t":6303,"text":"plan to um you know, be very conscious about the uh you know the options that we have and where we are are using it."},{"t":6311,"text":"And I think we can also be a bit more mindful with regards to you know how we are are um managing uh the site when we"},{"t":6320,"text":"are on scene and ensure that we do have a um a safety officer who can either you know stop training and you know shaffer"},{"t":6328,"text":"um you know the public uh through the the area safely and and be um you know a a respectful neighbor in this regard."},{"t":6340,"text":"The question was really just at this table because one of the points raised here was around the uh the direction whether or not to require the um the"},{"t":6348,"text":"staff follow the staff recommendation which I think the current motion does of amalgamating the two lots or do we want to keep those two lots separate for the"},{"t":6356,"text":"time being subject to future planning with the village area plan. Um, so I just throw that out there as a for"},{"t":6363,"text":"conversation with the council because I think it was discussed, we should probably be clear in the motion uh going forward."},{"t":6370,"text":"I would probably suggest if someone wants to given I think the current motion as it stands would essentially keep the uh the merging of the two lots"},{"t":6379,"text":"that I think any decision by the council to not do that would probably require a motion to amend the the to give that"},{"t":6386,"text":"direction as part of the motion to to retain the two lots."},{"t":6392,"text":"I I think it makes sense to keep the the lot separate actually. Yeah. Um I I I know that in in the future."},{"t":6397,"text":"I was just going to ask if that's if if you're interested in doing that, just to make an amendment to the to the motion that So I would also include that direction."},{"t":6405,"text":"I would move an amendment to um keep the two lots separate and not amalgamate them for the duration for the duration of the of the t."},{"t":6415,"text":"Is there a seconder for that?"},{"t":6421,"text":"Okay. Yes. not uh so uh we'll leave that there. Um those are the only two set of questions I wanted to make sure we"},{"t":6430,"text":"clarified before we move forward with any other pieces."},{"t":6433,"text":"Any other discussion? So the motion on the floor is to approve the TUP but subject to uh consultation with neighbors on the use and and the impacts"},{"t":6442,"text":"and uh dedication of resources to improve the maintenance of that lot."},{"t":6451,"text":"So I'm going to and put that to question. All those in favor and those opposed, seeing none opposed, that"},{"t":6458,"text":"carries. Uh that was a more complicated application than I was anticipating. So, thank you everybody for the uh for the discussion and thank you very much to"},{"t":6465,"text":"the neighbors for coming out and sharing your experiences uh and uh and input."},{"t":6471,"text":"Um you're welcome to everybody's welcome to stick around, but uh you don't have to. [snorts] Um because we move on to 10.3, which is another temporary use"},{"t":6480,"text":"permit. Um, and this one for Cadbury Bay Road and Cranmore Load Road parking lot."},{"t":6485,"text":"Uh, we've had a number of pieces of correspondence on this one. Uh, and I'll give this over to Mr. Hatfield. Welcome."},{"t":6491,"text":"Thank you, worship. This is another district initiated temporary use permit application for council's consideration."},{"t":6497,"text":"This application is for the unadressed district-owned parking lot located at the corner of Cadaro Bay Road and Cranmore Road. The purpose of this"},{"t":6505,"text":"application is to permit the use of the property for a limited recycling depot use for a period of three years. The applicant for this application is the"},{"t":6512,"text":"district's engineering department. This application was initiated by the district in line with council direction received at a special council meeting"},{"t":6518,"text":"held on June 15th, 2026. Staff were then directed to participate in the capital regional districts beyond the curb initiative and prepare and submit a"},{"t":6527,"text":"temporary use permit application for the subject property in question."},{"t":6531,"text":"Planning staff are recommending the temporary use permit application be approved based on the proposal's alignment with district official community plan policy. The proposed"},{"t":6539,"text":"temporary use also represents a service level enhancement to the existing recycling drop off services offered to residents while posing no cost to the district. No permanent site changes are"},{"t":6548,"text":"proposes are proposed and operations would be limited to weekends from 8 a.m."},{"t":6552,"text":"to 6 pm as a condition of the temporary use permit that staff are recommending avoiding the peak congestion in this area often associated with school operations."},{"t":6561,"text":"Planning staff are here to uh answer your applications and speak to the application. Steve Renick, the uh district's director of engineering public works is present today to answer"},{"t":6569,"text":"any questions council might have on this application as well. Thank you."},{"t":6574,"text":"Thank you very much. Did you wish I had anything uh director Renick?"},{"t":6578,"text":"Uh thank you very much, Mr. Mayor. No, I believe that uh between the discussion that we had in June and Mr. Hatfield's"},{"t":6585,"text":"introductory comments, um I think I'm I'm happy to take questions."},{"t":6589,"text":"All right. Thank you very much. We have had some correspondence from the public on this. Um and I'll turn it over to the members of council for questions. I'll go to councelor Smart and then brief."},{"t":6599,"text":"Thank you um through Mayor um to director Renick. Um my first question was just with regards to whether or not"},{"t":6607,"text":"parking within the parking lot will be um reserved to allow people to park in the lot when they're using the"},{"t":6614,"text":"facilities. I just wondered if there's a parking plan at this point."},{"t":6619,"text":"Mr. Rick, uh through the mayor, we had not intended on having reserved parking in"},{"t":6625,"text":"that lot for uh the use of the depot. Uh ultimately putting restrictions on municipal parking lots is something that"},{"t":6634,"text":"council has delegated to staff. I think that if we were seeing a persistent problem of people parking vehicles there"},{"t":6642,"text":"and then walking to the rec center or something like that and and impeding the ability for that site to be used for recycling, uh I think we would have"},{"t":6650,"text":"tools in the toolbox to be able to manage that. Anything else?"