{"videoId":"0ec98110-5927-46d1-8e31-bce34d5eb981","source":"assemblyai","segments":[{"t":5,"text":"I will see. Can you hear me now?","speaker":"A"},{"t":7,"text":"We can.","speaker":"B"},{"t":9,"text":"Wonderful.","speaker":"A"},{"t":46,"text":"Okay.","speaker":"C"},{"t":47,"text":"Good evening everyone. It is 7pm and I am going to call this meeting to order. In the chambers tonight we have Councelor Thompson, Councilor Graham, Councilor King and Councilor Paltiel. And online we have Mayor Windsor and Councillor Newton.","speaker":"D"},{"t":65,"text":"I'll start off by respectfully acknowledging that the land on which we gather is the traditional territory of the Wasanich people, including the Sartlip and Seot First Nations.","speaker":"D"},{"t":77,"text":"I'll look for a motion to approve the agenda as amended by amendment by adding late correspondence for action as item 11. 2, late correspondence to item 13. 2 and late correspondence for information as items 17. 24 to 17.","speaker":"D"},{"t":96,"text":"27.","speaker":"D"},{"t":95,"text":"If I may. Yeah, sure, I'll move that. And I would like to amend. Move to amend or do that now. 17. 5 to be moved up to actionable letters. That's correspondence from Mr. Dunnell that would go under 11.","speaker":"E"},{"t":114,"text":"Okay. Is there a seconder? Councillor Thompson?","speaker":"D"},{"t":121,"text":"Thank you. I wanted to move items 171 and 72 up to actionable, not for","speaker":"F"},{"t":133,"text":"open","speaker":"G"},{"t":133,"text":"discussion per se or presentation, but more to make motions relative to referrals to staff.","speaker":"F"},{"t":143,"text":"Okay. Councillor King, are you agreeable to adding those two additional items?","speaker":"D"},{"t":146,"text":"Sure.","speaker":"E"},{"t":147,"text":"Okay. Okay, so I've added action or. Sorry, item 17. 1, 17. 2 and 17. 52. Correspondence for action. So that's the amendment we're voting on? That's the motion we're voting on. Is anyone opposed? Carried.","speaker":"D"},{"t":167,"text":"Okay, I'll look for a motion to adopt the minutes from August 10th, 2026, special open council meeting.","speaker":"D"},{"t":176,"text":"I'll move all three sets of minutes from the 10th and the 18th.","speaker":"H"},{"t":183,"text":"Okay, anyone posed? Carried. All right, I have no business arising from the minutes. We have no rise in report, so we'll move into public questions or feedback.","speaker":"D"},{"t":196,"text":"So if there's anyone out there that would like to come up and ask a question of council or provide some input, please. Please. Do we have a maximum of two minutes per person.","speaker":"D"},{"t":213,"text":"So we ask that you do keep your remarks short and I'm sorry, before you get started, please state your name and your address or neighborhood.","speaker":"D"},{"t":227,"text":"Hello, my name is Brian Mycroft. The following comments address the development application at 7012 East Sanich Road and 6996 Central Sanich Road. That is being introduced later in this meeting.","speaker":"I"},{"t":243,"text":"Our home sits at the apex of the L shaped lot formed by the above two lots.","speaker":"I"},{"t":252,"text":"If developed, the north and east sides of our home will become a 61 car above ground parking lot 10ft from our home and our north and east valley views will be eliminated by a 50 foot wall of rental units.","speaker":"I"},{"t":273,"text":"One of the greater points of contention regarding this application is its non conformity to the ocp, which I refer to in the critique that is now attached to the application documents and was recently emailed to all the council members.","speaker":"I"},{"t":294,"text":"The results of a traffic study apparently conducted by the developer prior to the application being submitted did not in fact form part of the submitted application.","speaker":"I"},{"t":308,"text":"Since that time the Keating flyover has been completed substantially changing the traffic pattern for the purpose of safety.","speaker":"I"},{"t":318,"text":"A new study should be completed at the direction of the municipality and form part of this application before it goes to the Advisory Planning Commission.","speaker":"I"},{"t":331,"text":"With Respect, Councillor Peltiel's 2022 electoral declaration lists Graham Mann of GT Mann as the developer.","speaker":"I"},{"t":341,"text":"Can we just keep our comments to to the application?","speaker":"D"},{"t":346,"text":"Pardon me?","speaker":"I"},{"t":349,"text":"Oh, sorry, sorry. We do try not to just. We try not to address individual members of council in our remarks.","speaker":"D"},{"t":356,"text":"So if you just keep your remarks to the proposal and the concerns that you have, I'd really appreciate is","speaker":"D"},{"t":366,"text":"it is about the application. So can I speak it or no?","speaker":"I"},{"t":373,"text":"I'd ask that you not address individual or reference individual members of council in your comments. Thank you.","speaker":"D"},{"t":380,"text":"Okay, I'm finished. Thank you very much.","speaker":"I"},{"t":382,"text":"Thank you very much for your input.","speaker":"D"},{"t":392,"text":"My name's Mark Gillis and I live at 2253 Cooper Ridge and Homeowners position A number of homeowners position on the development application of PL 1701 homeowners on Central and East Saanich roads Cooper Ridge Drive, Lynn Lane and Winifred Place Support appropriately scaled and context sensitive development consistent with the ocp.","speaker":"J"},{"t":418,"text":"However, this proposal departs significantly not only from site specific zoning but also the principles and policies of the ocp. Represents a level of density and form that is incompatible with the surrounding neighborhood and exceeds local infrastructure capacity.","speaker":"J"},{"t":438,"text":"A more moderate form of density that aligns with form and character, scale and infrastructure capacity of the surrounding neighborhood would be more appropriate.","speaker":"J"},{"t":450,"text":"The major concerns include conflicts with the OCP which has been endorsed by the Mayor and council. By introducing a scale and density far exceeding the existing context.","speaker":"J"},{"t":464,"text":"Failing to provide a gradual transition between housing forms and locating high density development outside designated village centers. The site is approximately 3 km from the nearest village center, making it car dependent and inconsistent with climate and transportation objectives.","speaker":"J"},{"t":485,"text":"The proposed development belongs closer to village centers and the services they provide. Second, inconsistent with current zoning. Third, inconsistent with. Sorry. Parking and traffic impacts are primary concern. Real world parking guidelines call for 1.","speaker":"J"},{"t":503,"text":"5 places per unit or 90 vehicles for this development. The shortage of places will likely result in increased on street parking, pressure on already constrained residential roads.","speaker":"J"},{"t":522,"text":"Okay, would you mind wrapping it up? Yeah. Thanks very much.","speaker":"D"},{"t":535,"text":"Conflicts with current zoning and OCP policies and fails to recognize the form and character of the existing neighborhood. For these reasons, residents strongly urge mayor and council to reject this development application.","speaker":"J"},{"t":554,"text":"Thank you very much for your input. Hello.","speaker":"D"},{"t":563,"text":"Good evening.","speaker":"H"},{"t":564,"text":"My name is Stephen Salter. My family lives on Verning Avenue, and I'm here to speak about the zoning amendment, bylaw 2278 and a Keating business district Extraction lands rezoning.","speaker":"K"},{"t":576,"text":"This must be surely one of the largest developments in the history of Central Saanich.","speaker":"K"},{"t":582,"text":"And it has the potential to either make life better for residents or worse, to enhance public safety, to enhance our quality of life, or to degrade it.","speaker":"K"},{"t":594,"text":"I'm deeply concerned that the rezoning and development process has been too rushed and has not included adequate engagement and consultation with first nations nor with residents of Central Saanich.","speaker":"K"},{"t":606,"text":"I'm concerned that risks regarding road safety and public safety have not been adequately evaluated by independent and qualified professionals, such as those working for Road SafeBC, for example, who could also recommend ways of mitigating risks of additional traffic.","speaker":"K"},{"t":622,"text":"As taxpayers, it is also not clear to us how the proposed development costs or charges rather, will fully fund any additional infrastructure which Central Saanich may have to implement.","speaker":"K"},{"t":634,"text":"This would be infrastructure for potable water, firewater, stormwater, potable water, and so on.","speaker":"K"},{"t":640,"text":"If development charges prove to be inadequate in the future, developers will not be paying for the additional costs that will be us as taxpayers for generations to come. We ask that Central Saanish members reflect on this question.","speaker":"K"},{"t":656,"text":"Ask yourselves whether such a rushed process, mere weeks before a municipal election is in the best interest of the public. Thank you.","speaker":"K"},{"t":666,"text":"Thank you very much.","speaker":"D"},{"t":678,"text":"Hi.","speaker":"L"},{"t":678,"text":"Hello.","speaker":"D"},{"t":679,"text":"I'm Claire. I'm from Just Peachy Childcare. And before we get to more serious","speaker":"L"},{"t":683,"text":"matters, do you want to say your","speaker":"B"},{"t":684,"text":"name or do you want me to say your name? This is my friend Elliot. And at the 75th celebration, the anniversary of Central Saanich, the community was able to paint this together.","speaker":"L"},{"t":696,"text":"So we had all sorts of families, young, old, come together and create this art piece. So we would like to just give it to Central Saanich to commemorate.","speaker":"L"},{"t":709,"text":"Thank you very much.","speaker":"D"},{"t":743,"text":"Good job.","speaker":"F"},{"t":743,"text":"Thanks, buddy.","speaker":"L"},{"t":749,"text":"Do we have our next speaker? Come on up.","speaker":"D"},{"t":753,"text":"Hi, my name is Vanessa Busier. I am from 6966 Central Sandich Road. And I too am opposed to the redevelopment and Zoning bylaw Amendment to the 6966 Central Sanich Road and 7012 East Sanich Road.","speaker":"M"},{"t":765,"text":"My correspondence was the 13. 2 edition that I wrote earlier today. And just in case it's not read out loud, I did want to take an opportunity to highlight my concerns.","speaker":"M"},{"t":776,"text":"So Central Sanich in this area that the proposed zoning bylaw amendment is going to occur. There's already significant traffic volumes and I'm really concerned about the additional traffic that will add to also congestion with the 61 units.","speaker":"M"},{"t":790,"text":"In particular, I really want to highlight my existing safety concerns which I also have brought up with Central Sanich police. But those concerns shouldn't be their concerns. Every single day. I've called them about the speeding.","speaker":"M"},{"t":803,"text":"It's a 30 kilometer zone from the stretch of East Saanich at Central Saanich all the way up to Central Saanich and the Saanich crossroad and then all the way up to Keating. There are fewer.","speaker":"M"},{"t":815,"text":"And this is an estimate because obviously I'm not going to sit there and count all day.","speaker":"M"},{"t":821,"text":"I'm a mom, I'm a worker.","speaker":"N"},{"t":823,"text":"Less than 25% of cars are going the speed limit of 30 kilometers an hour. I walk that road four to five times a day to pick up my son, walk my dog.","speaker":"M"},{"t":834,"text":"Not only that, but people cut the corners. People don't stop at the stop signs. And that doesn't even take into account when you're at a crosswalk. We're lucky that the crosswalk at Keating has a flashing light.","speaker":"M"},{"t":846,"text":"Cars still go through when there's a crossing guard. So if you think about the crosswalk that's on East Saanich that goes from the bus stop over to Silverill Farm, which I'm sure some of you enjoy.","speaker":"M"},{"t":859,"text":"Also over to the mini golf course. Not once has a city in my four and a half years that I've been a resident stopped the first time I've approached that crosswalk.","speaker":"M"},{"t":869,"text":"My neighbor told me the other day, her and her two daughters stood while nine cars whizzed through that crosswalk. And what is a 61 story, 61 unit, pardon me, four story building gonna add congestion, Unsafe roads?","speaker":"M"},{"t":882,"text":"I'm all for responsible development, but that is not the spot for that size because we already have the safety concerns.","speaker":"M"},{"t":890,"text":"Okay, thank you very much.","speaker":"D"},{"t":892,"text":"Thank you.","speaker":"M"},{"t":897,"text":"Hello, welcome.","speaker":"D"},{"t":899,"text":"Are you ready for me?","speaker":"N"},{"t":901,"text":"We're ready.","speaker":"D"},{"t":901,"text":"My name is Wendy Limer. I live at 6988 East Saanich Road. Your proposed developments going in at 6996 Central Saanich Road and 7012 East Saanich Road are right behind where I live.","speaker":"N"},{"t":913,"text":"I'm going to second my neighbor on the fact that nobody stops in the crosswalks. I have been nearly hit more times than I can count and I rely on transit to go to work every day.","speaker":"N"},{"t":925,"text":"This development is going to shut down my bus stop. It's going to create more people parking on our street. We're going to have more people cutting through our back road, which is 30 that no one does 30 on.","speaker":"N"},{"t":939,"text":"You almost cannot pull out of your driveway without being hit. You can't cross at a crosswalk without cars not stopping, not looking. You can feel the breeze when they come around the corner at you.","speaker":"N"},{"t":952,"text":"As far as parking goes in our neighborhood, there is no parking. There's no parking.","speaker":"N"},{"t":957,"text":"I have had to tell people to get out of my driveway because they've parked in my driveway to go to the deli, to go to the Lions Club.","speaker":"N"},{"t":967,"text":"They park in the middle of the road with their horse trailers every Sunday to get a coffee. The middle of the road. Where are you to fill our potholes?","speaker":"N"},{"t":977,"text":"Where are you to tell people that the middle of the road is not a place to park? That parking right in front of my entrance and my mailbox seven days a week is not acceptable.","speaker":"N"},{"t":989,"text":"I ask people to move. I'm only going to be a minute. No, you're going to be an hour. I have an elderly bed bound man living in our house.","speaker":"N"},{"t":1000,"text":"You block off the access for him to have an ambulance. There's nowhere for this. This is too many people. It's too big of a building in a very established neighborhood that is not run down, that cannot support it.","speaker":"N"},{"t":1013,"text":"You don't have the infrastructure, you don't have the space.","speaker":"N"},{"t":1019,"text":"Thank you very much. Okay, I see a few more folks out there. Come on up. Hello.","speaker":"D"},{"t":1029,"text":"Thank you. My name is Veronica Boyd. I live at the corner of Patterson and East Saanich.","speaker":"N"},{"t":1036,"text":"So right here in town, and there is a Greenway Motors and the adjacent one, Small Motors, has now been sold and is under a development plan.","speaker":"N"},{"t":1047,"text":"And our neighborhood has already gotten together and we're just discussing, we understand we need development, but six stories is excessive, we feel. And just because there's other six story buildings, maybe that's setting a precedent.","speaker":"N"},{"t":1062,"text":"But we in our neighborhood feel that we don't need another six story building right there and maybe to just scale down to about three stories. If anybody knows property I'm talking about, it's right there at the.","speaker":"N"},{"t":1078,"text":"That old gas station.","speaker":"N"},{"t":1079,"text":"Right. Okay.","speaker":"I"},{"t":1081,"text":"Thank you.","speaker":"B"},{"t":1082,"text":"Thank You. Hello, welcome.","speaker":"D"},{"t":1088,"text":"Hi, my name is Robin Howe and I live at 6932 Central Saanich Road. And I am in opposition for the development at 6996 and Central Saanich Road and 7012 East Saanich Road.","speaker":"O"},{"t":1099,"text":"I don't have any prepared notes, kind of off the top echoing a lot of what other people have said. But where our house is situated, I can vouch for. We've been living there for 18 years.","speaker":"O"},{"t":1112,"text":"How much traffic goes along that road? We just reduced it to 30. The drivers don't care. They're screaming along that road.","speaker":"O"},{"t":1119,"text":"And also coming down to the bottom where East Senich and Central Saanich meet, people are going onto the highway there.","speaker":"O"},{"t":1126,"text":"So there's a ton of congestion already at that corner, which if you put a 61 unit lot or building in there with a whole bunch of parking, there's just not going to be enough infrastructure and roadway for that.","speaker":"O"},{"t":1139,"text":"My daughters grew up in this neighborhood, 26 and 15 years old. They both went to Kosk. So across from the Lions hall, every day I see kids walking down from Keating Elementary.","speaker":"O"},{"t":1151,"text":"I mean, I guess starting today, because school went back in and they're walking down to the Lions hall and they cross right where that, that development is going to be, where all of the cars are going to be.","speaker":"O"},{"t":1164,"text":"I just don't understand how children are not going to be impacted by this. I can also attest to how much parking when school is in.","speaker":"O"},{"t":1173,"text":"All along the roadway there in front of our house, all the way down the road, they're just every, like, from, what is it, 8:40 to 2:40, they're just coming in and there's a bunch of cars and then another bunch of cars.","speaker":"O"},{"t":1187,"text":"It's just not going to be conducive. The amount of traffic and infrastructure. And it's just that corner is awful. I can't explain it any other way.","speaker":"O"},{"t":1196,"text":"And for our own safety, with just the amount of traffic and vehicles and with the school and people trying to enter the highway, it's difficult for us to exit our own driveway, never mind adding a bunch of extra cars and traffic.","speaker":"O"},{"t":1211,"text":"Thank you.","speaker":"O"},{"t":1212,"text":"Thank you very much. Okay, I'll just. I appreciate the enthusiasm. I would just ask that we not clap because there may be different views in the room.","speaker":"D"},{"t":1224,"text":"And I just want to make sure that everybody feels safe to come up and speak. So thanks very much. All right, welcome. Hi, my name is Lori Morgan and I live at 6502 Hilltop Road.","speaker":"D"},{"t":1240,"text":"I'm just again, talking about bylaw 2278. Given the potential impact on our neighborhood and down on Keating and the end of Makati, we feel it's very important that this matter not be rushed through.","speaker":"D"},{"t":1255,"text":"The timing is particularly concerning with the first reading scheduled for the September 28 meeting and an election taking place like 19 days later.","speaker":"D"},{"t":1265,"text":"Residents deserve adequate notice and a meaningful opportunity to participate in the process before this bylaw moves forward.","speaker":"D"},{"t":1273,"text":"Thank you for considering our request for a public hearing, if we can get that, and for sure the residents have a fair opportunity to be heard. Thank you. Thank you very much.","speaker":"D"},{"t":1287,"text":"Is there anyone else that would like to come and speak or ask a question? Not seeing anyone else. Okay, I am going to move on through the agenda then.","speaker":"D"},{"t":1300,"text":"So we don't have any presentations or delegations tonight and no public or statutory hearings. So I'll move on to correspondence. Item 11, action required or recommended.","speaker":"D"},{"t":1312,"text":"We have two on the agenda and then we added three more which I believe are 17. 1, 17. 2 and 17. 5. So regarding 11. 1, we do have a recommendation from staff just looking to council.","speaker":"D"},{"t":1328,"text":"Does anyone have any questions or a desire to move the staff recommendation?","speaker":"D"},{"t":1337,"text":"So, I mean, I would be happy to move both letters of support for 11. 1 and 11. 2.","speaker":"H"},{"t":1345,"text":"Okay. Is there a seconder? Okay. Is anyone opposed? None opposed. So I'll move on to 17. 1. I think. Councillor Thompson, you raised 17. 1 and 17. 2. Would you like to speak to those?","speaker":"D"},{"t":1366,"text":"Yes, I just have a couple of motions I wanted to bring forward with reference to them which I will state now and I can provide a written copy to Emily, that the letter From Eric Johnson September 2nd be forwarded to planning staff for review and that staff report back to council on A the feasibility of access to and from the western expansion of the Industrial Area 1681 Keating via Alpha Road and the Butler properties.","speaker":"F"},{"t":1403,"text":"And B options for for effective screening buffer between the proposed industrial development and rural residential properties to the west. That's one. The second was.","speaker":"F"},{"t":1415,"text":"And the letters of concern received from council from Larry Scott and others, pages 113 to 117 on the agenda tonight be forwarded to staff along with the notice of motion offered by councillors Riddle and Newton and staff report back on A option for minimizing the impact of industrial traffic on Verling along with possible traffic mitigation measures.","speaker":"F"},{"t":1443,"text":"And B the consideration also be given to effective screening of industrial uses from Verling Avenue.","speaker":"F"},{"t":1452,"text":"Second.","speaker":"H"},{"t":1453,"text":"Okay, thank you. I think our corporate officer is going to try and pull that up. Just given. Were you going to or did I? You will. Okay, thank you. Because that is. It is lengthy.","speaker":"D"},{"t":1465,"text":"Okay, so Councillor Thompson, would you like to speak to that then?","speaker":"D"},{"t":1470,"text":"Well, yes, I would try to keep it quick. I mean, basically we are looking at the OCP. Clearly the OCP does support design designation or, sorry, rezoning from i2 to i1, but as far back as 1985.","speaker":"F"},{"t":1491,"text":"This is the 1985 Official Community Plan. It refers to policies relating to industrial development and depleted extractive areas to protect residential uses from unsightly aspects of industrial. Industrial land uses.","speaker":"F"},{"t":1508,"text":"That setback and screening provisions within the zoning bylaw shall reflect the need to create substantial distances between industrial and residential buildings and the need to screen industrial areas from adjacent residential areas. And there's. I won't go on.","speaker":"F"},{"t":1529,"text":"But there's other policies basically stating the same thing with respect to rezoning of extracted areas which is consistent with today's agenda.","speaker":"F"},{"t":1541,"text":"And I simply think it's important to look at those options to give us the opportunity to respond to community concerns and potentially look at site specific zoning changes that we would support.","speaker":"F"},{"t":1559,"text":"Those types of options that council may decide are appropriate.","speaker":"F"},{"t":1567,"text":"Okay, thank you very much. Is there any other member of council that would like to speak to this or to ask a question? No. Okay, maybe I'll just ask one then. Just to staff. Is this clear direction?","speaker":"D"},{"t":1582,"text":"Is there. Are you able to action this for the next meeting as part of the work.","speaker":"D"},{"t":1593,"text":"By September 28th potentially? I think that that's clear. We can, we can certainly work with that. Thank you.","speaker":"P"},{"t":1600,"text":"Okay. Oh, Councillor Newton online. Go ahead. Sorry, the hand is so tiny I'm gonna have to put on my glasses.","speaker":"D"},{"t":1610,"text":"Thank you.","speaker":"A"},{"t":1611,"text":"Chair.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":1612,"text":"I just wanted to acknowledge also the letter from Mr. Johnson that came forward and the information that he compiled and put together.","speaker":"A"},{"t":1621,"text":"So I'm happy to see this being shared to staff and see what can, you know, continue to evolve from this. Thank you.","speaker":"A"},{"t":1632,"text":"Okay, I'll call the question then. Is there anyone opposed? Okay, none opposed. The motion is carried. I'll move to you now. Councillor King with 17. 5.","speaker":"D"},{"t":1644,"text":"Thank you, madam Chair. And I note that this is very related to the letter correspondence from Mr.","speaker":"E"},{"t":1653,"text":"Mike Donnell who points out that following the July 27th council meeting, Councillor Graham made a motion to request that Central Saanich Council facilitate a meeting and provide a space.","speaker":"E"},{"t":1668,"text":"My understanding is that members of the OF PAC have not received further information as of yet. I would ask one, when will members be contacted about the next meeting? And two, will the meeting be scheduled for October?","speaker":"E"},{"t":1687,"text":"That's to begin with.","speaker":"E"},{"t":1691,"text":"Okay. So I guess this is a question. Oops, sorry. Through me to staff. Is someone available to provide that information?","speaker":"D"},{"t":1702,"text":"I can do my best. This is in Ms. Cullum's realm and she's obviously not here tonight, but we have tentatively scheduled something for the end of September and we'll reach out shortly. That's kind of all I have.","speaker":"B"},{"t":1717,"text":"All right, thank you.","speaker":"D"},{"t":1718,"text":"The remainder of Mr. Dunnell's letter is asked if we would. Well, has pointed out that there are sufficient funds within PAC and that. That to cover any costs, I suppose, and that it was mentioned.","speaker":"E"},{"t":1733,"text":"I think there's a request that if necessary, we grant what is requested here in this letter and facilitate anything, if that's required, beyond what's already proposed.","speaker":"E"},{"t":1745,"text":"So I was prepared to move that council grant the request, but prior to that I wonder if that's necessary given that there's something planned in September to facilitate.","speaker":"E"},{"t":1758,"text":"Is that the part that talks about me? I believe Ms. Cullum is making arrangements for staff support. There is money in the budget that counts, like approved in order to cover costs. So that.","speaker":"B"},{"t":1769,"text":"That's not the area of concern in the scheduling. Meaning I don't need a motion to say cover the cost. That was part of Councillor Graham's motion in July.","speaker":"B"},{"t":1778,"text":"Okay, so. So there's no need for a motion to make it happen. It sounds like it's in the works as a result of Councillor Graham's. So. And, and I. Did I hear correctly that yes, there.","speaker":"E"},{"t":1789,"text":"There may be a meeting, but there should be a meeting before October if it's at the end of September.","speaker":"E"},{"t":1795,"text":"That is certainly the goal. There's more than just us involved in this. There are three other member municipalities, so it does require the participation of the others.","speaker":"B"},{"t":1803,"text":"There are many staff as well, both from the CRD and from the Ministry of Agriculture that attend. So it's not simply us picking a date and giving out notice. So those. Those details are in the works.","speaker":"B"},{"t":1816,"text":"I wonder if we could give two minutes. I'll move that we give two minutes to the letter writer to speak to their letter","speaker":"E"},{"t":1823,"text":"second.","speaker":"F"},{"t":1825,"text":"Is there anyone opposed?","speaker":"D"},{"t":1828,"text":"Okay.","speaker":"I"},{"t":1828,"text":"None. Motion is carried. I will invite the letter writer to come forward if they so choose.","speaker":"D"},{"t":1843,"text":"Thank you.","speaker":"B"},{"t":1845,"text":"I just wanted to say that the terms of reference include a meeting on December.","speaker":"F"},{"t":1849,"text":"Sorry.","speaker":"E"},{"t":1849,"text":"On September 10th. And I guess the motion from Councillor Graham was questioning was asking whether the meeting on September 10th would be held. And I don't think that question has been answered.","speaker":"F"},{"t":1864,"text":"Thank you.","speaker":"A"},{"t":1867,"text":"Okay. Thank you. I do think I understand that it's likely not going to go ahead on September 10th. But sounds like there are plans to arrange it for later in the month.","speaker":"D"},{"t":1878,"text":"I will acknowledge we're just coming off of summer and the coordination involved. So thank you very much for bringing this to our attention and for digging in here so that we can understand where things are at.","speaker":"D"},{"t":1892,"text":"Okay.","speaker":"A"},{"t":1897,"text":"I'll move on to the next item in the agenda. So we're at reports of committees under we have nothing from the committee the whole 12.","speaker":"D"},{"t":1907,"text":"2 other committees of council and I do have a couple recommendations here from the Saanich Peninsula Accessibility Advisory Committee. Wondering if our representative might want to speak to this and provide a little bit of context.","speaker":"D"},{"t":1921,"text":"And then I'll look to council to move the recommendations if they desire.","speaker":"D"},{"t":1927,"text":"If I may chair while Councillor. Councillor Newton. Apologies for the interruption. We did it was brought to our attention that the recommendation number two spoke to Central Sanich. In fact that was an error and it we received correct.","speaker":"B"},{"t":1938,"text":"Admitted that advise it. Thank you Councelor King for that catch. It was actually assigned to North Sanich. So the recommendation is only the first one on the agenda. And apologies for the oversight.","speaker":"B"},{"t":1949,"text":"Thank you. That does clarify up things and I'm.","speaker":"A"},{"t":1952,"text":"I'm happy to answer any questions but to speak to it and I believe we sort of spoke to it when I did my committee update on this around looking to try and compile the registry for this.","speaker":"A"},{"t":1967,"text":"So I think I've already spoken about this.","speaker":"A"},{"t":1971,"text":"I think that there's an opportunity again here for us to work together as three regional governments to move forward and get the I think it's the right fit program and that information to them.","speaker":"A"},{"t":1988,"text":"Okay. Thank you very much. Is there anyone that would like to move the recommendation?","speaker":"D"},{"t":1995,"text":"Okay.","speaker":"J"},{"t":1995,"text":"I'll move it.","speaker":"A"},{"t":1997,"text":"Okay. I heard a move in a seconder. Is there anyone. Okay. Does anyone want to speak to it? No. We're all clear. All right. I'll call the question then. Is there anyone opposed? No one's opposed. Okay. Thank you.","speaker":"D"},{"t":2014,"text":"I'll look to council to see if there's anyone that wants to provide a council member report. All right. No one is raising their hand so let us continue. We're into staff reports now. We have 7100 Hamathko Road.","speaker":"D"},{"t":2032,"text":"A rezoning and OCP amendment. And and I'll look to our director of Planning and Building services to introduce the item.","speaker":"D"},{"t":2041,"text":"Thank you. Madam Chair. The purpose of this application is to formalize the existing campground use at Island View beach regional park. The CRD has operated the campground since 2010.","speaker":"P"},{"t":2052,"text":"Although the site has been used for this use prior to that. The campground currently includes 18 RV sites, 5 small trailer sites and 24 tent sites.","speaker":"P"},{"t":2062,"text":"The current official community plan and zoning designations do not fully align with this long standing use.","speaker":"P"},{"t":2069,"text":"The western portion of the campground is currently designated destination commercial while the eastern portion is designated park and the campground itself is zoned agriculture.","speaker":"P"},{"t":2078,"text":"The proposed amendments would redesignate the entire campground to destination commercial in the official community plan as this is the district's designation that permits campground use.","speaker":"P"},{"t":2087,"text":"The remaining portions of the park would also be brought into the parks and open space zone with a site specific amendment to permit the existing campground use.","speaker":"P"},{"t":2098,"text":"There is no expansion of the campground proposed as part of this application.","speaker":"P"},{"t":2102,"text":"The intent is to bring the existing operation into conformity with the district's planning framework and eliminate the need for the CRD to continue applying for temporary use permits to to operate this campground as part of the rezoning.","speaker":"P"},{"t":2117,"text":"Staff are also recommended recommending that a covenant be registered on title to maintain the operating conditions that have previously been established through the temporary use permits.","speaker":"P"},{"t":2127,"text":"These include limits on site capacity and infrastructure expansion, waste management requirements and the removal of campground facilities during the off season.","speaker":"P"},{"t":2135,"text":"The proposal is consistent with the official community plan policy supporting parks, recreation and community health and well being. And partnerships with the CRD staff are rec.","speaker":"P"},{"t":2145,"text":"Therefore recommending