},{"t":6656,"text":"Uh yes, through you may director. My other question was just with regards to some of the emails we received and I wondered if can you um uh remind us is"},{"t":6665,"text":"street parking enforced on the weekends um just if there's some incorrect parking Mr. Renick Mr. B."},{"t":6677,"text":"Thank you, Mayor. To you. Um, during the weekends, uh, there is less enforcement uh on parking. However, if there are uh"},{"t":6685,"text":"serious things that need to be addressed, a way police will be able to address those."},{"t":6690,"text":"Thanks, Dr. Smart."},{"t":6695,"text":"Thank you. and three emerges. My last question is just with regards to um has there been communication or response from the the school district on this?"},{"t":6706,"text":"Give it to staff I think for the notification I think or Mr. Enick."},{"t":6710,"text":"Uh thank you through the mayor. They school district would have received a notification because the high schools within the notification window but I'm"},{"t":6719,"text":"not aware of any response from the high school or from school district 61. Breathway."},{"t":6727,"text":"Thanks very much. Yeah, mine was around traffic as well because there there's no I know there we haven't done a traffic study around that area. Um but um"},{"t":6736,"text":"[clears throat]"},{"t":6737,"text":"there there may there could be um people queuing up for to get in and out of that um to drop off. And I'm wondering"},{"t":6745,"text":"whether or not um the vehicles uh could be interfering with emergency access because of the the fireh hall being so"},{"t":6753,"text":"close by. And I'm wondering if there's anything in place for that or if you have any anticipation of there being that many vehicles that could interfere with emergency access."},{"t":6764,"text":"Mr. Renick, uh through the mayor, I don't see the amount of vehicles really being a major concern and ultimately uh they are"},{"t":6773,"text":"vehicles. They do have a requirement to to pull the right and stop if they hear an emergency vehicle approaching with with lights and sirens on. So, uh, on"},{"t":6781,"text":"the whole, I I I don't think that's a concern. Patterson."},{"t":6787,"text":"Yes. Thank you, Mayor. And I I would, uh, through you to staff. Just wondering if there has been any further considerational for directional traffic"},{"t":6797,"text":"because the traffic can approach that site either from Cranmore or from Cadbur Road. um Cadro Bay Road, of course, it's"},{"t":6805,"text":"the bus stop and the uh the crosswalk is located in that location. And while"},{"t":6813,"text":"Sunday it may be quieter, Saturday it's very busy busy pedestrian and traffic"},{"t":6819,"text":"flow. Um so I I I fail to understand how"},{"t":6826,"text":"we will have um smooth interaction between the cycling lane, the pedestrian"},{"t":6833,"text":"crosswalk and vehicles if they're coming from both directions and and then exiting. So I just like further"},{"t":6841,"text":"clarification to see if staff have given that more consideration. Mr."},{"t":6847,"text":"uh through the mayor. Similar to the response with regard to the parking restrictions, I I think that those are are tools that we can use in"},{"t":6855,"text":"consultation with the operator if we do see a need. I do understand the concern that's being raised of well, would it be"},{"t":6863,"text":"better for the flow of traffic if it was if you made one entrance the entrance uh and and the other one the exit? But then"},{"t":6870,"text":"you have the concern of well now do people have to make a left turn off of Cadro Bay Road in order to get into the site when they would rather come around"},{"t":6878,"text":"from the Cranmore side for example. And I I'm just overall of the opinion that I think we should see the site in operation before we make changes to how"},{"t":6887,"text":"the vehicles uh enter and exit it."},{"t":6894,"text":"Yes, thank you. So for clarification, what I'm hearing then is that if this is if if this goes forward tonight, the"},{"t":6901,"text":"staff will be still monitoring this and making adjustments as ne necessary to protect the safety of uh pedestrians and cyclists too."},{"t":6913,"text":"Mr. Rick through the mayor that is 100% correct. All right. Thank you."},{"t":6920,"text":"Other questions?"},{"t":6922,"text":"There's a process here. As there's no more questions, we'll go to the public for comments and we'll come back to this table for potential direction. Um, I"},{"t":6930,"text":"think I'll leave my questions for the time being and and invite members of the public who wish to speak to council. We do have some correspondents for consideration. Please come on in."},{"t":6941,"text":"You probably heard the process before."},{"t":6943,"text":"We try to be not intimidating. Just uh have a seat, turn on the microphone, which is the center button. Perfect. and then just state your name, municipality"},{"t":6951,"text":"of residence, and then you have address council."},{"t":6953,"text":"My name is Sasha Vilber, and I'm a resident of Oak Bay for many years. Uh,"},{"t":6960,"text":"and I rent an apartment in one of those apartment buildings uh near Oak Bay High Oak and I support this temporary use"},{"t":6969,"text":"permit for a recycling site at this location. Um, I think it's a great idea and I look forward to using it to"},{"t":6976,"text":"recycle uh my glass and soft pla plastics and batteries etc. Um, I hope"},{"t":6984,"text":"that this new recycling opportunity will help to reduce the amount of recyclables in the uh the landfill and um I'd like"},{"t":6992,"text":"to suggest that uh you also put some kind of collection option for um clothing on the site. [snorts] Um, for"},{"t":7001,"text":"example, uh there are those pink uh uh Lifetime Network bins like the ones at"},{"t":7008,"text":"St. Phillips on uh on Easttown. I don't know if you've seen those. They're in the parking lot. Um and uh those bins"},{"t":7015,"text":"are for clothing, shoes, and um household items like um bedding and toys and that type of thing. So yeah, thank you."},{"t":7026,"text":"Thank you very much. I should just point out uh this is a capital regional districtwide program that they're driving the the standards with the"},{"t":7034,"text":"bottle depot and setting those. So it's not our program that we're selecting what kind of services are going there."},{"t":7040,"text":"Uh we're agreeing to a temporary use permit or not uh to allow a site for them to run that operation. So Oh, I see."},{"t":7047,"text":"Yeah. So that we the the type of things like flexible packers, styrofoam, etc."},{"t":7052,"text":"batteries, light bulbs are set by the uh by this regional program, not by Oak Bay."