that this application be referred to the Advisory Planning Commission for review and comment and to the SE First Nation for a 90 day comment period.","speaker":"P"},{"t":2155,"text":"A representative from the CRD is also available should council wish to have that presentation. Thank you.","speaker":"P"},{"t":2164,"text":"Okay. Thank you very much. I think I saw Councillor King and then I'll come to you. Councelor Graham.","speaker":"D"},{"t":2168,"text":"Thank you. Just one brief question came to mind. If. If the request were approved, what is the public input process that could arise if there. If it becomes permanent and regularized in terms of.","speaker":"E"},{"t":2182,"text":"If the public had any concerns in the future? Just sort of curious. I don't expect that. But if there were concerns, what would the CRD propose? What is the avenue for the public?","speaker":"E"},{"t":2198,"text":"Okay, thank you.","speaker":"D"},{"t":2200,"text":"From the district's perspective and maybe the CRD representative can answer from their perspective in terms of a complaints process, we would typically handle that through our normal bylaw enforcement process.","speaker":"P"},{"t":2211,"text":"If there were parking matters or noise complaints, that type of thing. If the covenant's also registered, that does help us manage the site. In terms of if it's extending longer into the period that's then permitted.","speaker":"P"},{"t":2223,"text":"So that's how the district would manage that. Or typical questions that make up to council. That's staff could then respond to.","speaker":"P"},{"t":2230,"text":"Thank you. And another question was will council wait for the full 90 day SE response before the first and second readings.","speaker":"E"},{"t":2241,"text":"That that would be. Thank you through Madam Chair. That would be staff's recommendation. And we'll get that information back to bring that to council prior to bringing the bylaws back.","speaker":"P"},{"t":2250,"text":"And are there change changes, if any, for that residents would experience or se out once the campground becomes permanent, like for them? I. I don't know of any, but","speaker":"E"},{"t":2266,"text":"thank you through the chair that there's nothing proposed. No changes to the existing operations. If council recalls, this has come back multiple times for a temporary use permit.","speaker":"P"},{"t":2274,"text":"And the last time I was here, there was actually direction for council to come forward the CRD to come back and rezone it so that that's what this is responding to.","speaker":"P"},{"t":2283,"text":"Thank you.","speaker":"E"},{"t":2285,"text":"Okay, thank you. Councillor King, Councillor Graham.","speaker":"D"},{"t":2289,"text":"Yes. I'm glad to see this getting formalized. I would move the Option 1 as outlined by staff to proceed with the rezoning.","speaker":"H"},{"t":2299,"text":"Okay, so just to clarify, you're moving staff recommendations one and two. So the referral to the Advisory Planning Commission and then also the referral to staff that's correct?","speaker":"D"},{"t":2309,"text":"Yes.","speaker":"H"},{"t":2309,"text":"Okay. Is there a seconder?","speaker":"D"},{"t":2312,"text":"Okay.","speaker":"B"},{"t":2312,"text":"Is there anyone that would like to speak to this? I'm checking the hands online. Do not see any. Okay, I'll call the question. Is there anyone opposed? No one's opposed. Okay, thank you. All right, item 13.","speaker":"D"},{"t":2330,"text":"2, which is 6996 CSR and 7 CSR. Central Sanich Road. I like this acronym. I've never seen that. Okay. And 7012 East Sanich Road. The proposed OCP and zoning bylaw amendment and development permit.","speaker":"D"},{"t":2347,"text":"I will look for an introduction by Mr. Vanderkamp planner. And we will also have a presentation by the applicant, Councillor Thompson.","speaker":"D"},{"t":2357,"text":"I just thought it might be interesting. The recommendation that we have is not to council to take action other than to refer it to the Advisory Planning Commission if that's what council decides to do.","speaker":"F"},{"t":2372,"text":"So we are not making a decision on the development tonight.","speaker":"F"},{"t":2377,"text":"Correct. This is the first time this has come before council. Thank you.","speaker":"D"},{"t":2386,"text":"Thank you, Madam Chair. The district has received applications for OCP amendments, rezoning and development permit with variances for the properties at 6996 Central Saanich Road and 7012 East Saanich Road.","speaker":"R"},{"t":2396,"text":"As part of the development, the two subject lots will be consolidated into one lot. The proposal consists of a four story, six to one unit rental apartment building placed in a north south direction along Central Sandwich Road.","speaker":"R"},{"t":2409,"text":"The building would be three or four stories as seen from the Surrounding area and take advantage of the natural slope and grade.","speaker":"R"},{"t":2417,"text":"Parking would be located to the rear of the building and vehicular access would be from the south end of the site. Landscaping would include a courtyard, a treat area, garden plots and play areas.","speaker":"R"},{"t":2429,"text":"While an OCP amendment is required to permit multifamily use over the eight units permitted currently, the proposal generally aligns with the main corridor development notation in the ocp.","speaker":"R"},{"t":2438,"text":"The rezoning would see the property fall under the residential apartment zone and while the density regulations of that zone would be met, vanses are required for the front and side yard setbacks as well as for parking.","speaker":"R"},{"t":2451,"text":"The project meets certain OCP guidelines, but certain aspects are not in line with the guidelines and these are described in the staff report.","speaker":"R"},{"t":2459,"text":"The proponent held a community engagement session prior to the application being made and due to an OCP member being included in the proposal. Proposal a public hearing is required as part of the overall process.","speaker":"R"},{"t":2471,"text":"Staff have some concerns with certain aspects of the proposal and therefore recommend that the Advisory Planning Commission weigh in on certain aspects such as the requested variances to proposed unit breakdown, the lack of on site visitor parking and the lack of amenity contributions and affordable housing units.","speaker":"R"},{"t":2488,"text":"Staff are recommending that the proposal be referred to the APC so that when amendment bylaws are presented to council for consideration after the election, the new council can consider the project based on staff report as well as input from the apc.","speaker":"R"},{"t":2502,"text":"Any proponent is here tonight and has a presentation prepared. Thank you.","speaker":"R"},{"t":2507,"text":"Okay. Thank you very much. I'll invite the proponent up to make their presentation. Okay. Oh, are we putting it up? No. Are they online?","speaker":"D"},{"t":2521,"text":"I believe it's online and clarify.","speaker":"C"},{"t":2523,"text":"Okay,","speaker":"M"},{"t":2529,"text":"Sorry, go ahead.","speaker":"D"},{"t":2530,"text":"Oh, thank you very much. Just to clarify. Just a short statement, not a presentation.","speaker":"C"},{"t":2535,"text":"Okay.","speaker":"D"},{"t":2535,"text":"Tonight we just wanted to thank you very much for welcoming us here tonight. We just wanted to note that we have been working with staff on this project for a approximately three years.","speaker":"C"},{"t":2550,"text":"We've been working to meet the requirements of staff as well as the objectives outlined in the ocp. Specifically to ensure that as a.","speaker":"C"},{"t":2560,"text":"As a project within the urban containment boundary, the fact that we're also on a major main corridor development and located at a small commercial node. We've noted that this area is.","speaker":"C"},{"t":2573,"text":"As staff have already noted, this area is available for four story development provided that that development demonstrates sensitivity to the surrounding neighborhood. We've. We feel we've taken measures to demonstrate that sensitivity.","speaker":"C"},{"t":2587,"text":"The current zoning for the product, the proposed zoning for the project, the residential zoning allows an FAR of 1. 75 the project as we've, we are proposing it comes in at 0.","speaker":"C"},{"t":2602,"text":"9, so significantly lower density then what is allowable. Our lot coverage is currently at 20% versus the allowable of 65%.","speaker":"C"},{"t":2610,"text":"As staff have noted, we have also ensured to include landscape amenity and retain as much green space as possible.","speaker":"C"},{"t":2619,"text":"We've also provided a an srw a statutory right of way along the north end of the site, allowing for a future pathway to connect to the trail network that is being established in central Saanich.","speaker":"C"},{"t":2634,"text":"We also have broken the massing of this project into smaller volumes to more be in line with the surrounding neighborhood.","speaker":"C"},{"t":2643,"text":"And as noted by staff, we are working with the topography to step the building down and to set it back into the hillside as much as possible to minimize impacts to existing view corridors for the neighboring project properties.","speaker":"C"},{"t":2660,"text":"The lower, lower section of this property, the, the top floor is actually in line with the, the top or the main floor level of adjacent properties.","speaker":"C"},{"t":2672,"text":"Whereas the, the upper volume, the, the third floor of that volume is in line with the first floor of neighboring properties as well. As noted by staff, a public presentation was given in October of 2024.","speaker":"C"},{"t":2688,"text":"During that presentation, while there was some comments about the project itself, it seemed that the majority of community concerns were related to traffic safety and the safety of intersections that are near the project but however are not within the project boundaries and unfortunately as such are outside the scope of our design.","speaker":"C"},{"t":2711,"text":"We would however, absolutely support increased traffic safety measures. We, we would support that at any time, but unfortunately we are. That's outside the scope of our project to address.","speaker":"C"},{"t":2723,"text":"As noted within the OCP policy, intervention would be required in order to meet the population growth requirements. Noted. This would be need to be required or addressed through a policy intervention OCP amendment, which is obviously why we're here.","speaker":"C"},{"t":2740,"text":"And we look forward to working with staff and council to provide much needed housing within Central Sanich and the lower Vancouver Island. Thank you.","speaker":"C"},{"t":2753,"text":"Okay, thank you very much. I'll look to council first for questions for the applicant or for staff. Oh, Councillor Newton. Oh, you have like a yellow blind or curtain that your hand blends into perfectly. Okay, please go ahead.","speaker":"D"},{"t":2775,"text":"Thank you Chair. I'm doing my absolute best Simpson impersonation out here. I guess my question through you to staff with respect to this application and then I'll have a second question follow up just on the process.","speaker":"A"},{"t":2791,"text":"But I think they spoke to the need for a public hearing given that this is beyond the residential corridor designation and this steps into multifamily. Is that correct?","speaker":"A"},{"t":2806,"text":"Through the chair, the OCP amendment portion is what triggers the requirement for public hearing for this project.","speaker":"R"},{"t":2815,"text":"Right.","speaker":"I"},{"t":2816,"text":"But that public hearing requirement is because it's changing the designation from within the residential corridor, which would allow. I think it's up to eight units and up to a three story building on these lots.","speaker":"A"},{"t":2828,"text":"This is going beyond that. Is that correct?","speaker":"A"},{"t":2833,"text":"Correct.","speaker":"H"},{"t":2834,"text":"Okay.","speaker":"A"},{"t":2835,"text":"It's in line with the main corridor designation notation. But the OCP designation for the property itself would be going from neighborhood residential to multi unit residential.","speaker":"R"},{"t":2848,"text":"Understood, thank you.","speaker":"A"},{"t":2849,"text":"And I guess the second question I have about this is just around the process and typically we see a first reading or some sort of, you know, trigger that this is something that is at least being considered under the current iteration and then it goes as well then to the apc.","speaker":"A"},{"t":2867,"text":"So I'm just curious about the process on this because it does seem to be a little bit different.","speaker":"A"},{"t":2877,"text":"Thank you, Madam Chair. I think as you'll see in the staff report, there's. There's a few items that that staff did highlight that I think we wanted APC to weigh in on.","speaker":"P"},{"t":2887,"text":"I wouldn't want to say major concerns, but some stuff that I think there, there could be some improvements to the project where it doesn't quite align with, with some of the policies of the district and bylaw requirements.","speaker":"P"},{"t":2900,"text":"So that is why you would see it referred to the APC for just some additional review and then it would come back to council with those comments.","speaker":"P"},{"t":2911,"text":"Right.","speaker":"E"},{"t":2913,"text":"Yeah. At this time, I mean, the lack of amenity contributions, the affordable housing component, the three bedroom unit. I think this may even be premature given the concerns that staff highlighted to even get to the apc.","speaker":"A"},{"t":2927,"text":"I think there's obviously input from them would be helpful, but I. Yeah, I don't.","speaker":"A"},{"t":2932,"text":"I think there's a significant gap between what we would like to see from an application and what the APC should weigh in on at this point.","speaker":"A"},{"t":2945,"text":"Okay. Do you have any further questions, Councillor Newton? No. Okay, thank you. I think I saw a hand on this side. Was it Councillor King? And then you.","speaker":"D"},{"t":2957,"text":"Thank you very much. I guess I would begin by asking staff if they could clarify the issue of the applicant's March 2027 building code deadline concerns and wanting to or desire to use the 2018 building code.","speaker":"E"},{"t":2977,"text":"Can you explain what that concern is? For my own benefit and maybe members of the public or if I understand that. Correct.","speaker":"E"},{"t":2992,"text":"Thank you. Through Madam Chair. Yes. Thank you, Councillor King. So the building code is changing in March 2027.","speaker":"P"},{"t":2998,"text":"And what our understanding, understanding is that building construction costs related to seismic changes to the code Would would increase by approximately 25%. That's what our.","speaker":"P"},{"t":3007,"text":"The information we have is if applicants that have been working on a project for as the. The applicant said three years we've been working with the. The applicant on this.","speaker":"P"},{"t":3018,"text":"If they have are able to submit a building permit by that deadline, they would fall under the. The older building code, not the new building code. So that's substantial cost implications. Absolutely.","speaker":"P"},{"t":3029,"text":"So that's, that's the interest of the proponent.","speaker":"P"},{"t":3032,"text":"Thank you. Thank you. That's their interest and I would. I understand it. I don't think the applicant's desire to use the 2018 building code rather than the current code or 2027 should determine municipalities review timeline, timetable.","speaker":"E"},{"t":3051,"text":"But I just wanted to state that the. I understand that the applicant's parking study estimates a demand of above the 61 spaces proposed and I'm just curious if staff have a discomfort with that.","speaker":"E"},{"t":3067,"text":"I know staff have mentioned there's some things that there is a discomfort with. Because that seems to be fewer than the consultants adjusted to demand.","speaker":"E"},{"t":3083,"text":"Yeah. Through the chair, the traffic study indicated a certain parking demand and provided recommendations in order to reduce the demand, including oversized parking e charging for bicycles. So as those have been included in the.","speaker":"R"},{"t":3100,"text":"In the proposal, the parking demand was reduced. But the six spaces that are provided in the right of way as visitor parking, those pose some concerns for staff as that is not our typical","speaker":"R"},{"t":3120,"text":"way","speaker":"H"},{"t":3121,"text":"of dealing with the visitor parking. With those six spaces included, the overall parking demand for that site would be met. It's just that they're provided in a different location than that unusual.","speaker":"R"},{"t":3133,"text":"In addition, it appears that the 34 trees would be removed but only 23 replacement trees put in place. Is there a logic to that or would staff have concerns with that?","speaker":"E"},{"t":3151,"text":"The tree bylaw sort of outlines a replacement ratio. With the replacement trees that are being proposed, the target ratio would be exceeded.","speaker":"R"},{"t":3165,"text":"So it would be exceeded though there's a reduction in the overall number of trees.","speaker":"E"},{"t":3171,"text":"Correct. There's also sort of credits given for retention of trees.","speaker":"R"},{"t":3175,"text":"So with the retention of the I think three trees on site as well as certain types of trees being proposed to be planted, they would exceed the target ratio.","speaker":"R"},{"t":3187,"text":"Okay. I guess I do understand that there's been some discussion about this potentially just going to the Advisory Planning Commission. But I concur with Councillor Newton that it is so seemingly inconsistent.","speaker":"E"},{"t":3202,"text":"There's too many concerns that I have to even and propose that it go to the Advisory Planning Commission. So I don't support this moving forward tonight, including referral to the AAPC","speaker":"E"},{"t":3218,"text":"I","speaker":"J"},{"t":3218,"text":"see this as a significant OCP amendment and rezoning, increasing the potential development From, I understand, 16 units to 61 with major parking and setback variances. No three bedroom units, no affordable units and no amenity contribution.","speaker":"E"},{"t":3234,"text":"And we are only weeks from an election as has been stated. I think there's only, what, something like two more meetings.","speaker":"E"},{"t":3244,"text":"I think that the incoming council should decide whether this proposal should proceed at all and not this current council. I think it would be irresponsible of this council to, to certainly move forward on it.","speaker":"E"},{"t":3260,"text":"I think I, I do understand the idea that it could, could go to the Advisory Planning Commission and get further information from them, but I, I'm not comfortable with that at this stage.","speaker":"E"},{"t":3275,"text":"I would prefer to see this presented to a future council, if at all. Thank you.","speaker":"E"},{"t":3282,"text":"Okay, thank you, Councilor Graham.","speaker":"D"},{"t":3286,"text":"Of similar mind. Except I think there is value referring this to the apc, the Advisory Planning Commission, basically so that it can get reviewed and then forwarded out to the next incoming council.","speaker":"H"},{"t":3300,"text":"Because there'll be some, there'll be a number of changes on this council regardless, possibly quite significant changes and I think it's going to be a, this is a very challenging application.","speaker":"H"},{"t":3312,"text":"I think it would be good to have had this application reviewed by our Advisory Planning Commission prior to council proceeding any further or denying it. So I'll move that this be forwarded to the. Sorry, is there further questions?","speaker":"H"},{"t":3328,"text":"I'll hold if there's further questions.","speaker":"H"},{"t":3334,"text":"Okay, go ahead.","speaker":"D"},{"t":3335,"text":"Councillor Thompson, I concur that certainly it's complex and it should be dealt with by the incoming council. I don't see a challenge of it going to the APC because that information would go to the incoming council.","speaker":"F"},{"t":3352,"text":"My question and my concern goes back to the main corridor designation. And I think this is something, and I felt at the time is not something that a lot of Republicans residents understand.","speaker":"F"},{"t":3368,"text":"And I did want to mention to or request information from staff. On our official community plan map, the main corridor is shown. Sorry, I know you can't see.","speaker":"F"},{"t":3382,"text":"It is shown as an orange line on the street and it may not reflect well in terms of what properties are involved or what the intent.","speaker":"F"},{"t":3394,"text":"So that you can have someone come forward with a three or four story building on these streets. So this is between along Central Saanich, East Saanich, Wallace, Wallace out here, et cetera, et cetera.","speaker":"F"},{"t":3410,"text":"I am concerned that people don't truly understand the impact or potential impact so that you can end up with a development like this, far from a village center.","speaker":"F"},{"t":3424,"text":"But could we get an Explanation from staff in terms of how would we interpret that orange line on those streets in relationship to the properties that line those streets in terms of what's consistent with the official community plan.","speaker":"F"},{"t":3445,"text":"Thank you. Through the chair. So that designation. Sorry, it's not a designation. It's really a notation and policy direction in the official community plan that identifies the main corridor development area and what that is.","speaker":"P"},{"t":3458,"text":"Council can contemplate a change in the official community plan use designation to, from general residential or neighborhood residential, which most of those are, to a multifamily residential where it's deemed to be generally consistent with the character of the neighborhood.","speaker":"P"},{"t":3472,"text":"Often these are on transit corridors and generally closer to village centers. So they're really extending that corridor out of the village center and providing that opportunity for that higher density development in a more walkable, transit oriented area.","speaker":"P"},{"t":3486,"text":"And how council and staff the district may look at that as if a property is fronting onto it. It could include the property behind per se if they amalgamate those properties.","speaker":"P"},{"t":3498,"text":"So it's really, it's really those properties that are touching it that would initiate that conversation and that consideration by, by council in the district.","speaker":"P"},{"t":3507,"text":"Yeah, I think that is the issue. And I know I, I felt this at the time. It's not necessarily the properties on the street per se that maybe impact as much as properties that are behind one back.","speaker":"F"},{"t":3522,"text":"So their backyard, they end up with a three or four story apartment building. And I'm sort of sensing that from what we're hearing in the letters and people that have spoken.","speaker":"F"},{"t":3534,"text":"So this is different, for example, from an area that's designated in the OCP","speaker":"F"},{"t":3540,"text":"for","speaker":"A"},{"t":3543,"text":"say multiple family, that, that would not require a rezoning if those lots were indicated as multifamily. But because these lots are not, lots are designated as neighborhood residential, the application is sort of consistent with that concept.","speaker":"F"},{"t":3565,"text":"But council is not compelled to accept that rezoning.","speaker":"F"},{"t":3573,"text":"Thank you, chair. One statement there. Just want to clarify, you mentioned zoning. This is all about the ocp. So if the property is designated in the official community plan as multifamily, an OCP amendment would not be required.","speaker":"P"},{"t":3589,"text":"Council could rezone it to that, but an OCP amendment wouldn't be required. Does that help clarify that point?","speaker":"P"},{"t":3597,"text":"It's just a different.","speaker":"F"},{"t":3598,"text":"Even though there is an orange line down there, it does not compel in the same way that council may feel compelled to do a rezoning or an amendment to the OCP to allow multiple family as opposed to an area that's","speaker":"F"},{"t":3614,"text":"designated multiple family, very, very different if it had the multiple family designation. That'd be clear, clear planning argument that the zoning would align with that OCP designation.","speaker":"P"},{"t":3628,"text":"Thank you.","speaker":"F"},{"t":3631,"text":"Okay.","speaker":"I"},{"t":3633,"text":"Mayor Windsor, your hand was up briefly. Do you have a. No. Okay. All right, I will, I think I heard a desire to make a motion. Okay, go ahead.","speaker":"D"},{"t":3645,"text":"I would, I would move referring this to the Advisory Planning Commission with the understanding that it won't come back until after the election to the incoming council.","speaker":"H"},{"t":3657,"text":"Okay, Moved and seconded. Is there anyone that wishes to speak further? Councelor Peel and then Councilor King?","speaker":"D"},{"t":3668,"text":"Yeah, I just think that there's been a lot of back and forth on this and if I'm reading the feedback from the applicant, it looks to me as though there's not a lot of additional steps or pieces that the application is going to concede on the pathway to approval here, even if the APC did come back and ask for the same things or clarify the same things that staff's after.","speaker":"S"},{"t":3699,"text":"So I don't, I guess kind of concurrent with Councilor Newton's question or comments, I don't know if there's much point in punting this to the apc and I think that it sounds to me like council's wavering a little bit as to whether or not this is even the right direction to take this, both this property and this general designation.","speaker":"S"},{"t":3725,"text":"So I'm a bit challenged as to whether or not to support this at this time because I, I really, I, I don't know if we're, we're setting the, the, the community's expectations clearly or the applicant up for clear feedback either.","speaker":"S"},{"t":3746,"text":"Okay, thank you.","speaker":"D"},{"t":3747,"text":"Councilor King, when would the APC meeting be? If I get a reminder on that,","speaker":"E"},{"t":3754,"text":"I'll look to staff.","speaker":"D"},{"t":3757,"text":"The APC is currently scheduled to meet on September 18th.","speaker":"R"},{"t":3760,"text":"September 18th.","speaker":"E"},{"t":3762,"text":"Thank you. September 18th.","speaker":"D"},{"t":3764,"text":"Okay.","speaker":"G"},{"t":3765,"text":"That's a Friday. It might be September 16th. Making eye contact with staff. Yes.","speaker":"B"},{"t":3769,"text":"If, if this does pass, it might be a well attended APC meeting, I would guess by the public.","speaker":"E"},{"t":3776,"text":"In the event that this might pass, I would move that the Advisory Planning Commission also be asked to comment on whether the changes to the unit mix should be considered to provide family size housing, including three bedroom units, and what effect that might have on overall number of units and parking demand.","speaker":"E"},{"t":3796,"text":"That's a motion.","speaker":"E"},{"t":3800,"text":"Okay, so it's an amendment.","speaker":"D"},{"t":3801,"text":"Yeah.","speaker":"E"},{"t":3802,"text":"Okay. And sorry, the key points, if you wouldn't mind just stating them again because","speaker":"D"},{"t":3807,"text":"they moved very quickly, that the Advisory Planning Commission APC also be asked to comment on whether changes to the unit mix should be considered to provide Family size housing, including three bedroom units and what effect that might have on the overall number of units and parking demand.","speaker":"E"},{"t":3826,"text":"That's, that's that proposed amendment. I have others.","speaker":"E"},{"t":3830,"text":"Okay. Councilor Graham second it. So there is now amendment on the floor. I did note Mayor Windsor's hand. Do you wish to, to speak to the amendment or.","speaker":"D"},{"t":3841,"text":"Once the main motion is on the floor, shall I return to you?","speaker":"D"},{"t":3846,"text":"My comments and questions are to the main motion. Thank you, chair.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":3849,"text":"Okay. All right. I'll look to Councilor Graham first. Is there anything you want to speak to on the amendment first?","speaker":"D"},{"t":3854,"text":"Well, I'm happy to go by amendment. Frequently we just list issues that council wants to have discussed by the or looked into by the APC and that those go along with it.","speaker":"H"},{"t":3866,"text":"But I just might just suggest that too as a way to expedite it.","speaker":"H"},{"t":3872,"text":"Okay, Councillor Thompson, thank you.","speaker":"D"},{"t":3875,"text":"I would just a reminder in terms of the recommendation number D notes the lack of three bedroom units and the resulting misalignment with the housing needs assessment. So does that address the same thing?","speaker":"F"},{"t":3889,"text":"And I do note that the chair of the APC is in attendance at this meeting.","speaker":"F"},{"t":3897,"text":"So I don't think it. Oh, if. I mean, sorry.","speaker":"E"},{"t":3900,"text":"Fair enough, go ahead.","speaker":"D"},{"t":3902,"text":"No, I just think it doesn't address it in that the Advisory Planning Commission has not been asked to comment on whether the changes to the unit mix should be considered to provide that and what the potential impacts could be regarding parking or other aspects.","speaker":"E"},{"t":3918,"text":"So it opens the door for them to have that discussion. If we're going to go to the apc, I think.","speaker":"E"},{"t":3925,"text":"Okay, thank you. Is there any other speakers on the amendment? Okay, I'll call the question. Is there anyone in opposition? Okay. Oh, Councillor Peltiel in opposition. The motion is carried.","speaker":"D"},{"t":3939,"text":"I had another that the Advisory Planning Commission also be asked to comment on whether the building provides an appropriate transition in scale to adjacent two story residential neighborhood, including whether the additional upper story setbacks should should be considered.","speaker":"E"},{"t":3955,"text":"Okay. Do you have more or is this","speaker":"D"},{"t":3957,"text":"the last one I have as well. Advisory Planning Commission also be asked to comment on whether the proposed density of 61 units is appropriate for this site and surrounding neighborhood context.","speaker":"E"},{"t":3974,"text":"Okay. Okay. There's a seconder. Is there any speakers to the amendment and does our corporate officer have that? Yes. Okay, good. Okay, I'll look to call the question then. Is there any in opposition question? Oh, got a question.","speaker":"D"},{"t":3992,"text":"Okay, so we are looking at the overall recommendation.","speaker":"F"},{"t":3997,"text":"No, sorry, we're still on a second amendment and there were two further things for consideration and I'm trying to Bring them to the front of my mind. Density and two stories. Thank you. Okay.","speaker":"D"},{"t":4014,"text":"Any other questions or comments from Council? This is on the amendment, so it's. No, we voted on the first Amendment, now we're on to a second amendment.","speaker":"D"},{"t":4027,"text":"And this is just to add to the list of items for consideration if this is referred to the apc.","speaker":"D"},{"t":4037,"text":"Okay.","speaker":"I"},{"t":4039,"text":"All right. I am going to call the question now. Is there anyone in opposition?","speaker":"D"},{"t":4043,"text":"To what?","speaker":"F"},{"t":4044,"text":"To the amendment.","speaker":"D"},{"t":4045,"text":"Thank you.","speaker":"F"},{"t":4048,"text":"Okay. I'm not noting anyone in opposition. So now we're back to the main motion as amended with additional items for consideration by the ap. I will return to Mayor Windsor.","speaker":"D"},{"t":4061,"text":"Thank you. Chair.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":4063,"text":"My question to start off to staff, appreciating what staff said earlier, that at this juncture, first reading is not something that is ready to move forward, but there might be some benefit if it were moving forward to getting feedback from the Advisory Planning Commission.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":4090,"text":"If Council decides not to seek guidance, will staff still, I assume, prepare further reports and, or first reading potentially for a new council? That's the first question, Chair.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":4107,"text":"Okay, thank you. I'll look to our director of planning.","speaker":"D"},{"t":4112,"text":"Thank you, Mr. Madam Chair. If Council so direct staff would prepare the bylaws for first reading, I think we would also have a report attached to that.","speaker":"P"},{"t":4120,"text":"I would comment on some of the issues that we identified in the report that that may not have APC input. So we would ourselves as staff just highlight and focus in on those for council's consideration.","speaker":"P"},{"t":4133,"text":"Thank you.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":4134,"text":"So the assumption would be if the referral does go forward to the apc, that they would bring you staff would bring that back to the new council and look for direction from the new council as to whether or not to prepare a.