},{"t":7058,"text":"Okay. Well, um you can just have a seat down so people at home can hear if you have anything else. I'm just just for your clarification. It wasn't"},{"t":7065,"text":"Yeah. Oh, I see. Okay. Yeah. Um, so I just for your clarification, um, I just want to say that it this, uh, Coastal"},{"t":7071,"text":"Networks, um, is an organization that like they, uh, they run the the bins and they have people pick things up and, um,"},{"t":7081,"text":"and regularly empty them. They don't allow things to overflow from the bins and uh, they have uh, phone numbers on"},{"t":7089,"text":"the bin to contact if there's any problem. Um, and yeah, so yeah, thank you very much. Thank you."},{"t":7097,"text":"Um, any other members of the public either online or in person wish to speak?"},{"t":7104,"text":"Okay, I have uh Mr. Zulka online. You're welcome to uh to address council. Just unmute you. There we go. Same process as before. Name and municipality, please."},{"t":7114,"text":"Uh, wonderful. You can hear me? Okay. Can please go ahead."},{"t":7117,"text":"Lovely. Uh, hello uh um uh your worship uh counselors. My name is Eric Zelka in the north part of Oak Bay. Uh, thank you"},{"t":7125,"text":"for the time to speak today. I stand before you firmly opposed to the temporary use permit for the proposed recycle depot at Cadbury Bay Road and"},{"t":7132,"text":"Cranmore Road parking lot. While the idea of expanded recycling sounds appealing, it sounds great. Sounds like"},{"t":7140,"text":"we're doing something. Yay. The practical evidence and realities and the direct impacts on our community simply do not justify this location. If you"},{"t":7149,"text":"absolutely must proceed with this, then the district Oak Bay lands north of Cedar Hill crossroads at Henderson Recreation Center uh which are not used"},{"t":7157,"text":"on the weekend. It appears might be much more appropriate or possibly Harleen Point uh might be a good place. Both those areas have very few services"},{"t":7166,"text":"available and uh might as well spread the services around across Oak Bay uh and because they would have fewer impacts on on a residents. And first we"},{"t":7175,"text":"must acknowledge the actual efficacy of what we're collecting. The narrative around soft plastics and styrofoam is highly misleading. According to numerous news reports, including from the CBC,"},{"t":7183,"text":"only about 5% of this soft plastic waste and styrofoam is actually recycled. Soft plastics normally jam up processing"},{"t":7191,"text":"machinery, etc., etc., and end markets often reject mixed or contaminated bales of it. It ultimately ends up being burned, sent out of province, goes to landfill, etc., etc."},{"t":7202,"text":"um uh we're forcing uh a local neighborhood disruption for a global processing system that is fundamentally broken. And by the way, the the current"},{"t":7210,"text":"system was built assuming everything could be sent to China. China no longer receives our recycling. So um uh it'd be interesting to see how much money we're"},{"t":7218,"text":"actually making from styrofoam and soft plastics uh from our current operations."},{"t":7222,"text":"Recycle BC suggests 98% of materials actually collected are recycled. Having worked for this BC government and seeing many, many failed initiatives with great"},{"t":7231,"text":"marketing, I do not believe those numbers. Second, I question the basic necessity of this new site. We already have a working facility, the district's"},{"t":7239,"text":"dropoff depot public works yard on Elgen Street, just north of Oak Bay, down the road from this site. It already accepts soft plastics and styrofoam."},{"t":7246,"text":"Importantly, that Oak Bay facility is already fully staffed and open to residents on Saturdays. Duplicating this"},{"t":7253,"text":"exact smelly service beside a school and in the middle of residential area makes no sense. And finally, we must consider the severe impact on the immediate"},{"t":7262,"text":"neighbors. There's a vast difference between community youth fundraiser uh and and a recurring depot. The impact to community groups such as the Fifth Gary"},{"t":7270,"text":"Oak Scout Group, the Girl Guys, and other community groups who already do bottle collection uh such as the one in Canarvin Park. Uh those one-day"},{"t":7277,"text":"localized volunteer events are are fantastic. They will be impacted by this. Uh what is being proposed with this permit is completely different"},{"t":7284,"text":"operation. This depot will be staffed by return of personnel handling depot deposit materials. Introducing a cash"},{"t":7290,"text":"exchange for empties guarantees a steady stream of heavy traffic. People will be lugging bags of clinking bottles and"},{"t":7298,"text":"cans in a residential area, broken glass, etc., etc. These are realities."},{"t":7302,"text":"If you any of you have actually tried to return uh stuff down to to the uh um return it facilities downtown, constant"},{"t":7310,"text":"vehicle idling, noise and disruption that's entirely inappropriate for this location. How will you, council, guarantee that no leftover garbage,"},{"t":7319,"text":"broken glass or smell will be left over uh for the for the schools and for the neighbors to deal with? And finally, how"},{"t":7326,"text":"will parking be maintained at the end of this TUP since this um permit says it must be returned to the zoning as"},{"t":7335,"text":"indicated and that zoning does not allow parking. So again, the TU has to be modified in this case. I urge council to deny this permit should you happen to"},{"t":7343,"text":"silly to in my opinion go ahead. Thank you. Bye. Thank you councelor Zilka."},{"t":7349,"text":"Uh, any other members of the public who wish to address council?"},{"t":7356,"text":"I'm just going to pass one question off to staff. Um, my understanding of this is can you just clarify the uh um the"},{"t":7366,"text":"funding of refundable deposits? Is this a return for cash or is it a drop off uh facility without payment?"},{"t":7374,"text":"Thank you for the question, Mr. Mayor."},{"t":7376,"text":"Uh this was the first that I had heard about it being a cash refundable. Uh certainly the way the program was presented to us by the CRD was that it"},{"t":7384,"text":"was a drop off recycling. Um certainly do not anticipate that it's being cash returns."},{"t":7393,"text":"All right."},{"t":7395,"text":"So we may want to make that clarification as part of our approval of the T if that's a concern of council. Um"},{"t":7402,"text":"uh any other questions? Uh, I don't see any other members of the public who wish to address council."},{"t":7409,"text":"If you wish to speak for a second time, we don't usually allow that, but you're I very much appreciate it. Very brief."