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":4155,"text":"A bylaw for first reading. Correct?","speaker":"Q"},{"t":4158,"text":"That. That is correct. And, and I guess waiting on that is some of the input from the APC and may change the bylaw.","speaker":"P"},{"t":4166,"text":"For example, if the building has a lower fsr, for example, it may change what the bylaw would have in it.","speaker":"P"},{"t":4173,"text":"Okay, so again, without presupposing the outcome of this vote on this motion, if Council rejects a referral to the apc, can Council take, can this council take any further steps with respect to the application, such as moving a motion to say that in its current form, Council does not feel the application is ready for first reading and needs further work or, or just outright reject it?","speaker":"Q"},{"t":4204,"text":"What are the options for this Council at this, at this stage this evening?","speaker":"Q"},{"t":4210,"text":"Thank you. Through. Through the chair. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. They would be. Council could decline the application. That is certainly an option for Council.","speaker":"P"},{"t":4218,"text":"Council could give staff in the applicant direction for specific things that they would like to see amended or just generally work on some of the comments that were discussed tonight and come back to council which would likely be a future council.","speaker":"P"},{"t":4234,"text":"Thank you, that's very helpful. I will hold the rest of my thoughts, I suppose until we have the decision on the referral to the APC this evening. Thank you, Chair.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":4247,"text":"Okay, so I'll look to council again to see if there are any further speakers on the main motion, which is a referral to the Advisory Planning Commission with a number of items for consideration. Okay.","speaker":"D"},{"t":4264,"text":"Councillor Thompson was just a comment. My sense is that going to the apology is not unuseful in terms of gathering more information this council would not be dealing with would provide more fulsome information to the incoming council.","speaker":"F"},{"t":4284,"text":"I have a challenge simply rejecting something this early in the process when we technically don't have all the information.","speaker":"F"},{"t":4294,"text":"And I don't like making these decisions initially at a council meeting as opposed to a committee meeting where we have the opportunity for second sober thought at a council meeting.","speaker":"F"},{"t":4310,"text":"So part of me is while I do see concerns with this application, I think that going forward to the APC is sort of a neutral thing to do at this time and leave it up to the incoming council in terms of taking action.","speaker":"F"},{"t":4335,"text":"Okay, thank you, Councillor Thompson. Are there any other speakers? Oh, oh, your little hand and the yellow curtain. Go ahead, Councillor Newton.","speaker":"D"},{"t":4352,"text":"I'm trying to deal with lousy Internet. Anyway, I appreciate Councillor Thompson's comments and around reflection and my colleagues comments around garnering insight from the apc. I think they're obviously very valuable.","speaker":"A"},{"t":4366,"text":"I just struggle with this because I don't think even if we were at first reading of this development, this isn't something in its current form that we would want to send to comment.","speaker":"A"},{"t":4382,"text":"I just think it's missing the mark significantly from what our expectations are when we're working with. Partner a developer coming forward on this.","speaker":"A"},{"t":4393,"text":"And again I'm just looking at where staff had highlighted seven comments plus the few amendments that. I appreciate it. I just.","speaker":"A"},{"t":4403,"text":"I think more work on this needs to be done before we get the insight and wisdom from the ATC on this.","speaker":"A"},{"t":4417,"text":"Okay, thank you Councillor Newton. There any other speakers? No.","speaker":"D"},{"t":4425,"text":"Okay, Am I Sorry, am I able to just jump in for a quick comment or is that.","speaker":"C"},{"t":4429,"text":"No, no, I'm sorry. We've got a motion on the floor, so just limited to Council. Okay, so with no other members of council speaking, I will just weigh in.","speaker":"D"},{"t":4442,"text":"Typically I would be supportive of moving an application forward to the apc. I really value the insight that they provide in this case.","speaker":"D"},{"t":4452,"text":"I do feel like a lot of good advice has already been offered by staff and quite a lot of community input and feedback has already been provided.","speaker":"D"},{"t":4464,"text":"And so in the interest of efficiency for the applicant, I do think that time would be better spent working on changes if they do intend to move forward.","speaker":"D"},{"t":4477,"text":"I think going forward to the apc at this point, when, you know, I've heard concerns across the board, there isn't really look like there's a good path in its current form.","speaker":"D"},{"t":4490,"text":"So I am not going to be supporting this motion. And with that I will call the question. So all those in opposition to referring this to the apc.","speaker":"D"},{"t":4503,"text":"Okay, I've got Councilor Paltiel, Councilor King, Mayor Windsor, Councillor Newton and myself in opposition.","speaker":"D"},{"t":4510,"text":"Madam Chair.","speaker":"E"},{"t":4512,"text":"Yes, Councillor King.","speaker":"D"},{"t":4513,"text":"Could I make a motion to decline the application?","speaker":"E"},{"t":4519,"text":"Second.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":4521,"text":"Who was that?","speaker":"F"},{"t":4521,"text":"Who was that?","speaker":"D"},{"t":4523,"text":"Mayor Windsor.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":4524,"text":"Okay, Mayor Windsor. Okay, I forgot to say the last motion failed. So I'm going to do that now just for clarity. And we have a new motion on the floor to decline this application. It has been seconded.","speaker":"D"},{"t":4537,"text":"Councillor King, would you like to speak to that as the mover?","speaker":"D"},{"t":4542,"text":"No, I think that much has been said both by council, but significantly by the community as well, that this is not an application that meets the needs of the community as the residents have stated for various reasons.","speaker":"E"},{"t":4557,"text":"We don't need to to reiterate those at this stage. Council was already considering the next council.","speaker":"E"},{"t":4563,"text":"So I think that it's obvious then if this motion moves forward, that the applicant would have to go back and do some further work, bring that to the next council or decide what they wish to do.","speaker":"E"},{"t":4577,"text":"But anyway, the motion is to decline the applications before us. Thank you.","speaker":"E"},{"t":4584,"text":"Okay, thank you, Councillor Thompson.","speaker":"D"},{"t":4587,"text":"Thank you.","speaker":"F"},{"t":4587,"text":"And unless Mayor Windsor, did you want to speak to it as a second or first?","speaker":"D"},{"t":4591,"text":"Yes.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":4591,"text":"Okay, I'll let Mayor Windsor go ahead and then we'll come to you, Councilor Thompson.","speaker":"D"},{"t":4597,"text":"Thank you, Chair. Same viewpoint, but different perspective. Perhaps in some ways it's unfortunate and maybe a bit telling.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":4605,"text":"Applications that take a bit longer and come to this point where we are perhaps, you know, taking in input from the proponent who has spent time, effort and made investment into creating housing that they believe in.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":4622,"text":"I'm very sorry to anyone out there who believes that, you know, proponents who are investing time are doing anything other than the level best. I will say though that the three years is a bit telling.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":4638,"text":"This site has significant challenges and the variances speak to those challenges.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":4643,"text":"I think in Some ways and quite frankly, when you see something that perhaps is just not going to work because it requires variances, because it has ongoing challenges, which, you know, some of the neighbors, frankly that I spoke to long before this evening ever came about, I was, you know, chatting with, with people in this, in this neighborhood and some of the speakers got up tonight and reiterated that I think it is prudent for a council to say, look proponent, we appreciate the investment the development has garnered to date, but quite frankly sending it to the APC in the vain hope that some alignment is going to materialize, I think perhaps is a bit disingenuous and probably unhelpful and probably would lead to the applicant investing more money and more time.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":4701,"text":"There are opportunities to create housing across the Capital Region and in central Saanich. I, I genuinely believe that. Sorry again to anyone who has a different viewpoint, that's part of democracy.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":4715,"text":"But I, I think that the applicant should receive a clear picture from council that this one isn't a viable option.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":4724,"text":"This council has an enormous amount of time and knowledge held over the years of service and when I hear as many counselors as I do uncertain about the viability and you know, appropriateness of this project, that's something worth listening to, as is the community.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":4744,"text":"I think quite frankly it's better just to say, look, this one is a, is a non starter. We're going to reject it. That isn't to say we don't appreciate it, but maybe spend time and money and investment elsewhere.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":4761,"text":"And that is, you know, an acceptable and an appropriate thing for a council to consider, as is frankly the cost impacts of building codes going into the future on the cost of housing.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":4776,"text":"I mean, in case anyone had noticed, we have not solved the housing issue across Canada or in the Capital Region yet.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":4786,"text":"But asking developers to spend time and money on investing in projects that probably have a strong chance of not moving forward anyway. We have an opportunity to simply say not this one, not here and move forward.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":4802,"text":"Then they can invest their time and money elsewhere. Thank you.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":4808,"text":"Okay, thank you, Mayor Windsor. Councillor Thompson.","speaker":"D"},{"t":4812,"text":"I don't disagree with the inappropriateness of the development at this location. My concern is what direction do we give to, to developers and to staff dealing with these issues on the main corridor?","speaker":"F"},{"t":4829,"text":"Because this is a difficult issue because we've said that our council has agreed that, well, apartments are not unacceptable in these residential areas. So does staff. I'm asking this as a theoretical question.","speaker":"F"},{"t":4846,"text":"Does staff have the appropriate direction or do we need to look at the OCP to clarify some of these Issues.","speaker":"F"},{"t":4857,"text":"So someone and the staff, not just the proponent, but the staff, aren't spending three years looking into a project","speaker":"F"},{"t":4869,"text":"that","speaker":"C"},{"t":4869,"text":"they think might be consistent with the OCP that hasn't a fit. Because it would be far better to deal with this in the first year than it is to let it go on for three years.","speaker":"F"},{"t":4886,"text":"But I think that's a question for an incoming council is how do you deal with this main corridor development?","speaker":"F"},{"t":4899,"text":"Okay, thank you, Councillor Thompson. So we do have a motion still on the floor to deny this application. Are there any other speakers? Okay, I don't see any other hands. I can't see Gord and his yellow curtain.","speaker":"D"},{"t":4918,"text":"So I will go ahead and call the question. Are there any opposed? No one is opposed to. So the motion passes. Councillor Paltiel?","speaker":"D"},{"t":4931,"text":"Yeah, I'd like to move that. Council ask the applicant to. Come back with an application that is single family or attached housing with a three story maximum.","speaker":"S"},{"t":4953,"text":"Okay. I see Mayor Windsor seconding online. Okay. Is there anything further you'd like to speak to?","speaker":"D"},{"t":4959,"text":"Yeah, no. Contrary to statements earlier this evening about us not doing any business in the lead up to the election, I think it is still important to provide some clarity and direction to the applicant.","speaker":"S"},{"t":4972,"text":"The purpose of this, you know, and the three year process and going through planning is not for I, ideally nothing. We have the benefit of receiving a significant amount of feedback and input from the neighbors in the area.","speaker":"S"},{"t":4987,"text":"I think that we are in a challenging time right now because the OCP and what was defined as substantial community benefit as a justification for height, which is largely, I think what this corridor designation is hinging upon, really doesn't benefit from the fact that we're in a very challenging market right now.","speaker":"S"},{"t":5006,"text":"And a lot of things on the cost of delivery and marketability of these buildings has changed since when this policy was first written.","speaker":"S"},{"t":5015,"text":"So I think that the staff's expectations and the laundry list of items that we were handing over for the APC to comment on, I just don't feel that they were attainable.","speaker":"S"},{"t":5026,"text":"I think that the applicant could have provided all three bedroom units and a million dollars in benefit and I think that the neighbors would have still felt very upset and opposed to the application and I think that likely it was going to get turned down anyway.","speaker":"S"},{"t":5043,"text":"So ultimately, I think that giving a clear direction that we would like to see modest family housing of some configuration on this site is, is clear enough direction that both staff and the applicant can go back and refine something to something that is more satisfactory and","speaker":"S"},{"t":5063,"text":"for","speaker":"J"},{"t":5064,"text":"the, for the neighborhood and future council","speaker":"S"},{"t":5068,"text":"okay, thank you, Councillor Paltiel. Mayor Windsor, do you wish to. No, not as a seconder. Okay, Councillor Newton, I see you and then I'll go to Councilor King and Councilor Graham after that.","speaker":"D"},{"t":5081,"text":"Thank you, Chair. I guess a question to the mover was just so that it's consistent with the residential corridor designation within the ocp. Is that correct? Is that what the intent is? Or to go something beyond.","speaker":"A"},{"t":5099,"text":"I think that the designation would support. Well, the designation supports single family through to multifamily.","speaker":"S"},{"t":5105,"text":"I'm taking out the multi family and just saying single family, two, three story attached housing only just to put parameters around it so that the feedback coming from this table is more clear.","speaker":"S"},{"t":5119,"text":"And we're working within part nine of the building code, so we're not doing anything that's extravagant on height.","speaker":"S"},{"t":5127,"text":"Right. So that would include. Then I guess the question's for you to staff Chair would be that that would include townhomes and as part of this.","speaker":"A"},{"t":5138,"text":"Thank you through the chair that. That's what I would interpret.","speaker":"P"},{"t":5140,"text":"Yeah.","speaker":"H"},{"t":5141,"text":"Just. Just not apartment buildings. The RN zone does allow some of that attached dwellings as it stands or maybe some adjustments or subdivision that could occur that could end up with potentially more attached units.","speaker":"P"},{"t":5155,"text":"But that would be coming back to council for any consideration.","speaker":"P"},{"t":5160,"text":"Thank you then. Appreciate that.","speaker":"A"},{"t":5164,"text":"Okay, thank you. I had Councillor King next and then Councillor Graham.","speaker":"D"},{"t":5169,"text":"Thank you, Madam Chair. I appreciate the motion and the, the desire to send a message. I wonder if we could table the motion. If I could move to table just to hear from the proponent to see further.","speaker":"E"},{"t":5187,"text":"I'll look for a seconder.","speaker":"D"},{"t":5192,"text":"Okay.","speaker":"E"},{"t":5193,"text":"I don't see a second.","speaker":"D"},{"t":5194,"text":"I was hoping that we might be able to test whether or not that is helpful. This is the current council inviting something for a future council.","speaker":"E"},{"t":5206,"text":"But I think that without the invitation it would be up to someone to bring forward an application anyway.","speaker":"E"},{"t":5214,"text":"So I was wondering if that is at all helpful to the person that's before us right now, given that it's from the current council and they have no idea necessarily what the next council will be thinking.","speaker":"E"},{"t":5231,"text":"But yeah, it's a little bit awkward as to what we're inviting because it's the current council inviting something that could be done anyway by a proponent in the future.","speaker":"E"},{"t":5244,"text":"And I also think it's not entirely helpful for staff because it's from this council suggesting what might be considered. But this council is free to make motions to invite and yeah, state the obvious, I suppose.","speaker":"E"},{"t":5261,"text":"Okay, thank you very much, Councillor Graham.","speaker":"D"},{"t":5265,"text":"Keep my comments brief. This isn't something council normally does, and I understand it's. I think that there's limited benefit to directing.","speaker":"H"},{"t":5273,"text":"I mean, the applicant will have heard the conversation tonight and will choose to do whatever the applicant chooses to do.","speaker":"H"},{"t":5284,"text":"Okay, Councillor Thompson, thank you.","speaker":"D"},{"t":5287,"text":"I'm going to reiterate my concern as to what sort of direction, where do we go with the main corridor?","speaker":"F"},{"t":5296,"text":"Given a whole range of options, I don't disagree with the public that in a neighborhood like this that the motion is more supportive of what people would expect.","speaker":"F"},{"t":5310,"text":"The challenge for me is that any applicant comes in now, reads the ocp, and then how do the staff respond and what's the process in terms of what's an appropriate development in what is effectively a residential area?","speaker":"F"},{"t":5334,"text":"Okay, thank you. I think I'll just ask one more question. Seeing no other hands, it's just. Is this direction that's being proposed that we're considering right now consistent with the OCP as it is?","speaker":"D"},{"t":5349,"text":"So if the applicant move forward with a proposal as suggested here, would an OCP amendment be required?","speaker":"D"},{"t":5361,"text":"As the current OCP designation is neighborhood residential, it allows for up to 8 units per lot. So with the 2 lots, anything over 16 units would still require an OCP amendment.","speaker":"R"},{"t":5373,"text":"Okay, so if the applicant came forward with single family home or attached townhomes that were 8 or less per lot, it would be consistent with the OCP and it would not require an OCP amendment or a rezoning.","speaker":"D"},{"t":5389,"text":"So the direction would be as laid out in this motion, to bring forward a proposal that is consistent with the OCP as it stands today.","speaker":"D"},{"t":5402,"text":"Correct.","speaker":"R"},{"t":5404,"text":"Okay, thank you very much, Councillor Thompson. Get back in there.","speaker":"D"},{"t":5407,"text":"One more question. So to clarify then, if the applicant came forward with such an application, assuming that it met other aspects of the, the zoning bylaw, no public hearing would be required.","speaker":"F"},{"t":5425,"text":"Thank you. If it came forward with a total of. So each lot under the current zoning is allowed up to four units. The OCP allows up to eight units.","speaker":"P"},{"t":5433,"text":"So if they had, say 16 units of rezoning may be required.","speaker":"P"},{"t":5436,"text":"So if they had anything more than the, the 4 units per lot, looking at the 1, 1 lot, it may be able to be subdivided under the current state zoning. That, that's why I mentioned subdivision previously.","speaker":"P"},{"t":5447,"text":"So they could potentially end up with, I'm just going to say three lots total, which can end up with 12. Under that scenario, there would not be a rezoning.","speaker":"P"},{"t":5455,"text":"It would just be a development permit and council would be considering the design guidelines.","speaker":"P"},{"t":5461,"text":"Okay, and then. Thank you. One more follow up on that. So a rezoning could be required. If it was eight units, but a public hearing would not be held because it would be consistent with.","speaker":"D"},{"t":5470,"text":"With the designation in the ocp. Is that correct?","speaker":"D"},{"t":5473,"text":"That is correct.","speaker":"P"},{"t":5474,"text":"Okay. Okay, thank you very much. All right. Councillor King.","speaker":"D"},{"t":5478,"text":"Sorry.","speaker":"K"},{"t":5478,"text":"Yeah. I just want to be clear that I understand as well that what we're.","speaker":"E"},{"t":5484,"text":"What the motion is doing is inviting the applicant to submit or consider an application that is consistent with the official community plan, which one would think that the applicant. Applicant may already know.","speaker":"E"},{"t":5497,"text":"And so I'm not sure what the motion is doing. I take it that it's somewhat unusual, I think, to make a motion like this.","speaker":"E"},{"t":5506,"text":"And I understand that having a long discussion on this may not matter as well, since it's already should be obvious that the applicant can look to our official community plan and bring something forward if they wish.","speaker":"E"},{"t":5527,"text":"Councillor Graham, do you have a question? Oh, no. You want me to call the question? I was just about to. I was just making sure Gord didn't have his hand up there. Okay.","speaker":"D"},{"t":5540,"text":"I don't see any other speakers, so I will call the question on the motion. Is there anyone opposed? Okay. I do not see any hands in opposition. So the motion passes. Okay. All right.","speaker":"D"},{"t":5555,"text":"Well, I think we had quite a good discussion on that one. I'm going to move us Forward to now 13. 3. We have a procurement award for a street Sweeper Equipment Model 2026 Elgin Crosswind 1.","speaker":"D"},{"t":5570,"text":"Nobody is excited about this one move.","speaker":"D"},{"t":5572,"text":"The recommendation second.","speaker":"E"},{"t":5574,"text":"Okay, I've heard. Okay, Councillor. Okay, so I've heard. The recommendation has been moved and seconded. It's on the floor. Councillor Newton, I do see your hand.","speaker":"D"},{"t":5582,"text":"I'm going to allow the mover to speak first and then I will come to you.","speaker":"D"},{"t":5587,"text":"Okay, Certainly. Yeah. No, I understand that the sweeper in the past has had some issues, and so I'd love to hear a little bit more about the one that we're getting. Is this a good one? Is this.","speaker":"E"},{"t":5601,"text":"Can we thank you through Madam Chair? So the. The sweeper that we are looking at procuring is based upon best value to the district. So we did weigh dollars and we have tried out and gone out for quality.","speaker":"T"},{"t":5615,"text":"We also did talk to references with respect to the sweeper and actually went out and took a look at. At a model that is in use.","speaker":"T"},{"t":5625,"text":"So we did do a lot of due diligence in trying to procure a sweeper.","speaker":"T"},{"t":5633,"text":"Okay, Councillor Newton, go ahead.","speaker":"D"},{"t":5638,"text":"Thank you, Chair. My question through you to staff, is this just authorizing the previous sort of discussion around this, or is this, in fact, a Third Street Sweeper that we're looking at trying to acquire.","speaker":"A"},{"t":5651,"text":"Thank you. Through Madam Chair, this is just to procure to replace our existing street sweeper.","speaker":"T"},{"t":5659,"text":"Thank you.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":5659,"text":"We only have one. It's just to replace it.","speaker":"T"},{"t":5665,"text":"Okay. Are there any other questions or comments from council on this motion? Okay, I'm going to call the question. Are there any opposed? No one's opposed. The motion carries. Okay. 13. 4.","speaker":"D"},{"t":5683,"text":"We have some background on the Butterfield roof replacement costs. A report from the director of engineering was provided and he is available for questions. Not seeing any hands. I will move us along. Oh, go ahead.","speaker":"D"},{"t":5703,"text":"No, this is on the metal roof versus the.","speaker":"E"},{"t":5706,"text":"Correct.","speaker":"D"},{"t":5707,"text":"Yeah, No, I think it makes a lot of sense to go with the metal roof. I did have a question, though, as to whether it could affect heritage approval or. Heritage.","speaker":"E"},{"t":5719,"text":"Thank you. Through Madam Chair, this. The heritage designation is district heritage designation. So it's not the same as, like, a provincial.","speaker":"T"},{"t":5728,"text":"Okay.","speaker":"E"},{"t":5729,"text":"So it is up to council to make that. That differentiation. So.","speaker":"T"},{"t":5735,"text":"Okay, so district heritage, is that. Is that. Thank you for educating me on that. Is that our own inventory or. Yeah.","speaker":"E"},{"t":5746,"text":"Yes, that's correct.","speaker":"T"},{"t":5747,"text":"Thank you, then.","speaker":"E"},{"t":5748,"text":"Thank you. Okay. Nothing else on the roof? Nope. Okay, then I'm going to move us into bylaws. We have a. Another heat pump financing program, local area service bylaw amendment.","speaker":"D"},{"t":5768,"text":"So moved.","speaker":"E"},{"t":5770,"text":"Okay.","speaker":"I"},{"t":5770,"text":"Second, are you moving recommendations one in? Oh, we have to do them separately. Do we have to? Nope, we can do them together. Excellent. Okay. Recommendations one and two have been moved. Councilor Graham, you see, seconded them.","speaker":"D"},{"t":5784,"text":"Is there any questions or discussion? No. All right, I'll call the question. Is there anyone opposed? No one is opposed. The motion is carried. Moving us along. Road Closure Bylaw 2268, 2026, which is a portion of Columbia Avenue.","speaker":"D"},{"t":5798,"text":"A report was provided by the director of engineering and he is available for question.","speaker":"D"},{"t":5806,"text":"I'll move the staff recommendation.","speaker":"H"},{"t":5808,"text":"Okay. Councilor Graham has moved the staff recommendation recommendation. Do we have one and two? Is that. Yep. Okay, I'll look for a seconder. Okay. Seconded by Councillor Thompson. Do either of you wish to speak to the motion? No.","speaker":"D"},{"t":5826,"text":"Okay. Councillor King?","speaker":"D"},{"t":5827,"text":"Yeah, Just. I think there's an anonymous resident who wrote. Is that right? There's a letter that came in. Am I correct that it's an anonymous.","speaker":"E"},{"t":5837,"text":"Yeah. Okay.","speaker":"G"},{"t":5841,"text":"I wanted to know some of the answers to the questions that that person raised. Can staff tell us whether the pond was permitted and why the right of way has been gated and locked?","speaker":"E"},{"t":5858,"text":"Thank you. Through Madam Chair, the pond wasn't","speaker":"T"},{"t":5865,"text":"approved","speaker":"E"},{"t":5865,"text":"in its Current form. So it didn't require approval in its initial when it was being constructed. This is going quite a ways back. So this road right of way process has been going on for the last 16 years.","speaker":"T"},{"t":5886,"text":"The pond was built after started initial discussions on the road closure and it wasn't envisioned to go over the road right away. The property owner did note and we're looking at ways of possibly remedying.","speaker":"T"},{"t":5905,"text":"However we were in discussions with closing the road and and carrying out the disposal of the road right away as well at the time.","speaker":"T"},{"t":5917,"text":"So there was no enforcement for going and constructing the pond on top of the road right away with respect to the closure. I'd have to look back into why it was closed because it's been closed","speaker":"T"},{"t":5937,"text":"for","speaker":"E"},{"t":5939,"text":"since probably 2000 so last 25 years.","speaker":"T"},{"t":5944,"text":"So central Saanich gated it and locked.","speaker":"E"},{"t":5947,"text":"It's quite possible it's been closed and there has been no bylaw file with respect to the closing and the gating. If it was not Central Saanich there was no enforcement on. On any complaints foreclosure.","speaker":"T"},{"t":5960,"text":"I'll have to look back and I can provide some feedback on that.","speaker":"T"},{"t":5965,"text":"Okay.","speaker":"G"},{"t":5966,"text":"So the pond wasn't permitted but it's got some historical thing. And the right of way was gated and locked but we're not sure who and why.","speaker":"E"},{"t":5978,"text":"That's correct.","speaker":"T"},{"t":5980,"text":"And do we have any policy or criteria that we use to decide whether rights of way remain available for the public or sold.","speaker":"E"},{"t":5993,"text":"We typically follow the provincial requirements for closing road right of ways. Provincial requirements usually surround either if there's environmental or ecological preservation requirements or if there's public safety with respect to an undeveloped road right away.","speaker":"T"},{"t":6014,"text":"An example would be. I'm just trying to think of one.","speaker":"T"},{"t":6020,"text":"Currently","speaker":"E"},{"t":6022,"text":"there might be an argument for public safety on Meadowbank. There's currently is a road right away that crosses the Ossanic Land Trust property in Mabre Flats. It's Meadowbank Road right away and it has.","speaker":"T"},{"t":6038,"text":"Has CRD water main traveling through it when that land is flooded. That would definitely be a public safety issue and that would be a reason for closure.","speaker":"T"},{"t":6053,"text":"Thank you. So we do we have a. I guess we don't particularly have a specific policy. Is that right?","speaker":"E"},{"t":6060,"text":"That is correct.","speaker":"T"},{"t":6061,"text":"Right. I think, I think the report mentions. And this might just be because the report was written for this meeting. It mentions second and third readings is occurring at a future meeting after notice.","speaker":"E"},{"t":6079,"text":"But was that for this meeting?","speaker":"E"},{"t":6082,"text":"That's correct. So at the time that the report was written notice was in place.","speaker":"T"},{"t":6087,"text":"Thank you.","speaker":"M"},{"t":6087,"text":"Yeah.","speaker":"B"},{"t":6087,"text":"Just wanted to make sure. Thank you.","speaker":"E"},{"t":6090,"text":"Okay.","speaker":"I"},{"t":6090,"text":"That's it.","speaker":"E"},{"t":6092,"text":"Okay. Are there any further questions or speakers? No. Okay, I'll go ahead and call the question then. Is there anyone opposed? None are opposed. The motion carries. Okay. Unfinished business.","speaker":"D"},{"t":6107,"text":"We have a notice of motion submitted by Counselor and Newton for consideration tonight. Ms. Gorman, Director of Corporate Services, is available for questions. Councillor Newton, you are online. Do we have to read it all?","speaker":"D"},{"t":6124,"text":"Does Councillor Newton have to read it all? No, we're. We're good here. Okay.","speaker":"D"},{"t":6131,"text":"That's a chair decision.","speaker":"B"},{"t":6132,"text":"I'm not going to make you do it.","speaker":"D"},{"t":6137,"text":"Could we.","speaker":"E"},{"t":6138,"text":"But the full okay.","speaker":"D"},{"t":6142,"text":"Not the. Yeah. Not the whereas, but okay.","speaker":"E"},{"t":6145,"text":"Okay.","speaker":"D"},{"t":6146,"text":"For the benefit of the public as well, because they don't necessarily have it before them.","speaker":"E"},{"t":6150,"text":"Fair.","speaker":"M"},{"t":6150,"text":"I was going to allow a summary, but thanks to Councillor King. Councillor Newton, you're on the hook for reading all of your further be it resolved.","speaker":"D"},{"t":6157,"text":"I just finished my water bottle, so bear with me here.","speaker":"A"},{"t":6159,"text":"Perfect.","speaker":"N"},{"t":6162,"text":"Therefore, be it resolved, the Council directs staff to report back on the feasibility of creating a publicly accessible online council transparency dashboard for the District of Central saanich for the 2026-2030 council term. And therefore be it further resolved.","speaker":"A"},{"t":6180,"text":"That report include recommended dashboard features including recorded votes, council meeting attendance, committee participation, declarations of conflict of interest and links to agendas, minutes, reports and meeting recordings.","speaker":"A"},{"t":6193,"text":"Two examples of comparable transparency dashboards or or reporting tools used by other British Columbia municipalities.","speaker":"A"},{"t":6200,"text":"Three, the estimated one time implementation cost, ongoing annual operating and maintenance costs, staffing and technology requirements, and any budget implications associated with creating and maintaining the dashboard. 