},{"t":7416,"text":"Thank you again. It's Eric Zelka in North Oak Bay. The staff report, if you read it carefully, it actually talks about returnables before cash with"},{"t":7425,"text":"exchange. It's in the staff report. So, if you approve this, you are approving [gasps] money exchanged by the return of st personnel. Please read the Mr. Zelka."},{"t":7435,"text":"Thank you, Mr. Zelka. It does refer to refundable beverage containers. It does not speak specifically to it, the"},{"t":7442,"text":"refunding happening at the site. Um, if you could just make your comments briefly. We don't usually have secondary."},{"t":7448,"text":"I didn't hear a lot of um support like um backup for the assertions just made and um I support uh your idea of just"},{"t":7457,"text":"going ahead and doing it and seeing how things go. I mean, I look in our garbage cans every day at the building I live in."},{"t":7466,"text":"That's fine. They need to try something. Yeah. Thank you for your comments."},{"t":7471,"text":"Uh, I'm just going to make sure every member public that wishes to speak has a chance to speak. I don't see any other hands raised though at this time to speak. Oh, Mr. B, please come forward."},{"t":7480,"text":"Same process. Name, municipality, residents."},{"t":7484,"text":"Then I'm going to bring it back to this table for discussion and direction. if you just turned it off."},{"t":7494,"text":"Hello everyone, mayor and council. Thank you again. Uh my name again is Anton Brackage, resident of Oak Bay. Um"},{"t":7503,"text":"from from what I've heard, I think this this sounds like a perfectly reasonable thing to approve. I would support it as well. Um, [sighs]"},{"t":7512,"text":"and I would say that I I would agree with this that the what criticisms we've heard of it do not appear to be particularly wellounded in my view."},{"t":7522,"text":"Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Brackich."},{"t":7528,"text":"One more chance for the members of the public to address council."},{"t":7533,"text":"All right. Seeing none, I'm going to come back to this table. Uh, I'm going to seek there is there's I'll just see if there's any questions before I go to"},{"t":7541,"text":"seeking a motion. No more questions. Go ahead, Council Watson. Uh, yeah. I'd like to move the staff recommendation that council approve temporary use"},{"t":7548,"text":"permit TUP00002 for the property located at the corner of Cadar Bay Road and Crmore Road. Second."},{"t":7557,"text":"Seconded. Thank you. Just to speak briefly to you. Uh yeah, just to say I think this is a great initiative and it's a lovely marriage between a program"},{"t":7565,"text":"that the CRD is willing to come forward and do and our own uh needed direction to staff to find some options for"},{"t":7572,"text":"pedestrians and cyclists to be able to uh access recycling facilities within the community. So I think uh it solves"},{"t":7580,"text":"it it it solves that issue uh really beautifully and provides um regular access to the same kind of facility that"},{"t":7587,"text":"they don't have access to at the municipal yard. Thank you. Thank you Appleton."},{"t":7595,"text":"Thank you worship. So certainly support what's on the table here. I I I guess I would call the public and and council's attention is is very good timing. There"},{"t":7603,"text":"was actually an article presented on the CBC just today um with respect to what they referred to as wish cycling which"},{"t":7610,"text":"is sort of crosscontamination of recyclables um and how this has actually become a significant concern in some"},{"t":7617,"text":"other municipalities u as council's probably aware and staff certainly knows that you we're required when operating our municipal recycling"},{"t":7626,"text":"systems to keep uh contamination by other materials down below a certain level or actually in some cases risk"},{"t":7634,"text":"financial penalties and in and in uh certain situations too much contamination can obviously result in"},{"t":7641,"text":"the whole load of recyclables not being recycled and in fact landfilled. So there was just a recent article about how significant the issue is becoming."},{"t":7651,"text":"So this I think really provides a directed opportunity for us to provide an opportunity for folks to recycle"},{"t":7658,"text":"things which are not bluebox. Many things are not bluebox materials. Some things are not available for recycling at our current dropoff depot. Uh so"},{"t":7667,"text":"provides a real tactile and a real practical way for people to minimize crosscontamination which has real uh"},{"t":7674,"text":"real concrete and uh significant potential results for the district if contamination be expands beyond a"},{"t":7682,"text":"certain level. So it has a lot of practical benefits in my mind your worship. Thank you. Thank you very much councelor Green."},{"t":7690,"text":"Thank you very much and I'm happy to support the motion. I think we also have a year in which to assess the location in terms of traffic safety and public"},{"t":7699,"text":"pedestrian safety and so on. And I think um neighbors will have a chance to weigh in and uh so we have a a year to sort of"},{"t":7707,"text":"trial this program and I think it's it's a good opportunity to do that. But I am mindful of some of the concerns that have been expressed about traffic noise and parking."},{"t":7720,"text":"Uh thank you councelor Patterson. Yes."},{"t":7722,"text":"Thank you, mayor. Well, I I guess I'm hesitant at supporting this, but uh I I recognize it is a temporary use."},{"t":7731,"text":"However, I I must admit I am a bit disappointed that we are placing yet"},{"t":7738,"text":"more traffic flow in in a in a part of the community where where people have already expressed so many concerns about"},{"t":7748,"text":"transportation issues and I live through that daily. So, I I certainly appreciate"},{"t":7754,"text":"those those concerns and uh I think that while we are considering this, we"},{"t":7761,"text":"haven't as a council um received a transportation overview of this area and"},{"t":7768,"text":"how it does function and the changes and how they will be monitored um to ensure"},{"t":7776,"text":"that we are not um it it feels like we're overburdening a part of the uh community uh that is"},{"t":7786,"text":"already taking more than their share of the burden while relieving it from from other areas. And so I just put those"},{"t":7792,"text":"comments out there while I I support some of the initiative by the CRD and certainly it will provide the"},{"t":7799,"text":"opportunity for people to access this on foot or or other methods like that. Um,"},{"t":7808,"text":"I could see certainly where it it also could add to a lot of the transportation problems that the area is already"},{"t":7816,"text":"experiencing. So, while I'll support it, I think that we we need to we need to pay more attention to what we're doing"},{"t":7823,"text":"transportation in that whole area. Thank you."