4.","speaker":"A"},{"t":6213,"text":"And finally, any legislative, privacy or administrative consideration that Council should consider prior to the implementation.","speaker":"A"},{"t":6221,"text":"Few second.","speaker":"E"},{"t":6224,"text":"Okay, so it's been moved and seconded. I'll allow Councillor Newton the floor if he wishes to speak to it first. And then Councillor King and then Mayor Windsor and then Councillor Graham. I'm gonna have to write this down.","speaker":"D"},{"t":6236,"text":"Okay, please go.","speaker":"D"},{"t":6238,"text":"Yeah, I was just sort of doing some final review on sort of practices and what comments from the public about improving our transparency and engagement with the public.","speaker":"A"},{"t":6249,"text":"And Saanich and Victoria have something similar on their website and so it seemed that there was an opportunity maybe for the District of Central Saanich to look at, you know, mimicking something that has already been done and improving transparency for the public on the matters related to Council.","speaker":"A"},{"t":6269,"text":"Hopefully this isn't a significant investment in time and effort and resources. I spoke to staff about this, I will confess, used a little bit of AI to craft this.","speaker":"A"},{"t":6281,"text":"But I want to commend the staff, the work that our current staff have done around this for other jurisdictions and hopefully it again will just improve transparency and accountability.","speaker":"A"},{"t":6296,"text":"Okay, thank you, Councillor King, go ahead.","speaker":"D"},{"t":6300,"text":"I'm very enthusiastic supporting this and I'm grateful to Councillor Newton for putting this forward. I sort of look at this as in terms of the history of council.","speaker":"E"},{"t":6312,"text":"Before we had web cameras here recording meetings, before council members or could chime in from a distance and before the public could even watch recordings of council meetings, you had to come to a council meeting and you had to look at just it in person or look at the minutes, find the minutes.","speaker":"E"},{"t":6336,"text":"It wasn't easy, wasn't easy to track how votes were done. And then even with the changes that have occurred, you don't pick up every aspect.","speaker":"E"},{"t":6348,"text":"So I think that what's proposed here by Councillor Newton is sort of a next step, a further progression towards transparency, further transparency and democracy in central Saanich.","speaker":"E"},{"t":6360,"text":"And so I'm grateful to Councillor Newton for spearheading this and I note that it's to receive information at this stage, but I think that's an appropriate step. So thank you for that.","speaker":"E"},{"t":6376,"text":"Thank you, Mayor Windsor, go ahead.","speaker":"D"},{"t":6381,"text":"Thank you, Chair. Taking somewhat of the contrarian viewpoint here, this is not the first time we've come up with this idea. There are 161 municipalities in British Columbia and no more than a total of six do this.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":6400,"text":"Victoria and Saanich are much larger municipalities than our own. And yet I would contend that the cost of implementing the system is probably marginally the same in terms of staff, time and technology.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":6417,"text":"This is not really a scalable scenario. Ironically, it might be a useful thing for AI to do in the future.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":6428,"text":"Indeed, if AI could be trusted, which it might be, a skeptics view that one should always re examine what's produced by AI and if you're doing it manually, such as city of Victoria and Spanish, city of Vancouver, city of Nanaimo are doing, there's going to be a significant cost to that.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":6455,"text":"And in a smaller municipality such as ours, and as someone who intends to retire from the mayor's seat shortly, but we'll be a taxpayer on an ongoing fashion, my preference would be for us to make investments in things that are perhaps more meaningful to the 18,000 people who live in central Saanich, although I appreciate people who are interested in council business, I'm also not convinced that a voting tracker by itself tells you enough.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":6494,"text":"If you are genuinely interested in a decision that is before any council, there's going to be more work, there's going to be talking with members of council, understanding context, watching Video. The transparency tracker is, frankly, it's, it's.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":6513,"text":"I'm just gonna be blunt. I think it's a gimmick. The minutes reflect the votes of council. You know, if you want to know about a decision of council, you review the minutes. And that's just the way of it.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":6534,"text":"It's worked for a century. It's working for 155 municipalities in the province of British Columbia currently. I think we should better invest our money elsewhere. Thank you.","speaker":"Q"},{"t":6550,"text":"Okay, thank you, Mayor Windsor.","speaker":"D"},{"t":6553,"text":"Councillor Graham, I almost feel like we should have council trading cards too, if we're going to be doing this.","speaker":"H"},{"t":6560,"text":"I'm not speaking against the motion because it sounds like the work's already been done in Victoria and Sanich and I agree it probably isn't scalable.","speaker":"H"},{"t":6569,"text":"So we could simply ask them what their process was and how much it costs.","speaker":"H"},{"t":6575,"text":"I'd hope that staff wouldn't be reinventing the wheel and trying to do this report from scratch, as opposed from just taking what the experience of these other municipalities have done it.","speaker":"H"},{"t":6586,"text":"And hopefully that would be a quick process and wouldn't be very expensive. So from that perspective, if council wants to find out, I guess I'm okay with that.","speaker":"H"},{"t":6599,"text":"Okay, thank you very much, Councillor Thompson.","speaker":"D"},{"t":6601,"text":"Thank you. My sense of this is this should be considered by the incoming council if it chooses to want to do this. It can then get the information and act if it feels appropriate.","speaker":"F"},{"t":6616,"text":"I've always felt, and I go back to the old days when you couldn't even get the agenda. You wanted to know what was going on in council.","speaker":"F"},{"t":6629,"text":"You had to come down to the municipal hall on Friday afternoon and look at the posted agenda.","speaker":"F"},{"t":6636,"text":"And, I mean, I know I'm old fashioned on this, but I think it encourages better participation, more effective participation, in that you have to invest some time and focus on doing it.","speaker":"F"},{"t":6651,"text":"We do have recorded votes, and my sense on that is sometimes it's too easy.","speaker":"F"},{"t":6657,"text":"It's not a scorecard in the sense of some people may be strongly in favor of something, some of them may be strongly opposed to, but often you're sort of going, how do I do on this?","speaker":"F"},{"t":6673,"text":"What is the complexity in those decisions? And for someone to simply read someone's opposition or support based on a number or a checkpoint on a chart, it concerns me, but council meeting attendance in the minutes.","speaker":"F"},{"t":6689,"text":"What the hell does committee. Oh, sorry, my language. What does committee participation mean? I have no idea what that means. So through you to Councillor Newton. Why would. What. Committee participation would be the recording. Oh, he's frozen.","speaker":"F"},{"t":6707,"text":"No, he's still there. Go ahead, Councillor Newton.","speaker":"D"},{"t":6711,"text":"Sure. Thank you. I think it's probably just similar about in line with attendance for the committees that they're assigned to.","speaker":"A"},{"t":6723,"text":"So just to clarify, does that include only council committees or are you imagining external appointments would also be.","speaker":"D"},{"t":6729,"text":"No, I would. The intent was just solely council committee appointments.","speaker":"A"},{"t":6734,"text":"Okay. Okay. Councillor King. Or unless. Oh, sorry.","speaker":"D"},{"t":6738,"text":"Yeah.","speaker":"A"},{"t":6739,"text":"I do have links to agendas, minutes, reports and meeting recordings. I do it frequently, so I don't know. I agree in part with Mayor Ryan. In terms of Mayor Windsor. Sorry.","speaker":"F"},{"t":6755,"text":"In that, is the cost really worth it or is it oversimplification of what we do? I don't know. I agree with Ken. Councillor Graham.","speaker":"F"},{"t":6768,"text":"I'm not opposed to it getting the information, but I think clearly it is up to the incoming council to consider this in the whole.","speaker":"F"},{"t":6780,"text":"And therefore, I will make a motion to refer this forward to the incoming council for consideration.","speaker":"F"},{"t":6789,"text":"Second.","speaker":"I"},{"t":6791,"text":"Okay, I'm just processing this because. Is it an amendment that we could. The referral. Oh, you're gonna. Okay. You're gonna move a referral. Okay, it's been seconded. All right.","speaker":"D"},{"t":6803,"text":"Is there anything you want to add on your referral motion?","speaker":"D"},{"t":6808,"text":"Nope.","speaker":"T"},{"t":6809,"text":"No. Okay. Are there any other speakers? Okay, first, I'm going to go to Councillor Newton and then I'll go to you, Councillor King.","speaker":"D"},{"t":6819,"text":"Thank you, Chair. This. This information would come back as a referral. All this is doing is starting that step to get information and have that council make a final decision on this.","speaker":"A"},{"t":6830,"text":"I didn't envision this council making a decision on this. It would come forward to that council to have it, but then they would have that information already at hand.","speaker":"A"},{"t":6842,"text":"Okay, thank you, Councilor King.","speaker":"D"},{"t":6844,"text":"Yeah, I appreciate the deferral motion. I think some of the good discussion and analysis kind of got a little bit further into the weeds about whether it's a good idea or a bad idea, et cetera.","speaker":"E"},{"t":6860,"text":"But I think it may be missed that this is asking for further information. And the decision as to whether it's a good idea or a bad idea could be informed by the analysis from staff.","speaker":"E"},{"t":6876,"text":"And so I think it's presupposes by this council, and I think that it's better to. I prefer to ask staff to do the work and have the future counsel than have material before them in this case.","speaker":"E"},{"t":6893,"text":"But instead, what we're proposing here by deferring is to defer consideration of the motion that Councillor Newton has brought forward to allow a future council to have the same discussion and see whether or not it wants to have staff do the Research and present something.","speaker":"E"},{"t":6914,"text":"So I would prefer to, you know, honoring Councillor Newton's initiative here, to support the initiative by asking staff to do the work and then allow the future council to make a determination. Thank you.","speaker":"E"},{"t":6930,"text":"Okay, thank you. I don't see any other hand. So I just have a question on this and it's to staff. I'm wondering about the effort involved in drafting this report and gathering this information and making recommendations.","speaker":"D"},{"t":6948,"text":"Thank you. Through the chair. As the person who would be writing the report, I could say that given the current. Current focus on the election, it would not come forward until the new council if directed by.","speaker":"B"},{"t":6960,"text":"By this council tonight. We are fortunate and the mover did. Councillor Newton didn't imply that. Both Ms. Martin and myself have previous experience in these transparency trackers and some of the other local governments that are currently having them.","speaker":"B"},{"t":6973,"text":"So we can build on that expertise as well as call on colleagues. So the report itself, not. Not that much work. I don't know how to measure it. Obviously a lot more in implementation.","speaker":"B"},{"t":6987,"text":"Okay, so the motion that we have on the floor is whether to refer this motion to a future Council, to the next council. Not a future council, the next one. And I don't see any other hands.","speaker":"D"},{"t":7005,"text":"So I am going to call the question. Are there any opposite opposed? Okay. Counselor King is opposed and Counselor Newton is opposed. So the. Oh, and councelor. And. And Mayor Windsor is also opposed.","speaker":"D"},{"t":7022,"text":"Okay, so the referral motion does pass. All right, So we do have a couple of notices of motion submitted. One submitted by Councilor Paltiel, one submitted by myself and Councelor Newton.","speaker":"D"},{"t":7038,"text":"Those will be considered at the next meeting and I will. Oh, we do have the September 2026 meeting calendar for information. Any questions or comments on that? I do not see anyone. Okay, so we are into court correspondence.","speaker":"D"},{"t":7057,"text":"We do have a lengthy list. I see Councilor Graham's hands. Is there anything you'd like to raise?","speaker":"D"},{"t":7066,"text":"17. 10. I was hoping if staff could give an update. And, and I noticed that there's a number of people from the organization here probably to speak to that item.","speaker":"H"},{"t":7076,"text":"So perhaps that's something that council may want to consider after the update.","speaker":"H"},{"t":7083,"text":"Okay. 17. 10 is regarding the parking and roadway changes.","speaker":"D"},{"t":7089,"text":"Thank you Madam Chair. Currently staff are still working on the conceptual designs along that roadway. So we did provide three options and met with community groups along there including the school district, the Brentwood Community hall, extreme softball.","speaker":"T"},{"t":7105,"text":"So we've met through with them. We've also talked with BC Transit just to get input on options.","speaker":"T"},{"t":7113,"text":"We have provided options where we didn't measure out the total number of stalls if everyone was parking because there are no marked stalls from Brentwood Community hall all the way to Sluggett along Wallace and it's approximately 33 total stalls.","speaker":"T"},{"t":7130,"text":"We've tried to keep that total number. However depending on the configuration we get anywhere between 28 to 31. So. So we're working through those, those options now. We don't have anything to bring forward to council yet.","speaker":"T"},{"t":7145,"text":"We do still have a little bit of engagement that we do want to carry out prior to bringing some options forward. In addition to that we do have to do some costing as this does come from the 10.","speaker":"T"},{"t":7162,"text":"4 million active transportation funding that we've the council had approved in July 2023.","speaker":"T"},{"t":7168,"text":"So with this in conjunction with the Mount Newton Multi Use Path Phase 2, we're trying to make sure that we stay within budget and move ahead that way.","speaker":"T"},{"t":7180,"text":"So no decisions have been made and we don't have a final design to present and we aren't finished with the engagement yet.","speaker":"T"},{"t":7190,"text":"Just a further follow on question. I know the Bridge Community hall was concerned that already their parking was they felt was being significantly curtailed. Has that issue been addressed?","speaker":"H"},{"t":7207,"text":"It's very tough with the grading in that area to address.","speaker":"T"},{"t":7211,"text":"Like so if we were to have a sidewalk walk along there with the, with a bike lane, the grading in there makes it extremely hard to have like even just parallel parking to the roadway.","speaker":"T"},{"t":7223,"text":"There is a drop from the existing roadway down to the grade of the building.","speaker":"T"},{"t":7228,"text":"In addition to that, the hydro pole in the middle of the frontage makes it very tough to try to get something where we're trying to get any cool equivalent number of spots in front.","speaker":"T"},{"t":7240,"text":"So we have been trying to work through some options along there to address that as well as address the safety issues along that corridor.","speaker":"T"},{"t":7265,"text":"Sorry, Councillor Graham, can you use your mic?","speaker":"D"},{"t":7268,"text":"Thank you. Sorry, going old school, no mic.","speaker":"H"},{"t":7270,"text":"I think there'd be some value since a number of the members from the Brentwood Community hall are here tonight to have give them an opportunity to perhaps express their own perspective if that's or raise any issues they would like to since they're here, if that would be agreeable to council.","speaker":"H"},{"t":7290,"text":"Is that a motion?","speaker":"D"},{"t":7291,"text":"I'll move that, that we offer them a two minute, I second speaking opportunity each.","speaker":"H"},{"t":7297,"text":"Okay. I don't see any hands so we'll call the question on that. Is there