},{"t":7827,"text":"Thank you very much. Um, don't see any other discussion. I just want to raise the flag. I think the the question was"},{"t":7834,"text":"raised and and it seem to be just a lack of clarity on the on the question of whether or not this would be acting as a"},{"t":7842,"text":"as a commercial payer of refundables. Uh and so I think if that's not part of I mean I will point out there is payable refundables immediately across the"},{"t":7850,"text":"street basically at Savon Foods and at the liquor store. And so if there's something we don't we want to be able to receive them but don't want this become a commercial transaction place we may"},{"t":7859,"text":"want to make that as a condition of the of the top at least we get the information back. So Miss Hunt yeah thank you your worship I did actually have a look at the CRD's beyond"},{"t":7867,"text":"the curb website and it says beverage containers and in brackets donation only. So I don't believe that they are thank you for looking that up. I was"},{"t":7876,"text":"trying to find it but a few too many things going on here. Uh thank you for that clarification. So I don't think we need any more clarification for that. Um"},{"t":7884,"text":"and I don't see any other hands. I'm going to call the question. All those in favor? Any opposed? None opposed. Uh thank you very much. I move to 10.4 uh"},{"t":7893,"text":"which is a correspondence management policy update. Miss Anderson, this was before committee of the whole and there's been a couple of changes based"},{"t":7900,"text":"on the feedback. Uh so over to you for the uh for the update."},{"t":7905,"text":"Uh thank you mayor. That was my opening comments. [laughter] Um but it is providing clarity for council corresponding with the public"},{"t":7914,"text":"related to governance related matters and correspondence timelines and process when it relates to bylaws subject to public hearing. So the revisions are"},{"t":7921,"text":"incorporated into the version before you for consideration of approval."},{"t":7926,"text":"Thank you very much. It is subject to public input. So I'll take questions first and then public and then back to this table. I have please wait then."},{"t":7934,"text":"Thanks very much mayor. Um and thanks so much for um implementing those um those suggestions from last week. That was awesome. Um, and I I just have one"},{"t":7941,"text":"question in regards to the to the words disregarded and deleted when it comes to um, council submissions around the"},{"t":7948,"text":"public hearing process. Um, I I'm just wondering I I understand the legal reasoning for that, but I'm just"},{"t":7956,"text":"wondering whether um, deleting correspondents might raise questions."},{"t":7960,"text":"So, I'm wondering if it might be more appropriate to say that the correspondence would will not be considered as part of the public hearing process, but will be retained as part of"},{"t":7969,"text":"the corporate record rather than deleted, or is there a reason why we would say um disregarded and deleted?"},{"t":7977,"text":"Miss Anderson was looking at Mr. Bull, you can hand this off if you want."},{"t":7989,"text":"I give it to Mr. Paul. Thank you, Mayor."},{"t":7992,"text":"Um um this is I haven't looked at the legislation, but we we could. And uh um I think that there's another uh set of"},{"t":8001,"text":"correspondents. I think that gets provided later after the decision is made. So I think this could be treated the same, but also look at Miss Anderson"},{"t":8008,"text":"who has spent more time on this policy than I have. So thanks."},{"t":8014,"text":"Yes. Thank you. said um 9.5 is in relation to correspondence received by council members. So it is sitting in your inboxes. It isn't a corporate"},{"t":8022,"text":"record at that point. So there would need to be a transaction between the council member forwarding it to corporate in order for it to be on file"},{"t":8031,"text":"with us. And that there it does muddy the waters on what is being considered as part of the public hearing package at that point. So when it hits the inboxes"},{"t":8039,"text":"of those individual council members, it would be better to disregard and delete because then there couldn't be any confusion that it had been considered as part of the public hearing."},{"t":8047,"text":"Thank you. That makes sense. Thank you. Thank you, Council Wson."},{"t":8052,"text":"Uh yes, thank you. And I also have a question for Miss Anderson. And it's just a clarification. um when the when the up Thank you for the updates to the"},{"t":8061,"text":"draft on the flowchart document uh the correspondence flowchart"},{"t":8068,"text":"attachment three on the second page there's just something that I didn't quite understand and it may not have gotten updated at the same time as the"},{"t":8075,"text":"rest of the policy did and it's stream five and that would be on page 140 of the agenda or I think it's page 20 of"},{"t":8084,"text":"your report um it says council members members who have received correspondence after public hearing deadline but before decision. So that's the item and then it"},{"t":8092,"text":"says inform the member of the public that at the public hearing they will have the opportunity to be heard or to present written submissions for the"},{"t":8099,"text":"public record. The chronology the chronology of that doesn't make sense to me. It speaks to something about"},{"t":8107,"text":"correspondence after the public hearing but it gives advice for what to do before the public hearing. So I just wonder if I'm missing something there."},{"t":8118,"text":"I think that's referring to the public hearing deadline, not the public hearing per se."},{"t":8124,"text":"Okay. So, as long as you guys know what that me I I I couldn't parse that, but"},{"t":8129,"text":"[laughter]"},{"t":8130,"text":"maybe it just is missing a word. Anyway, I'll leave that to you."},{"t":8135,"text":"And thank you through the mayor. We could we we can update this to include the deadline more more consistent language with the policy if it would make it easier."},{"t":8142,"text":"Yeah, it would. Cuz I actually couldn't follow it. So I would I would certainly appreciate that. Thank you. Yeah, it's I I hear what you're saying."},{"t":8149,"text":"I think the wording is correct, but I think part of it is just because the carriage return happens after, you know, correspondence after public hearing and"},{"t":8157,"text":"so you sort of trigger that that's after the public hearing, but of course it continues on deadline. And so I think anyway, I don't think it affects the actual uh policy. I think that can be"},{"t":8166,"text":"either a formatting thing or just some minor clarification language changes."},{"t":8172,"text":"Any other comments or questions at this point? Uh, anybody from the public wish to address this item on the agenda, which is a 10.4 correspondence management policy?"},{"t":8185,"text":"Take a moment. Nope. Nobody has raised their hand online or in person. So, I'll come back to this table for direction."},{"t":8192,"text":"I'll move the recommendation. This is for approval of the correspondence management policy. Thank you. Moved and seconded. Um any further discussion?"},{"t":8201,"text":"There's no we had a robust de discussion on this a committee of the whole. So I don't uh anybody's wondering why this is going through so smoothly. That is why"},{"t":8208,"text":"all those in favor. Any opposed? None opposed. Thank you very much Miss Anderson for that report and for joining us tonight to be here to present it. Uh"},{"t":8216,"text":"we move then to section 11. This Saturday is not for public input um uh relating to bylaws and permits. 11.1 is"},{"t":8224,"text":"for 2630 Margate Avenue. This is a zoning bylaw amendment. Miss Claver is with us again to uh to introduce this item and the applicant is here as well."},{"t":8234,"text":"Please go ahead."},{"t":8235,"text":"Thank you. Um mayor and council, this report uh as you noted refers to a zoning bylaw amendment application for"},{"t":8244,"text":"the property located at 2630 Market Avenue. The application specifically seeks a sightsp specific amendment to"},{"t":8252,"text":"facilitate the construction of a new single family dwelling and an associated patio directly outside of the rear of"},{"t":8260,"text":"the property of the residence. Um there is a protected mature uh atlas cedar in"},{"t":8267,"text":"the boulevard and so the sighting of the new residence specifically is cited um to avoid um or or at least to protect"},{"t":8277,"text":"the critical tree uh root system of this tree. Um and also because of the sloping of the site the the house is positioned"},{"t":8284,"text":"exactly where it is. Um because under the district zoning bylaw um patios um"},{"t":8291,"text":"exceeding 8 in above natural grade um do trigger uh or fall under the definition of floor area and floor area and uh"},{"t":8301,"text":"being a measurement of density if uh [snorts] you exceed the allowance um a zoning bylaw amendment is required."},{"t":8309,"text":"Hence why we're here today. So um a tree management plan uh was submitted. Uh so"},{"t":8316,"text":"it did consider this mature tree as well as the remaining site. Um the parks department did evaluate this tree"},{"t":8324,"text":"management plan. Um and the walkway actually was uh from the the front entrance was actually redesigned to"},{"t":8332,"text":"consider parks department referral comments. Um and ultimately they're they're satisfied with the current plan."},{"t":8338,"text":"Um, ultimately the amendment is pretty limited in scale. It represents a pretty modest exceedence of the permitted floor"},{"t":8346,"text":"area and lot coverage. Um, and which this primarily relates to the inclusion of the elevated patio. So ultimately"},{"t":8355,"text":"staff recommend first, second, and third reading as well as adoption of the bylaw tonight. Thank you."},{"t":8362,"text":"Thank you very much, Miss Claver. Are there any questions for the applicant or staff? Please go ahead, councelor Braithweight, and then Um, thanks very"},{"t":8370,"text":"much, Mayor. I have two questions. Um, the one would be if we did accuse um approve this amendment, could a future"},{"t":8377,"text":"owner uh choose to enclose the patio without getting a zoning amendment, M. Clever."},{"t":8384,"text":"So, it would have to fit uh specifically the the variances that were we're including in this bylaw amendment speak"},{"t":8392,"text":"to the lot coverage and the F or the floor area. And ultimately we've increased it ever so slightly. I think"},{"t":8398,"text":"you could see it's at 32% and um.5 for F to include to include sorry to inclo in"},{"t":8407,"text":"why can't I speak tonight [laughter] to make the patio incl."},{"t":8415,"text":"[laughter]"},{"t":8416,"text":"Can we do some bloopers please? um ultimately that would trigger even further and so ultimately that would"},{"t":8423,"text":"very likely exceed what is being um approved tonight and so we would have to come back um to council."},{"t":8430,"text":"Thank you for that. And then my second question um is uh the the rear um setback the required rear set setback is"},{"t":8438,"text":"like 7.6 6 meters, but the proposal is providing like 18.74 meters. Um, which is quite large. And I'm wondering if"},{"t":8446,"text":"there was any consideration given to moving the house slightly forward if it would still protect the trees. Um, it's probably a question for the proponent."},{"t":8454,"text":"Um, just because then because you do have such a a large rear setback in the in the back."},{"t":8460,"text":"Sure. So, just need to state your name and municipality residence and then you can answer the question."},{"t":8465,"text":"Sure. Hi, my name is Louis Harvat. Good evening, mayor, council. Um, so if I understand the question correctly, it is"},{"t":8472,"text":"it if we were to move the building forward toward the toward the street."},{"t":8477,"text":"Um, so we haven't considered that only because of the root zone of the tree, the root zone is right is touching our"},{"t":8485,"text":"building right now. So it's it's as far forward as we would like to push it. Um, yeah. [clears throat]"},{"t":8492,"text":"Okay. Thank you. Any other questions for staff or the applicant?"},{"t":8498,"text":"I'm not seeing it. It's usually a good sign. Yeah."},{"t":8501,"text":"Um so, uh I'll turn to the council to see if someone wishes to I'll move that council give first and second reading to zoning bylaw number"},{"t":8509,"text":"3531 1986 amendment bylaw number 4976 2026."},{"t":8513,"text":"Second move and seconded. Any discussion?"},{"t":8518,"text":"Not seeing any. All those in favor? Any opposed? Not opposed, please carry. I'll move that council give third reading to"},{"t":8525,"text":"zoning bylaw number 3531 1986 amendment bylaw number 4976 2026 and seconded. Thank you. There is a"},{"t":8533,"text":"debate on third reading. All those in favor? Any opposed? None opposed."},{"t":8537,"text":"And I'll move that council adopt zoning bylaw number 3531 1986 amendment bylaw number 4976 2026."},{"t":8544,"text":"Seconded. Thank you. Uh before I call the question, since there's unanimous agreement on this, just want to congratulate you and uh wish you all the best with the project. It'll be it'll be a lovely project and a lovely street."