anyone in opposition? No one's in opposition.","speaker":"D"},{"t":7304,"text":"So if there is anyone who wishes to come and speak to this item, you may come up to the pod.","speaker":"D"},{"t":7322,"text":"Hi, I'm Richard Mountz and I represent the Brentwood Community Hall. Our major concern is the hall has been in place for I don't know how many years, you guys can say. And it's been working up till now.","speaker":"G"},{"t":7334,"text":"The staff and the municipality kind of just showed up one day and implemented without any consultation or any input. So that we did ask for that.","speaker":"G"},{"t":7342,"text":"And moving forward, we asked for better input and we don't really see why a change is necessary when there's so many other major issues within the municipality to do with transportation. And it's currently working.","speaker":"G"},{"t":7352,"text":"We'd rather look at moving the sidewalk or having some less impact on the current, I guess, parking that we have in front of the building because it's already a very restrictive area for parking with the school and with the ballpark park and everything that's going on in that area.","speaker":"G"},{"t":7368,"text":"So we just would really like the to have more involvement with it and just kind of see what proposals are brought forward, if that makes sense. I don't know.","speaker":"G"},{"t":7377,"text":"Is there anything else you guys would like me to bring up? Yeah, one proposal about moving the crosswalk closer to the ball area is definitely a better option.","speaker":"G"},{"t":7385,"text":"Like I know their biggest issue was where the crosswalk was and concern with the school and that sort of. So we just would like to be included in that if that makes sense.","speaker":"G"},{"t":7396,"text":"And we don't see why we'd want to spend a whole bunch of money on something that's been working for so long when it could be as simple as moving a crosswalk and designated the parking areas. Thank you.","speaker":"G"},{"t":7409,"text":"Okay, thank you, Councillor Thompson. You've been very patient.","speaker":"D"},{"t":7413,"text":"Thank you.","speaker":"H"},{"t":7415,"text":"I guess my question would be, and I've heard the same concerns directly, would be that the district is going to go back to the rentman community group to share some ideas.","speaker":"F"},{"t":7431,"text":"And I'm even thinking that this would be a good opportunity for a committee meeting in the council chambers for the district along with interested groups like the Brentwood Community Hall.","speaker":"F"},{"t":7446,"text":"I organized dances there, the Strawberry Dance, for a number of years and I truly understand the challenges of the parking in that area. And one certainly wants to support community groups here.","speaker":"F"},{"t":7463,"text":"So I think having a discussion in the council chamber so that we're all here for the discussion would be useful.","speaker":"F"},{"t":7476,"text":"Okay. Did you want to make a motion to that effect?","speaker":"D"},{"t":7479,"text":"Sure, I'll make a motion that Brentwood Community hall group be invited to a council, a committee meeting of council along with staff to discuss the options going forward.","speaker":"F"},{"t":7495,"text":"Just a clarification. Would it just Be the Brentwood Community hall group or would school district and extreme and possibly transit.","speaker":"T"},{"t":7504,"text":"Possibly, yeah. I mean, I. Multiple groups I'm not worried about. I certainly want the Brentwood Community hall involved. Others I know there was an issue with Fairway, for example, in terms of restricting parking. That sign is apparently gone.","speaker":"F"},{"t":7523,"text":"Should Fairways be included in such a discussion or invited to participate? I wonder.","speaker":"F"},{"t":7530,"text":"Okay, I'll second it.","speaker":"T"},{"t":7532,"text":"And suggest that we do a broader outreach to the. To the local. To the neighboring properties.","speaker":"H"},{"t":7540,"text":"Okay, so I'll take the motion to be. To invite impacted parties to a meeting, a committee meeting in council chambers with. With staff to discuss options for the parking situation by the Brentwood Community Hall.","speaker":"D"},{"t":7556,"text":"So that's been moved and seconded. Are there any other speakers? I do not see any hands, so I'll call the question on that. Is there anyone opposed? I do not see anyone opposed. So the motion is carried.","speaker":"D"},{"t":7573,"text":"All right. Councillor King, is there another item you'd like to raise?","speaker":"D"},{"t":7579,"text":"Yes, absolutely. I've got a few. So 171 or 17. 1, that's with regards to parking. On Burling, there was a letter. Well, this is a letter. I think it's from Larry Scott, Steven Salter. They've already been dealt with.","speaker":"E"},{"t":7597,"text":"But have the questions. But been answered. And that's what I was going to get to their specific questions. So the question that has been asked.","speaker":"E"},{"t":7611,"text":"Sorry, point of order. I don't think they're technically on the agenda at this point in time because they've been moved into the active correspondence section.","speaker":"H"},{"t":7619,"text":"Okay.","speaker":"D"},{"t":7619,"text":"So I think that we're past those particular pieces of agenda. Sorry, just. Just a technical point of order.","speaker":"H"},{"t":7625,"text":"Yes, a point of order. Acknowledge. I'll look to our corporate officer. I feel. I recall that we did move these up.","speaker":"D"},{"t":7632,"text":"We did have them discussed and they were referred to the broader conversation or the broader item around the bylaw for the industrial area.","speaker":"D"},{"t":7641,"text":"Yes, 17 1, 172 and 175 were technically moved to section 11. Correspondence required or recommended and did have motions made related to them.","speaker":"B"},{"t":7651,"text":"Very good. That makes sense. Thank you, Councilor Graham, for that. Then 178 and 1712 and 1713 and 1721 have not been addressed.","speaker":"E"},{"t":7663,"text":"Correct.","speaker":"G"},{"t":7665,"text":"So 178 refers to Hilltop Road and I think it's Selena Farkas and the Keating rezoning.","speaker":"E"},{"t":7673,"text":"And the question that is addressed is from Selina Farkas, who asks if council will ensure that there is no access from Makati property to Verling Avenue. And I wonder if we can get any clarity on that.","speaker":"E"},{"t":7694,"text":"Can staff tell us clearly whether that access is still contemplated? Anywhere in the rezoning or future development planning.","speaker":"E"},{"t":7706,"text":"Thank you, Councillor King. I do think the other letters did speak to the road access and then that was referred to the next report. But I'll look to staff to confirm that they will be looking at that,","speaker":"D"},{"t":7717,"text":"making sure that 17. 8 questions get answered or asked.","speaker":"E"},{"t":7724,"text":"Thank you. Through the chair. That","speaker":"P"},{"t":7729,"text":"matter?","speaker":"E"},{"t":7729,"text":"I don't know. That was directly in the motion that was previously. Previously put forward by council. Speaking more to the.","speaker":"P"},{"t":7736,"text":"To the west, this would mean the lot that's up on Verling Avenue, the only property that's up on Verley Avenue that could be developed as industrial.","speaker":"P"},{"t":7745,"text":"So limiting access to that lot to Verling would essentially render that property not developable. So right now the plan is to have access from that lot to Verling. Should, should that.","speaker":"P"},{"t":7755,"text":"You know, that's what the proposal currently as it stands.","speaker":"P"},{"t":7758,"text":"Thank you.","speaker":"E"},{"t":7759,"text":"And I just wanted to work through some of the letters to make sure that questions are aired here and then you can tell me if those have already been answered or not or if they're in a motion.","speaker":"E"},{"t":7774,"text":"But 1712 from Jackie Lee asks whether converting the northern RE2 portion to light industrial is consistent with the OCP. Has staff provided Council with a written legal planning analysis answering that OCP consistency question.","speaker":"E"},{"t":7791,"text":"Thank you. Through the chair. Yes, it's consistent with the ocp. The land use designation is industrial. Therefore the zoning would. The rezoning would match that designation by being industrial.","speaker":"P"},{"t":7801,"text":"Thank you. And then there was a question from 1713 from Jim Brown. Jim Brown says this land is a necessary buffer between the industrial activity and residential properties. What is staff planning?","speaker":"E"},{"t":7816,"text":"Planning Staff's planning rationale for eliminating that existing buffer rather than retaining it. I don't know if that is. Something that staff can speak to, but I just wanted to raise the question that was put in the letter.","speaker":"E"},{"t":7835,"text":"I can respond by just council direction. At the.","speaker":"P"},{"t":7838,"text":"At a previous council meeting was for our staff to report back on things that can be done to mitigate that impact and provide additional buffering, such as increased setback, such as.","speaker":"P"},{"t":7847,"text":"So that's something that staff are currently working on and going to be reporting back to council.","speaker":"P"},{"t":7853,"text":"Super, thank you. And then 1721 or 21. Stephen Salter, Laurie Morgan, Eric Johnson.","speaker":"E"},{"t":7859,"text":"They ask whether council has received written reports stating or setting out the full infrastructure costs of the rezoning, including water, fire flow, wastewater, road safety, parking, sidewalks and stormwater. Have we received such a report?","speaker":"E"},{"t":7874,"text":"If not, why would council proceed to readings before we have it? And they ask also whether the district has. Has received a written traffic and road safety report identifying the impact of the additional industrial traffic and mitigation measures.","speaker":"E"},{"t":7892,"text":"And they ask whether there is a documented First Nation consultation and engagement for this rezoning. And I wanted to air the questions that they've asked and allow staff to speak to those if they can this evening.","speaker":"E"},{"t":7909,"text":"Thank you. And I may look to Director of Engineers speak to this as well. So staff have been over, I know council and the public have recently seen this in the last couple of months.","speaker":"P"},{"t":7920,"text":"Staff have been working on this for about a year and a half now with the applicant looking at all of those matters that were raised. Traffic, stormwater management, servicing. We've had studies done on our sewer stormwater capacity.","speaker":"P"},{"t":7933,"text":"The recent direction from council on traffic that was already initiated. But we're summarizing that report to make it more, more public facing, I would say. And I mentioned stormwater.","speaker":"P"},{"t":7942,"text":"So all of those technical elements have been considered and are being considered as a part of this proposal. What we typically see though is those conditions are a part of subdivision.","speaker":"P"},{"t":7953,"text":"So as the development progresses we get into the more detailed components and site design and layout and actual capacity analysis. Zoning sets the framework for that.","speaker":"P"},{"t":7961,"text":"But what we're do to trying to do is secure all of those elements that ensuring that they will be looked at and will be completed and done as this progresses. So yes, all those elements are being looked at.","speaker":"P"},{"t":7974,"text":"In terms of first nations, we have been in communications. Two weeks ago we had a meeting with the Wisanish Land Stress Society and Sartler first nations and we're continuing those conversations. So that is ongoing. And Mr.","speaker":"P"},{"t":7986,"text":"Puskas, anything to add to that? Thank you.","speaker":"P"},{"t":7989,"text":"Just, just to add a little bit more on the technical side of so determining domestic, what we would typically call domestic water demand.","speaker":"T"},{"t":7998,"text":"So that would be the water demand used for day to day use or fire flow requirements really depends on like the actual design of what is actually being put forward and that usually doesn't come forward until subdivision.","speaker":"T"},{"t":8013,"text":"So for the purpose of rezoning, as Mr. Matanowicz had mentioned, we're just trying to get the groundwork set up so that when it comes time for subdivision there is no negotiation on what needs to happen to facilitate.","speaker":"T"},{"t":8028,"text":"I'd just say thank you to staff.","speaker":"E"},{"t":8030,"text":"I know we all get a bit punchy and tired at the end of the meeting, but thank you for taking the questions that I've been able to try to summarize from the letters and to rest of council and to the, our, our chair.","speaker":"E"},{"t":8042,"text":"Even though we want to get out of here, I thought it was good to kind of make sure some of those letters had their questions aired and at the council meeting. So thank you.","speaker":"E"},{"t":8054,"text":"Okay. I don't see any other hands. I do want to raise the very last item of correspondence on the agenda regarding child care. I want to acknowledge that we have received it and then I will make a motion.","speaker":"D"},{"t":8070,"text":"I do see some folks here just to allow them to speak. Okay. All right.","speaker":"D"},{"t":8077,"text":"Okay.","speaker":"N"},{"t":8079,"text":"Well, I don't know if that's going to come up, but. Okay, so I'll just note that Councillor Thompson has declared in conflict and he's. He's leaving the room.","speaker":"D"},{"t":8089,"text":"So I just will make that motion that if, if anyone does wish to speak to that item, that they are welcome and I'll look for a seconder. Okay. See no other hands.","speaker":"D"},{"t":8100,"text":"So call the question, is there anyone opposed? No one's opposed. The motion passes. So I will invite anyone if they do wish to speak.","speaker":"D"},{"t":8109,"text":"No pressure.","speaker":"M"},{"t":8109,"text":"I just did want to offer the opportunity to speak to 17. 27. I'm Claire Meadmore.","speaker":"D"},{"t":8130,"text":"I'm from Just Peachy Childcare. The letter that you are referring to is mine. There have been other letters written to support as well. Sorry, I am really terrible at this. The thing is, my notes aren't opening.","speaker":"L"},{"t":8151,"text":"Sorry, give me a second. Oh my gosh. I'm so sorry.","speaker":"L"},{"t":8158,"text":"Okay, take your time.","speaker":"D"},{"t":8159,"text":"Just. I just want to thank you for bringing this to attention and.","speaker":"L"},{"t":8165,"text":"Oh my God.","speaker":"E"},{"t":8166,"text":"Can I take one moment?","speaker":"L"},{"t":8168,"text":"Take a minute. No problem. I'm going to fill my one water because I've been wanting to do that for like two hours.","speaker":"D"},{"t":8194,"text":"Okay.","speaker":"B"},{"t":8195,"text":"Thank you for giving me the opportunity to provide the full picture.","speaker":"L"},{"t":8199,"text":"There's been some significant differences between what was communicated to me throughout this process, which happened to be three years, and then what was later presented to council by the north and South Saanich Agricultural Society.","speaker":"L"},{"t":8212,"text":"And I think those deserve some clarification. I'm not asking council to force the north and South Saanich Agricultural Society Society into the agreement, but I'm not necessarily asking to go back to the fairgrounds.","speaker":"L"},{"t":8224,"text":"But if council feels there is an opportunity to have that conversation revisited, I would absolutely be open to sitting down again, seeing whether there is a workable path forward.","speaker":"L"},{"t":8234,"text":"More than anything, though, I'm asking council for help with what comes next. Central Saanich has already been.","speaker":"L"},{"t":8241,"text":"Has already identified the need for some child care spaces for more significant child care spaces and the difficulty providers face finding suitable land and buildings to do so. We have now lost spaces instead of gaining them.","speaker":"L"},{"t":8254,"text":"I would really like to work with council to figure out how we change that. Whether that means revisiting the fairgrounds or helping identify another opportunity in our community.","speaker":"L"},{"t":8266,"text":"Thank you very much.","speaker":"D"},{"t":8267,"text":"Thanks.","speaker":"A"},{"t":8272,"text":"Okay. I do not see any hands. We do not have a closed meeting tonight, so I will look for someone to move adjournment.","speaker":"D"},{"t":8282,"text":"So moved.","speaker":"E"},{"t":8284,"text":"Okay. Is there anyone in opposition? No one in opposition. We are adjourned.","speaker":"D"},{"t":8297,"text":"It.","speaker":"H"}],"words":18952,"fetchedAt":"2026-10-03T01:33:12.997Z"}