},{"t":8555,"text":"So, good luck. All those in favor? Any opposed? None opposed? Car. Yeah. Thank you. Uh moving on then to item 11.2."},{"t":8564,"text":"This is 310 King George Terrace zoning bylaw amendment. Mr. Green, this is an application we had some time ago, but with some modifications."},{"t":8572,"text":"Yeah, thank you. This item relates to a zoning amendment application that council gave three readings to on November the 24th, 2025."},{"t":8582,"text":"Since that time, the applicant has received updated survey information from the surveyor for the subject property, which has altered the proposed lot"},{"t":8590,"text":"layout. Because the proposed CD8 zone was specifically for this proposed subdivision of the subject property,"},{"t":8598,"text":"amendments are also required to the zone to accommodate the updated survey information specifically in relation to the minimum lot size and minimum lot"},{"t":8606,"text":"width. As such, staff are recommending that council receive third reading of the zoning amendment bylaws and that council amend the bylaw and give third"},{"t":8613,"text":"reading to the bylaw. Staff are also recommending that a section 219 covenant be registered as a charge on title to secure the accessible washroom for the"},{"t":8622,"text":"secondary suite and either lot two, lot three or lot four and ensure that a residential fire sprinkler system is installed in each of the residential"},{"t":8629,"text":"units to address the concerns of the fire department. The applicant is also here to answer any questions that council may over the application and"},{"t":8636,"text":"also happy to answer any questions that council may have on the uh application."},{"t":8642,"text":"Thank you. very convenient having the same applicant for for two applications, but I'm too bad that you're here at the end of the night, not the beginning. Uh, councelor Brieweight."},{"t":8651,"text":"Uh, thanks very much, Mayor. And I just wanted to um clarify from staff that um aside from the res uh revised survey and"},{"t":8658,"text":"corresponding lot dimensions that no other aspect of the development has changed, including building size, floor area, setbacks, landscaping, anything like that."},{"t":8667,"text":"Mr. Green, that is correct. There's only those changes to the minimum lot area and the minimum lot width that has changed as a"},{"t":8675,"text":"result of that updated survey information and that was a result of a posting plan adjacent to this property which then required the surveyor of this"},{"t":8684,"text":"property to submit a new posting for this property which then resulted in this ability to change the proposed plan of subdivision."},{"t":8693,"text":"Thank you. And then my my next question um is uh does the narrower lot create any challenges for uh emergency access?"},{"t":8705,"text":"So the the proposed common property i.e."},{"t":8708,"text":"The access driveway for these four lots is below 6 m which is the cut off for when a fire department requires those"},{"t":8716,"text":"buildings to be sprinkled. And that is the reason for the section 219 that would require the four buildings to be sprinkled at time of building permit."},{"t":8724,"text":"And we're recommending that this be dealt with through a section 219. So that at the time of building permit uh that that covenant will be on title for"},{"t":8732,"text":"the building department to know that there is a requirement for those four buildings to be sprinklered. Thank you, Mr. Barv. I can just get you to turn off your microphone. It's just that's okay."},{"t":8741,"text":"Thank you. Uh just prevents any feedback loop from happening. Uh any other questions for staff or the applicant? Councelor Watson."},{"t":8749,"text":"Yes, I do. Um actually, um it's about the sprinkling requirements in the driveway width and I just wondered um"},{"t":8756,"text":"the sprinkling adds, you know, I don't know proportionally, but it certainly adds cost to the project. And I wondered if the"},{"t":8763,"text":"alternative of widening the driveway access was one of the things that was considered if you could meet those fire requirements without having sprinkling and if that was something that was ever"},{"t":8771,"text":"discussed with the applicant or a possibility."},{"t":8775,"text":"Mr. Green uh through your worship to council Watson. Yes, that was a a comment back to the applicant to say that they the new plan of the"},{"t":8782,"text":"subdivision had a a driveway with less than six meters which was the requirement for our fire department and as such the applicants had already"},{"t":8789,"text":"agreed that the buildings would be happy to be sprinkling those buildings."},{"t":8795,"text":"Yeah. So, if I could also just direct can I direct a question to the applicant just so that I I'm clear about that."},{"t":8802,"text":"Were you actually able to consider widening the driveway as an alternative to sprinkling? Was that was that a design process that you actually contemp"},{"t":8811,"text":"you you thought through that that might have saved you the cost of sprinkling?"},{"t":8814,"text":"Maybe it was six of one half dozen of the other. I don't know."},{"t":8818,"text":"Um, yes. Uh, we did we did look at widening the driveway. Um, what ends up happening is the driveway width comes closer to"},{"t":8828,"text":"the south property line and there are a number of trees that we're planting and we're trying to salvage along that property line. So, that's one reason we"},{"t":8835,"text":"didn't want to do it. Um the second reason is uh it increases the impermeable paving. So I I think we're"},{"t":8844,"text":"at our limits right now with impermeable coverage."},{"t":8849,"text":"So So that's another reason that we we decided not to do it."},{"t":8853,"text":"Great. Thank you. I just wanted to understand that. Great."},{"t":8857,"text":"Thank you. I don't see any other questions and we don't have public input on this item. So I'll need someone to go through. There's a number of uh of"},{"t":8864,"text":"bylaws that have to be read into the record. Uh so if we can start somewhere, uh your worship, I would move that"},{"t":8872,"text":"council resend the third reading of zoning bylaw number 3531 1986, amendment bylaw number 4937 2025."},{"t":8880,"text":"Second. Seconded. Thank you. Any discussion? Go ahead, councelor Brie."},{"t":8885,"text":"Uh thanks. Um, I actually um went back and looked on this one because I remember it um coming to council before and I I did vote in opposition of this"},{"t":8893,"text":"um based on what I felt was the neighborhood fit and density. Um and that rationale for me is is really"},{"t":8900,"text":"largely unchanged. I think it's I think you'll end up with a nice product, but I think that for me it's it's a little bit too much density for that neighborhood"},{"t":8908,"text":"fit. So I I'm I'm probably going to end up voting against all of these which seems weird to be voting against a resins and then um so I might vote for"},{"t":8917,"text":"the first two but then I'll be voting against the the the next ones. So thank you."},{"t":8923,"text":"Understood. I appre always appreciate comments of voting against things. Uh so we have a mover and a seconder uh for"},{"t":8930,"text":"the motion to resend. Uh see no discussion. All those in favor? Any opposed? None opposed. I worship I would"},{"t":8938,"text":"move the council amend zoning by law number 3531 1986 amendment by law number 4937205 by a revising the minimum lot area in"},{"t":8946,"text":"section 7.8.5 uh subsection 1 to 286 square meters and b revising the minimum lot width in section 7.8.5 subsection 3 to 5.5 m."},{"t":8960,"text":"Seconded. Thank you. Any discussion? All those in favor? Any opposed? None opposed. Please continue."},{"t":8969,"text":"I would move your worship the council give third reading to zoning by number 3531 1986 amendment bylaw number 4937 2025 as amended."},{"t":8978,"text":"Second. Seconded. Any discussion?"},{"t":8982,"text":"Seeing none. All those in favor and those opposed. Council braith oppose. That carries."},{"t":8988,"text":"This is a large one you worship. Uh, I would move that council direct staff to work with the applicant on a covenant under section 219 of the land title act"},{"t":8996,"text":"registered prior to adoption of zoning bylaw number 3531 1986 amendment bylaw number 49372025"},{"t":9004,"text":"as a charge against title to all of the land in the proposed comprehensive development zone that secures a the provision of an accessible washroom for"},{"t":9012,"text":"the secondary suite on either stratalot 2, three or four and b the provision of residential potential fire sprinkler"},{"t":9020,"text":"systems for all units in the development in compliance with the BC building code, BC fire code and building and plumbing bylaw number 4247."},{"t":9030,"text":"Second move and seconded any discussion seeing none. All those in favor any opposed councelor Braithweight to oppose that carries."},{"t":9040,"text":"Uh so this is not for adoption at this point. We come back for a future uh piece of that correct subject. Okay."},{"t":9048,"text":"Thank you. Uh we then moved to good luck with the project. Although we'll come back here for final adoption after all those things are done. Uh we now move to"},{"t":9057,"text":"uh sessions items 113 through 116. These are all related to the uh blasting regulation changes. Um Mr. B, I'll let"},{"t":9066,"text":"you provide the introduction for all four and then I'll I'll go through them procedurally."},{"t":9071,"text":"Thank you. Um the new blasting and rock breaking bylaw uh represents the culmination of a review that began in"},{"t":9079,"text":"2020 in response to resident concerns regarding blasting activities in Oak Bay. Since that time, staff have"},{"t":9086,"text":"completed technical review work and multiple rounds of public and industry consultation and the proposed regulatory framework in the bylaws now seeks to"},{"t":9095,"text":"balance community livability objectives with the practical and safety considerations raised throughout the process."},{"t":9102,"text":"Um, as the bot implemented, staff will continue to monitor uh its effectiveness and we would report back to council on"},{"t":9109,"text":"any significant issues or recommended amendments that might emerge through experience with the new regulations. Um,"},{"t":9116,"text":"yeah, today these four bas are in front of you for adoption and that would introduce the new regime as of tomorrow and we have done our preparations. We"},{"t":9125,"text":"still have some to complete uh but we're largely prepared for this change. Thank you."},{"t":9130,"text":"Great. Thank you very much, Mr. B. Uh, are there any questions on any of these before I get to the motions? Go ahead,"},{"t":9137,"text":"Council Green. Oh, go ahead, Council. We had questions. I think she was going to move. Oh, I was going to make a motion."},{"t":9143,"text":"I just had a really quick question. Um, there there I noticed that it says one blasting permit every 12 months. And I'm"},{"t":9150,"text":"wondering what happens if a project like legitimately has requires two blasting phases. Do we just have to grant an exemption in that case?"},{"t":9161,"text":"Mr. B."},{"t":9163,"text":"Thank you, Mayor. For you, there there is an option to either extend the permit uh for certain reasons. That might be one option. And the other option uh for"},{"t":9172,"text":"an extra permit, I'm not quite sure. Um but um yeah, that might be through"},{"t":9182,"text":"council decision if the pilot doesn't give staff that option. Thanks. Thank you."},{"t":9190,"text":"Green, I'm prepared to make a motion. Second, can I just uh I need you to read it into the motion to the record, please. So, for 11.3."},{"t":9201,"text":"Sorry."},{"t":9204,"text":"I just need that council adopt blasting and rock breaking by number 4958 2026."},{"t":9210,"text":"Moved and seconded. Uh any discussion? Okay. All those in favor? Any opposed?"},{"t":9218,"text":"Not opposed. That carries. Can you just continue on council brace if you have it handy for 11.4"},{"t":9226,"text":"uh for um 11.4? Yeah. I I'll move that council adopt anti noise bylaw number"},{"t":9232,"text":"3210 1997 sorry 1977 amendment bylaw number 4960 2026."},{"t":9238,"text":"Seconded. Thank you. Any discussion on adoption? Seeing none. All those in favor? Any opposed? None opposed."},{"t":9246,"text":"And I'll move that council adopt building and plumbing bylaw number 4247 2005 amendment bylaw number 49592026"},{"t":9255,"text":"and seconded. Thank you. Uh all those in favor opposed and 11.6."},{"t":9263,"text":"I'll move that council adopt planning building and development fees and charges bylaw number 48452023"},{"t":9269,"text":"amendment bylaw number 49612026 blasting."},{"t":9274,"text":"Move and seconded. Thank you. All those in favor? Any opposed? None opposed. Is there any new business or notices emotions?"},{"t":9281,"text":"Not seeing any. We will see you all here in September. Uh so have a great August"},{"t":9288,"text":"and uh hopefully there's no emergency meetings before. Before that, uh we move now to adjournment. I have a motion to adjurnn. Move second. All those in"},{"t":9296,"text":"favor? Any opposed? None opposed. 929 and 59 seconds. Just squeeze under the 9:30 barrier."},{"t":9304,"text":"Thank you everyone."},{"t":9306,"text":"[sighs]"}],"words":25986,"fetchedAt":"2026-10-03T01:34:28.407Z"}